deyres42 Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 8 minutes ago, kowenicki said: Apparently some new offers for Bury making representations direct to EFL tonight? But why didn’t they come forward last week or last month. Shambolic. Cannot be any more postponements. The competition has already been hugely undermined by Bolton and Bury. No point complaining about it, nothing you can effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweeperKeeper Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, BP1960 said: Was Ian Stott on the right track after all with the idea of a Manchester North team, i.e Latics, Rochdale and Bury? Personally I don't think so, but some might think it would have been a better financial proposition. No. It doesn't matter how big an area the team claims to represent. If they get a basket case as owner or overspend chasing dreams, then they'll end up in Bolton's state. And putting Manchester in the name... seriously, just no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweeperKeeper Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 27 minutes ago, lookersstandandy said: If you’re Bournemouth at the moment, you could be forgiven for thinking, it won’t happen to us, we’re in the big time..... but that was Bolton not so long ago.... what happens when their benefactor disappears..... Bournemouth know full well already what happens - they were very nearly kicked out of the league themselves in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Handsy said: 1st division north and south needed in my opinion instead of div 1 and two Champions promoted then a play off for the remaining place More local games Would mean more away fans at games increased revenue for clubs And less cost involved for the fans obviously some midland teams would swap between north and south dependent on relegation and promotion Said this for a long time, all the EFL are interested in is bringing under EPL 23s into the lower divisions, if more established clubs drop out this is exactly what they will do as they wouldn't have to worry about them going bust. The organisation is run by a bunch of incompetents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweeperKeeper Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 hours ago, kowenicki said: How can fans do this within the current EFL rules and company law? What could/can fans of Bury, Macc, Bolton, Blackpool have done/do to take control? Those fans, their demonstrations and actions achieved precisely nothing. 9 minutes ago, GlossopLatic said: 3 offers on the table for Bury SSN reporting. Really need to get this done and dusted. Then the EFL needs to sit down and find prevention measures to stop people coming into do this type of thing again. Alright you probably won't completely stop football clubs getting into bother but you can make it more difficult for dodgy characters getting hold of football clubs and holding them to ransom and make it less likely for this to happen again. I'm a big fan of the German system. Clubs have to give majority ownership to the members (i.e. fans). Harder to hide anything. In most of Europe, you need to get a license to enter the league each year - in other words at least a month before the season starts, turn the books over to the league. If the league isn't happy, they relegate as necessary, well before the season kicks off. Usually they promote to fill the gaps. Far fewer clubs seem to end up in as bad a way as in England, because problems come to light earlier and have to be dealt with in order to enter the league. If we'd have this system, there are a couple of season where we might have got bumped down a league for financial reasons. But equally the owners may not have made some of the bad decisions they made, knowing that would be the result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweeperKeeper Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Handsy said: 1st division north and south needed in my opinion instead of div 1 and two Champions promoted then a play off for the remaining place More local games Would mean more away fans at games increased revenue for clubs And less cost involved for the fans obviously some midland teams would swap between north and south dependent on relegation and promotion I don't think it will make that big a difference to the finances. The clubs don't make that much from away fans or spend a lot on travel, compared to wages. Every little helps though. I'd just rather us play Rochdale, Doncaster and Tranmere than midweek trips to Colchester, Yeovil or Gillingham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 22 minutes ago, deyres42 said: No point complaining about it, nothing you can effect. I’m observing and commenting on the shambolic events. It’s not a complaint. I’ll leave the complaining to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz_Oafc Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Ivan Lewis MP just on radio manc, says he's introduced a consortium in the last few hours to Steve Dale & EFL. He's appealing to the EFL for an extra 24hrs to sort everything but they have the proof of funds (best part of £4mil) the EFL require. He says the other bid is former Gateshead owner Joseph Cala, (who sounds a bit dodgy himself!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Gaz_Oafc said: Ivan Lewis MP just on radio manc, says he's introduced a consortium in the last few hours to Steve Dale & EFL. He's appealing to the EFL for an extra 24hrs to sort everything but they have the proof of funds (best part of £4mil) the EFL require. He says the other bid is former Gateshead owner Joseph Cala, (who sounds a bit dodgy himself!) How is 4m enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz_Oafc Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 6 minutes ago, kowenicki said: How is 4m enough? He explained you have to prove you have enough cash available upfront to run the club for 2 seasons (£1.2mil per season in Bury's case) and another £1.5mil to go towards clearing essential/urgent debts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookersstandandy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, SweeperKeeper said: Bournemouth know full well already what happens - they were very nearly kicked out of the league themselves in 2008. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookersstandandy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 7 minutes ago, kowenicki said: How is 4m enough? Our lad got through demonstrating less.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspiral_Carpet Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 4 minutes ago, Gaz_Oafc said: He explained you have to prove you have enough cash available upfront to run the club for 2 seasons (£1.2mil per season in Bury's case) and another £1.5mil to go towards clearing essential/urgent debts. Don’t they also need £3.6m to fund the CVA or the whole deal is off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 8 minutes ago, lookersstandandy said: Our lad got through demonstrating less.... Yes. But that’s irrelevant, the circumstances are hugely different as you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweeperKeeper Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 17 minutes ago, Gaz_Oafc said: Ivan Lewis MP just on radio manc, says he's introduced a consortium in the last few hours to Steve Dale & EFL. He's appealing to the EFL for an extra 24hrs to sort everything but they have the proof of funds (best part of £4mil) the EFL require. He says the other bid is former Gateshead owner Joseph Cala, (who sounds a bit dodgy himself!) Cala of the Gateshead that just got demoted for financial irregularities, about four months ago? Jesus Christ, seriously? Surely the EFL wouldn't allow that.... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whittles left foot Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, lookersstandandy said: ..a dozen clubs in the Premier League aside, every other club could end up like Bolton or Bury. Maybe now - because of Bolton & Bury - is the time for all supporters of all clubs that could end up like Bolton & Bury to come together. That would be the majority of football supporters in the UK. Are the current shenanigans not showing though that the fans don't really matter? Its all about buying and financing debt. If the authorities had more teeth and a better monitoring system then there may be a way of managing clubs better. Imagined fan power ain't gonna work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_blue Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 10 hours ago, mikejh45 said: Thought I'd seen it somewhere: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/man-city-evict-bury-fc-16509443 Yeh I new about the eviction. I read your post as taking them to court to recover more costs. They’ll just boot them out and move on with the site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookersstandandy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 45 minutes ago, whittles left foot said: Are the current shenanigans not showing though that the fans don't really matter? Its all about buying and financing debt. If the authorities had more teeth and a better monitoring system then there may be a way of managing clubs better. Imagined fan power ain't gonna work. .....yeah.... but all football fans - short of the immune few - haven't sought to come together..... where is the authorities motivation without it? All Shaun Harvey cared about what his next paycheck. If all 72 of the EFL’s clubs supporters said enough is enough, he wouldn’t be getting paid. The Labour movement was formed from the Trade Union movement, which was disparate unions coming together. Why not in football, amongst its supporters of all its clubs. Without a workforce, an industry couldn’t prosper, without supporters, neither can football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lees Latics Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Surely the time has come to make a decision, I don’t want to see either Bolton or Bury out of the league, but come on, I could rock up with a bag of Monopoly money, ask to see the books to do due diligence and then announce both clubs are beyond saving, these so called saviours are a load of chancers. There comes a time that clubs need to be run according to their income not by chucking a load of cash at it, run out and the fans suffer the consequences. If by pure chance that Bury were saved they’d be playing 3 times a week and by my reckoning they’ve only got 6 signed on players. Both clubs should fold and then reform as AFC Wimbledon and FCUoM have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookersstandandy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 55 minutes ago, kowenicki said: Yes. But that’s irrelevant, the circumstances are hugely different as you know. Different.... but could end the same.... we have no idea whether we are being saddled with debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_R Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 21 minutes ago, Lees Latics said: Surely the time has come to make a decision, I don’t want to see either Bolton or Bury out of the league, but come on, I could rock up with a bag of Monopoly money, ask to see the books to do due diligence and then announce both clubs are beyond saving, these so called saviours are a load of chancers. There comes a time that clubs need to be run according to their income not by chucking a load of cash at it, run out and the fans suffer the consequences. If by pure chance that Bury were saved they’d be playing 3 times a week and by my reckoning they’ve only got 6 signed on players. Both clubs should fold and then reform as AFC Wimbledon and FCUoM have. FCUoM haven't been reformed. Not yet, anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lees Latics Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 4 minutes ago, Steve_R said: FCUoM haven't been reformed. Not yet, anyway Ok smart arse, but it’s a club that was started by the fans and managed within their means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 25 minutes ago, lookersstandandy said: Different.... but could end the same.... we have no idea whether we are being saddled with debt. Secured against....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookersstandandy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 4 minutes ago, kowenicki said: Secured against....? Director loans.... money Mr. Lemsagam wants back, to pay over inflated wages for his players..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, lookersstandandy said: Director loans.... money Mr. Lemsagam wants back. Which he wouldn’t get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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