Thank Your Lucky Stars

[peanuts]

7 hours ago, Dave_Og said:

It's not so much thank your lucky stars as don't assume that Corney is the embodiment of evil

he has become rather a pantomime villain the way he is vilified anything that goes wrong is his fault anything that goes right did so despite him in some peoples eyes .

[peanuts]

could have this guy in charge 

 

[disjointed]

You have got to feel for the supporters of Orient, lets hope they can bounce back with decent owners in charge.

[Dave_Og]

There is a lot here about what the EFL/FA could have done re Orient but no clues as to exactly what that could have been

[JoeP]

29 minutes ago, Dave_Og said:

There is a lot here about what the EFL/FA could have done re Orient but no clues as to exactly what that could have been

 

Probably on about the "fit and proper persons" test...whatever that involves.

[Dave_Og]

2 minutes ago, JoeP said:

 

Probably on about the "fit and proper persons" test...whatever that involves.

 

Fit and proper tests may catch crooks but it can never reveal competence.  Most people who but football clubs are by definition successful businessmen but that clearly doesn't prove whether they can run a club.

[leeslover]

The fit and proper person tests are a sham. It took a few years before it became clear that Mr King was in charge of The Rangers but couldn't be a director of the club board. There can be no oversight of foreign owners and you can always have your cousin own it for you.

[HarryBosch]

On 06/05/2017 at 5:54 PM, Andy b said:

Why should we be grateful that we are not in the position of Leyton orient rather than disappointed that we are not Brighton, Swansea, Preston, Burnley, huddersfield. I don't get this mentality at all. 

 

There will always be very poorly run clubs just as there will always be well run and ambitious clubs. We are not the worst run clearly but our decline and year on year drop in attendances shows that we at the lower end of the spectrum.

 

I am not at all grateful to anyone for merely remaining in business 

 

Great post but you forgot Leicester, Bournemouth, Hull, Watford, Brentford, Reading, Barnsley & Burton... 

[Dave_Og]

22 minutes ago, HarryBosch said:

 

Great post but you forgot Leicester, Bournemouth, Hull, Watford, Brentford, Reading, Barnsley & Burton... 

 

Common factor is that most if not all have wealthy benefactors

Edited May 7, 2017 by Dave_Og

[Andy b]

It also proves that for every Leyton orient there is at least 1 or 2 clubs that have been dealt a better hand. Our owners are mediocre when you look at the average. 

 

Am I grateful we are not LO? Yes

 

Do I think our owners have done a great just cos we are not in LO's position? No

[JoeP]

9 hours ago, Dave_Og said:

 

Common factor is that most if not all have wealthy benefactors

 

And, with exception of Burton and arguably Brentford and Bournemouth, a bigger fanbase to begin with...

Edited May 8, 2017 by JoeP

[ChaddySmoker]

19 hours ago, Andy b said:

We have a platform to build on with our tidy ground and potential fanbase. This season more than any has shown what sort of regular crowds we might be getting with a bit of hope and quality (note the uplift in attendances towards the very end). 

 

we are more Rotherham than bury/Rochdale. You only have to look at than dale following 2 weeks ago. 

We SHOULD be more Rotherham but we arent. Will Dale finish above us next season for the 4th year in a row? Probably.

[mikeroyboy]

52 minutes ago, Andy b said:

It also proves that for every Leyton orient there is at least 1 or 2 clubs that have been dealt a better hand. Our owners are mediocre when you look at the average. 

 

Am I grateful we are not LO? Yes

 

Do I think our owners have done a great just cos we are not in LO's position? No

You seem to have a lopsided view of average and mediocre. Surely remaining in the same league during Corney's reign is bang on average. Qualifiers for mediocre are the clubs relegated, some more than once, some through two trapdoors and Stockport through three, into oblivion.

 

Irrespective of the many mistakes made someone has maintained and funded a stable league standing at no risk to our personal financial health.

 

Football is a business, unique in the expectations of its core customers who support their club stoically through thick and thin. Patronising the business is not obligatory, more a calling and a lifetimes hobby.

 

If Corney was trying to ruin or relegate us he would have done it by now. None of the unappreciative have a better plan or a wealthier benefactor.

 

I don't buy the tub thumping 'we should have ambition' as fans. For me ambition is self motivated, self funded and personally achieved.

 

Hope is what us fans should stick with and after 64yrs following Latics I still look forward to match day in hope rather than expectation.

 

Former Premier League Champions visiting us next season I see.

[Andy b]

Definition of mediocre is average. The clue is in 'med' ! 

 

Our fall in income and attendances since the current owners came in puts us substantially below mediocre doesn't it. 

 

Not everyone can go up and not everyone can go down. Yes, our on the pitch performance is therefore 'average' since we are currently in the same place as when the owners joined.

 

we have performed substantially below average on other fronts as you well know 

[HarryBosch]

31 minutes ago, Andy b said:

we are currently in the same place as when the owners joined.

 

 

 

Are we? Are you sure? 

[Andy b]

League position wise, as noted above, yes.

 

do you have a view to the contrary? 

 

Off field - significantly reduced income and crowds is what I see.

 

thanks 

[mikeroyboy]

1 hour ago, Andy b said:

Definition of mediocre is average. The clue is in 'med' ! 

 

Our fall in income and attendances since the current owners came in puts us substantially below mediocre doesn't it. 

 

Not everyone can go up and not everyone can go down. Yes, our on the pitch performance is therefore 'average' since we are currently in the same place as when the owners joined.

 

we have performed substantially below average on other fronts as you well know 

 

You appear to feel some sort of entitlement to your hobby being funded to a level beyond what the present owners are prepared/able to pay. And to a quality no amount of funding is guaranteed to achieve.

 

There is no queue of candidates nor is there likely to be. I honestly can't see why any football fan can expect an outsider to fund their club on the rollercoaster of promotion and relegation. If nothing else we have beaten the law of averages by staying put for 20 odd years.

 

I notice Portsmouth have just been promoted from League 2. 7yrs ago they were in the Premier League.

 

I would view a change of ownership with interest but no great expectations until progress was delivered.

[deyres42]

4 minutes ago, Andy b said:

League position wise, as noted above, yes.

 

do you have a view to the contrary? 

 

Off field - significantly reduced income and crowds is what I see.

 

thanks 

Reduced income?

[Andy b]

Do you believe we don't have a reduced income compared to 14 years ago? In real terms and with our drop in crowds I think it's highly likely we do. Aren't we told of 'reduced budgets' year on year? 

 

for the record I am not asking anyone to fund my hobby. No where do I suggest that we would be better off with a different owner.

 

Merely pointing out that we have gone backwards under the current owners and I am not willing to heap praise on them just because its not been as bad as it could have been. 

 

At best we have stagnated. 

 

 

[deyres42]

I'd say more money comes into the club than ever before.

 

I'd also say more money goes out of the club than ever before.

[Andy b]

More money in real terms? 

[deyres42]

Yes, is there a reason to suggest otherwise?

[Andy b]

2003/4 average crowd 6,266

 

2016/17 average crowd 4,361

 

2k reduction. In real terms that's well over 900k reduced income over a season based on 20 quid per ticket and without taking cup games into account. Where are we making that shortfall up from then? 

 

I'd guess that based on match day income, facilities in the new stand bring in c200k per year (not all of which is a net increase since we already had a corporate income from the two portakabins).

 

I suggest income has reduced in real terms 

 

[deyres42]

Payments from leagues/TV larger than in 03/04 - someone on here will probably know the details.

[jorvik_latic]

1 hour ago, Andy b said:

Do you believe we don't have a reduced income compared to 14 years ago? In real terms and with our drop in crowds I think it's highly likely we do. Aren't we told of 'reduced budgets' year on year? 

 

for the record I am not asking anyone to fund my hobby. No where do I suggest that we would be better off with a different owner.

 

Merely pointing out that we have gone backwards under the current owners and I am not willing to heap praise on them just because its not been as bad as it could have been. 

 

At best we have stagnated. 

 

 

 

 

According to this, our budget in 2009 was £1.6mil (over £1.9mil in real terms) -

 

Anthony Gee told us that last season's budget had increased from the year before but was less than £2mil. We are receiving higher funds from the Football/Premier League now too.

 

I make that as budgets staying roughly the same but income increasing (the League money increase will outweigh the losses in ticket revenue IMO).

 

 

Edited May 8, 2017 by jorvik_latic