Wellens.

[League one forever]

Right.

 

I want to know how people feel about how he’s done in the 31 games he’s had. An for all those that jump on ‘31 games, wtf is that to judge’ We all made a judgement on Kelly, Robinson, and Dunn, far quicker. So I think it’s a fair amount time to look at his performance. 

 

Hes taken 36 points from 31 games. 

 

Im interested in things HE CAN AFFECT. Team selection, tactics, man management, player recruitment. (The ones he could pick, which he had plenty of scope for) 

 

Im not interested in, the training facilities are shit,  he can’t have all his own players, the takeover. This man is not stupid. An to say these things are surprise to him or he didn’t have his eyes wide open when he took the job, is insulting his intelligence. 

 

Personally, I’m very 50/50. I think we flatter to deceive. If we stay up, and Wellens keeps the job, I honestly wouldn’t go into next season with any great hope. As he’s shown so far, he can’t organise a defence. How many times do we a goal down, start slowly, or concede a couple without tactical change. Having said that I think we’d be ok for our usual 17th, because he’d have us scoring a few. 

 

So, we bob along watching a few more entertaining games, and finish 17th.

 

Terrific. Can’t wait. 

 

 

[johnafoafc]

I’m in the willing to give him a go next season but wouldn’t be sad to see him go either camp. He had a good honeymoon period and a good run up until November. Nine games ago, Plymouth game? I thought we were in deep shit but he’s managed to grind out a few results since then.

The injuries, poor training facilities, shit storms, issues recruiting players and poor playing surface are all something his predecessors have had to contend with. They’re an occupational hazard at BP.

Edited April 11, 2018 by johnafoafc

[Kusunga_Is_God]

It's a tough one for sure.

You have to really nit pick with this one because there are so many variables. Takeover, position he started in, loanees leaving in January..

I think the bottom line is, could we have done better? Yes, absolutely.. There are so many games where we have thrown them away ourselves. So many times going 2-0 down and 0-0 draws that should have finished 3-0.

Do we get rid of him though..? I think so. I think Abdallah will want his own man and I can't help think if Shez and Abdallah did get on then we would be in a better position now that's for sure...

The idea of a relegation battle at the start of December would have been scorned at, it just didn't seem possible. I think one major point is the period surrounding the uncertainty regarding loanees and the confirmation of the takeover. If it was a more stable environment would we have picked up more points.. who knows?

Shrewsbury are challenging with some absolutely bang average players and play a style of football that could make a monk swear in frustration. We have some extremely talented players that Richie just can't seem to either, get the best out of.. or find their correct position.

Heart say's in all honesty, let's see what he can build over the summer. Get the players in let's see what he can do. Mind says we have under performed too badly to trust him with a pre-season. 

Edited April 11, 2018 by Kusunga_Is_God

[League one forever]

2 minutes ago, Kusunga_Is_God said:

It's a tough one for sure.

You have to really nit pick with this one because there are so many variables. Takeover, position he started in, loanees leaving in January..

I think the bottom line is, could we have done better? Yes, absolutely.. There are so many games where we have thrown them away ourselves. So many times going 2-0 down and 0-0 draws that should have finished 3-0.

Do we get rid of him though..? I think so. I think Abdallah will want his own man and I can't help think if Shez and Abdallah did get on then we would be in a better position now that's for sure...

The idea of a relegation battle at the start of December would have been scorned at, it just didn't seem possible. I think one major point is the period surrounding the uncertainty regarding loanees and the confirmation of the takeover. If it was a more stable environment would we have picked up more points.. who knows?

Shrewsbury are challenging with some absolutely bang average players and play a style of football that could make a monk swear in frustration. We have some extremely talented players that Richie just can't seem to either, get the best out of.. or find their correct position.

Heart say's in all honesty, let's see what he can build over the summer. Get the players in let's see what he can do. Mind say's we have under performed too badly to trust him with a pre-season. 

That is a top post! Very well balanced. An exactly the discussion I’m after.

 

I really want him to do well. Like I do any Oldham manager. The point about Abdallah and shez getting along in different circumstances is very intriguing. However it wasn’t to be. Also the point about Shrewsbury is excellent. What are their constraints, lack of budget, etc - but look at what is achievable. Like all of us I just want something- anything to shout about. The only two mangers I’ve felt had ‘it’ were shez an Johnson.

 

I think there’s enough in his tenture to say he’ll do ok, but won’t push us on IMO.  

[Smiler13]

The fans at Shrewsbury this time last year where also calling for Hursts head because they where on a similar number of points to us at this time in the season but look 12 months forward and they are third in the league. Building a solid team takes time so I think Wellens deserves to bring in his own players in the Summer and let’s see what he can do in the first 10 games of next season. If we sack him and bring in another rookie we start all over again from scratch and there is no stability in the club again. Since Johnson left we have had nobody for more than 6 months as manager. We have gone from one crisis management to another. I think if Wellens keeps us up then he deserves a chance. I thought tonight we played some good football in bad conditions but we did not have any luck. You cannot blame the manager. We had 19 shots at goal and 59% possession. We played good football and their goalie produced two fantastic  saves . Also one was kicked of the so called line but looked to behind the line when it was kicked out. The Lino didn’t see it or the ref. They should have had a man sent off for a dangerous tackle. Our luck needs to change on Saturday.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Smiler13

[Bobledgersheart]

We really need to stop this knee jerk reaction after every match. Yes I know it's a bit disappointing we haven't taken three points tonight but I thought that some individual performances deserved credit. Moimbe, obviously had a good game, but to me man of the match was George who really seems to be growing as a player. With Gerrard obviously not 100% I thought he covered brilliantly for his partner's immobility and will prove to be a great asset to our club. It's a time for players to step up to the mark and in my opinion Edmundson has. I noticed that on Saturday after the goalmouth melee late on he congratulated Hamer on his defensive block which shows the team spirit we'll need to survive this season. As I've said before whatever happens this season we should start the next one with the current manager, albeit with a decent defensive minded assistant.

,   

[johnafoafc]

Not wanting to divert the thread but Hurst has done well at Shrewsbury with his recruitment, he’s signed a lot of players from league two and conference level that have slotted in and done a job. He’s also down well in th loan market.  I don’t know what sort of budget we are likely to have under AL as only a handful of people know what his plans are. But it’s worth considering that Shrewsbury did have a top ten budget until recently, certainly before Hurst took over hence why their fans were underwhelmed with the annual relegation battles.

 

Hopefully Richie will get a chance in pre-season (after keeping us in league one) but I remain to be convinced that he’ll take us forward despite wanting him to be a success.

Edited April 12, 2018 by johnafoafc

[League one forever]

5 minutes ago, Smiler13 said:

The fans at Shrewsbury this time last year where also calling for Hursts head because they where on a similar number of points to us at this time in the season but look 12 months forward and they are third in the league. Building a solid team takes time so I think Wellens deserves to bring in his own players in the Summer and let’s see what he can do in the first 10 games of next season. If we sack him and bring in another rookie we start all over again from scratch and there is no stability in the club again. Since Johnson left we have had nobody for more than 6 months as manager. We have gone from one crisis management to another. I think if Wellens keeps us up then he deserves a chance. I thought tonight we played some good football in bad conditions but we did not have any luck. You cannot blame the manager. We had 19 shots at goal and 59% posetion. We played good football and there goalie produced to worldy saves . Also one was kicked of the so called line but looked to behind the line when it was kicked out. The Lino didn’t see it or the ref. They should have had a man sent off for a dangerous tackle. Our luck needs to change on Saturday.

You can’t not blame the manager?

 

Why?

 

Is he exempt from criticism? 

 

Does he not pick the team? 

 

Does he not choose the tactics?

 

Where else does blame lie, when your results are poor/mediocre? 

 

How many ant times under Robinson did we say, ‘we’re nearly there’ our stats are good. We don’t concede. An yet the results were poor/awful. 

 

 It’s a results based game! Otherwise it be should/would/ could have. 

 

I do take your point about how things can change one season to the next. An that’s the hope. I also would be delighted if he could show in the first 10 games next year that he’d learnt from this year. 

 

But I also think to want stability and accept mediocrity is very uninspiring. 

[League one forever]

1 minute ago, Bobledgersheart said:

We really need to stop this knee jerk reaction after every match. Yes I know it's a bit disappointing we haven't taken three points tonight but I thought that some individual performances deserved credit. Moimbe, obviously had a good game, but to me man of the match was George who really seems to be growing as a player. With Gerrard obviously not 100% I thought he covered brilliantly for his partner's immobility and will prove to be a great asset to our club. It's a time for players to step up to the mark and in my opinion Edmundson has. I noticed that on Saturday after the goalmouth melee late on he congratulated Hamer on his defensive block which shows the team spirit we'll need to survive this season. As I've said before whatever happens this season we should start the next one with the current manager, albeit with a decent defensive minded assistant.

,   

Did you my read my post? 

 

Where did I mention tonight’s result?

 

There is absolutely nothing knee jerk about my post whatsoever. 

 

Its asking for an assesmemt of 31 games not 1. 

[mickjagger]

 We had 19 shots at goal and 59% possession. 

 

This might be a novel idea what about having ten shots and converting three, it is the quality of chances that is created that is the problem plus we played a team who are in diabolical form  they should of been beat no ifs no buts.

[Smiler13]

2 minutes ago, League one forever said:

You can’t not blame the manager?

 

Why?

 

Is he exempt from criticism? 

 

Does he not pick the team? 

 

Does he not choose the tactics?

 

Where else does blame lie, when your results are poor/mediocre? 

 

How many ant times under Robinson did we say, ‘we’re nearly there’ our stats are good. We don’t concede. An yet the results were poor/awful. 

 

 It’s a results based game! Otherwise it be should/would/ could have. 

 

I do take your point about how things can change one season to the next. An that’s the hope. I also would be delighted if he could show in the first 10 games next year that he’d learnt from this year. 

 

But I also think to want stability and accept mediocrity is very uninspiring. 

The blame lies with the players. However the style of play under Wellens is far better than under Robinson. Christ he’s only been manager 6 months give the guy a chance. That’s the problem at this club everyone wants instant success. When big Joe took over as manager it took him several seasons of mediocre performances before he got us playing as a potent playing team.  Perhaps people in those days had more patience in supporting a young new manager. 

[Smiler13]

7 minutes ago, mickjagger said:

 We had 19 shots at goal and 59% possession. 

 

This might be a novel idea what about having ten shots and converting three, it is the quality of chances that is created that is the problem plus we played a team who are in diabolical form  they should of been beat no ifs no buts.

Well therefore it’s players that are at fault in not converting the chances. If the manager sets the team up to get 59% possession then he’s done his job. It’s the players who need to get the ball into the net. Like I said you need a certain amount of luck as well and if you don’t get the luck then you loose. You can’t expect the manager to go and do it for them. 

[League one forever]

1 minute ago, Smiler13 said:

The blame lies with the players. However the style of play under Wellens is far better than under Robinson. Christ he’s only been manager 6 months give the guy a chance. That’s the problem at this club everyone wants instant success. When big Joe took over as manager it took him several seasons of mediocre performances before he got us playing as a potent playing team.  Perhaps people in those days had more patience in supporting a young new manager. 

I totally agree the style is better, but where are we????

 

Robinson- awful to watch. Roughly 1 point a game.

 

wellens - better to watch. Roughly 1 point per game.

 

He’s had 31 games. Is that enough for you to give an honest assesmemt of his performance? 

 

Or is it players fault up until now??? Really??? 

 

When does he take responsibility? 

 

60 games?

 

90 games? 

 

 

[Smiler13]

2 minutes ago, League one forever said:

I totally agree the style is better, but where are we????

 

Robinson- awful to watch. Roughly 1 point a game.

 

wellens - better to watch. Roughly 1 point per game.

 

He’s had 31 games. Is that enough for you to give an honest assesmemt of his performance? 

 

Or is it players fault up until now??? Really??? 

 

When does he take responsibility? 

 

60 games?

 

90 games? 

 

 

A six months tenure is not long enough

[johnafoafc]

10 minutes ago, Smiler13 said:

When big Joe took over as manager it took him several seasons of mediocre performances before he got us playing as a potent playing team.  Perhaps people in those days had more patience in supporting a young new manager. 

I was born not long before Big Joe was appointed so I’m not old enough to appreciate what the fans’ feelings were towards him in the early days.  Obviously this predated Internet forums. I guess the only platforms for debate were the pub, work or letters to the chron. I wonder if people genuinely questioned Big Joe in the early years but it wasn’t as well publicised?

[League one forever]

Just now, Smiler13 said:

A six months tenure is not long enough

But 3 months was long enough for Kelly, Dunn, and Robinson. 

 

I don’t get why you never balance your argument? You dont debate his record, his tactics, his team selection. 

 

I think you and others read posts like mine, an read what you want to see. ‘Oh, another wellens out post’

 

I’ve not called for him to be sacked. Once. 

 

But can we talk about his record, without unnecessarily leaping to his defence about how long he’s had the job? 

[Bobledgersheart]

6 minutes ago, johnafoafc said:

I was born not long before Big Joe was appointed so I’m not old enough to appreciate what the fans’ feelings were towards him in the early days.  Obviously this predated Internet forums. I guess the only platforms for debate were the pub, work or letters to the chron. I wonder if people genuinely questioned Big Joe in the early years but it wasn’t as well publicised?

It really doesn't matter what we, as supporters, feel the fact of the matter is that ANY manager needs time to succeed or fail and until we give them those opportunities we are destined to underachieve. Certainly the advent of these message boards has upped the pressure on an already tenuous job.

Edited April 12, 2018 by Bobledgersheart
grammar

[johnafoafc]

25 minutes ago, Bobledgersheart said:

It really doesn't matter what we, as supporters, feel the fact of the matter is that ANY manager needs time to succeed or fail and until we give them those opportunities we are destined to underachieve. Certainly the advent of these message boards has upped the pressure on can already tenuous job.

It was just a genuine question.  Obviously it was a different technological world in the early 80s but I wondered if fans at the time were happy/unhappy with Joe but it wasn’t as well documented or were people more patient and willing to give him a chance bearing in mind Jimmy Frizzell had just  been in charge for 12 years.

Edited April 12, 2018 by johnafoafc

[Smiler13]

At the moment he has my full support in trying to keep us up. He doesn’t need guys like you knocking him and analysing the teams perforances. We all need to support him until the end of the season . All he needs is a bit of luck. If the Walsall keeper had not produced two world class saves tonight we would have won 3-1 and then your posts would not be as critical. I don’t think it helps him or the team when you are so negative. Anyway it’s just my opinion that we should give the guy a chance next season with his own squad of players. I like the way he sets his team up to play attacking attractive football. Give him 10 games and then he will in effect have had a full season in management. I’m not saying he hasn’t made mistakes, of course he has , he’s a young rookie manager learning his trade. If he’s learned lessons from his mistakes then that will make him an even better manager next season. 

[League one forever]

2 minutes ago, Smiler13 said:

At the moment he has my full support in trying to keep us up. He doesn’t need guys like you knocking him and analysing the teams perforances. We all need to support him until the end of the season . All he needs is a bit of luck. If the Walsall keeper had not produced two world class saves tonight we would have won 3-1 and then your posts would not be as critical. I don’t think it helps him or the team when you are so negative. Anyway it’s just my opinion that we should give the guy a chance next season with his own squad of players. I like the way he sets his team up to play attacking attractive football. Give him 10 games and then he will in effect have had a full season in management. I’m not saying he hasn’t made mistakes, of course he has , he’s a young rookie manager learning his trade. If he’s learned lessons from his mistakes then that will make him an even better manager next season. 

Guys like me?? ?

 

Have we met? 

 

Ive tried a few times to have a natter with you, but looks like your incapable. 

 

Never mind.

 

Wellens out. ?

[Smiler13]

1 minute ago, League one forever said:

Guys like me?? ?

 

Have we met? 

 

Ive tried a few times to have a natter with you, but looks like your incapable. 

 

Never mind.

 

Wellens out. ?

We all love our club that’s the common denominator on this forum. So really we should at this crucial time of a very crazy season be as one in supporting the team until the very last kick of the game at Northampton. I don’t personally think it helps the manager or team to keep undermining their efforts when you can see them trying their best to get the necessary results to keep us in division 1. Tonight we played well without the luck we need. I just hope and pray that on Saturday our luck will change.

[League one forever]

1 minute ago, Smiler13 said:

We all love our club that’s the common denominator on this forum. So really we should at this crucial time of a very crazy season be as one in supporting the team until the very last kick of the game at Northampton. I don’t personally think it helps the manager or team to keep undermining their efforts when you can see them trying their best to get the necessary results to keep us in division 1. Tonight we played well without the luck we need. I just hope and pray that on Saturday our luck will change.

Agreed. 

 

Not undermining anyone, just want to talk to other fans about our team/manager. On a forum. 

 

Hoping for 3 points on sat. 

 

As always. 

[Smiler13]

1 minute ago, League one forever said:

Agreed. 

 

Not undermining anyone, just want to talk to other fans about our team/manager. On a forum. 

 

Hoping for 3 points on sat. 

 

As always. 

Point taken no hard feelings 

[b0ndl1ne]

I’m clinging onto the belief that if the pitch had held up, the training facilities also and the uncertainty with the return of loan players etc we would have continued in the rich vein of form we were in for a lot longer than we did and the season would have turned out completely different.

 

Weve had absolutely zero momentum this season and you need to maintain that to get anywhere e.g Shrews and Plymouth.

 

I would like us to stick by Wellens and see how he goes next season. I think if we were in this position this time next season he would have walked by now if not pushed

Edited April 12, 2018 by b0ndl1ne

[deyres42]

31 games.

 

Started off very well, things have tapered off a bit.

 

He's made some decisions, some not so good.

 

31 games.