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Crusoe

The Athletic: L1 & L2 to be abandoned next week?

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Posted (edited)

The Athletic – usually a fairly reputable and serious source – is saying the EFL will tell clubs early next week that there is no chance of resuming the season. Method to be voted on to determine promotion, relegation and league places; currently favouring a points per game model, weighted to account for differences in how many home and away games each team has played.

 

https://theathletic.com/1800891/2020/05/08/leagueone-league-two-efl-ppg-coventry/

 

Edited by Crusoe

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I was certainly in favour of getting this season done before starting the next one a few weeks ago, but there's no way that this season can realistically be finished.  Points per game to work out promotion and relegation is the least worst option, null and void shouldn't (and probably won't) happen. 

 

That said, football will probably look completely different by the next time we can watch a game.  Hopefully we'll still be around at that time that happens.

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Like many, I am now coming to the view that the season will not restart. Promotion and relegation should be decided on a weighted points per game basis.

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That's Sunderland screwed for another season, will make another good season for netflix

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I have also changed my view on this. I was of the view that we had to finish the keague for integrity reasons but now I accept that even if we did, there would be no integrity.

 

If the league was to resume in say a month, come the end of June all clubs with nothing to play for would allow all out of contract players to leave and then finish off the season with youth team players. 

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Another one who has changed their view except I'd now also be in favour of null and voiding the season.

 

A PPG resolution is predicated on a need (emotional or practical) to have an outcome to the season. But it will have arbitrary losers (as well as winners) and there was so much of the season to go it just feels premature. If this had happened at Christmas I think it would have been null and voided and unfortunately it has stopped at probably the worst possible point. It will stick in the craw of your Liverpools, Leeds and Swindons but alas.

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6 hours ago, jsslatic said:

Another one who has changed their view except I'd now also be in favour of null and voiding the season.

 

A PPG resolution is predicated on a need (emotional or practical) to have an outcome to the season. But it will have arbitrary losers (as well as winners) and there was so much of the season to go it just feels premature. If this had happened at Christmas I think it would have been null and voided and unfortunately it has stopped at probably the worst possible point. It will stick in the craw of your Liverpools, Leeds and Swindons but alas.

It's not relevant yet to Leeds and Liverpool ; this is L1 & 2

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1 hour ago, Dave_Og said:

It's not relevant yet to Leeds and Liverpool ; this is L1 & 2

 

If L1 & L2 are decided on a PPG basis:

 

League 1

Champions - Coventry

Promoted - Rotherham

Third - Wycombe 

Relegated - Tranmere, Southend, Bolton

 

League 2

Champions - Swindon

Promoted - Crewe, Plymouth, Cheltenham 

Relegated - Stevenage

 

I wonder, in this age of algorithms, whether the PPG calculations should also include an element of recent form? 

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We need a model, guy called Ferguson is free.  We could get promoted to Prem 😀

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2 hours ago, Dave_Og said:

It's not relevant yet to Leeds and Liverpool ; this is L1 & 2

 

I know but my view is the same for everyone.

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1 hour ago, TheBigDog said:

 

If L1 & L2 are decided on a PPG basis:

 

League 1

Champions - Coventry

Promoted - Rotherham

Third - Wycombe 

Relegated - Tranmere, Southend, Bolton

 

League 2

Champions - Swindon

Promoted - Crewe, Plymouth, Cheltenham 

Relegated - Stevenage

 

I wonder, in this age of algorithms, whether the PPG calculations should also include an element of recent form? 

 

I'd also seen talk of weighted PPG to account for home/away matches.

 

It's completely arbitrary. If you can't complete the season then just sack it off.

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29 minutes ago, jsslatic said:

 

I'd also seen talk of weighted PPG to account for home/away matches.

 

It's completely arbitrary. If you can't complete the season then just sack it off.

also weighted for strength of remaining opposition

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20 minutes ago, jsslatic said:

 

I'd also seen talk of weighted PPG to account for home/away matches.

 

It's completely arbitrary. If you can't complete the season then just sack it off.

 

That’s the debate I suppose. Is it better to write off the season and upset a few clubs who will miss out or finish the season on a predictive basis and upset a few clubs who will suffer? 

I favour the latter.

 

And realistically only Tranmere might have a case against relegation from League 1 with Stevenage now vying with Macclesfield since the recent points deduction in League 2. The promotion picture however is far more complex I agree. 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, TheBigDog said:

 

That’s the debate I suppose. Is it better to write off the season and upset a few clubs who will miss out or finish the season on a predictive basis and upset a few clubs who will suffer? 

I favour the latter.

 

And realistically only Tranmere might have a case against relegation from League 1 with Stevenage now vying with Macclesfield since the recent points deduction in League 2. The promotion picture however is far more complex I agree. 

 

 

 

Not hard to justify not relegating Macc or Stevenage if the National League can't get play-offs on

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It's a wonder the pools panel haven't been mentioned to decide all remaining games.😕

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There's no fair way of solving this. We all know that teams at the bottom win games at the end of the season that they wouldn't have won earlier, and that teams at the top end start to get jittery and lose games they shouldn't. My ex colleague at work will be happy if the forecast of Coventry being champions of L1 is confirmed. He used to have the goal they scored to win the cup as his wallpaper on his monitor.    

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1 hour ago, BP1960 said:

It's a wonder the pools panel haven't been mentioned to decide all remaining games.😕

 

What is a pools panel?

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The only fair and logical solution is to cancel the season.... Basically it simply never happened.... Surely that is fairer than some nonsensical algorithm or formula or behind closed doors with 7 players, 25 minute half's and roll on roll off subs or whatever else the Premier league scumbags are discussing 

 

As for clubs complaining they were 5 points clear with only 9 games to play.... Tough shit!! grow up. 

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26 minutes ago, Ritchierich said:

The only fair and logical solution is to cancel the season.... Basically it simply never happened.... Surely that is fairer than some nonsensical algorithm or formula or behind closed doors with 7 players, 25 minute half's and roll on roll off subs or whatever else the Premier league scumbags are discussing 

 

As for clubs complaining they were 5 points clear with only 9 games to play.... Tough shit!! grow up. 

 

Nothing fair and logical about saying that a season which is almost 80% completed ‘simply never happened’ though is there?

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, TheBigDog said:

 

Nothing fair and logical about saying that a season which is almost 80% completed ‘simply never happened’ though is there?

 

 

 

 

No but there is nothing fair or logical about the situation the world finds itself in so we need to deal with things and make simple rational choices and decisions as best we can

 

Its not fair on Liverpool but it is also not fair on a team that was on a roll and only a few points off promotion, it is not fair on those who have lost their jobs, their business or their homes (which many could in the coming months when the economic fallout really starts to bite) 

 

On a more positive note, whatever system the EFL comes up with we will be safe in our customary 17th position or thereabouts 😁

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Depending on how they go about cancelling the season. There could be an argument that Bury are technically still in the football league? 

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13 hours ago, Canada_latic said:

Depending on how they go about cancelling the season. There could be an argument that Bury are technically still in the football league? 

If they scrap the whole season as Ritchie suggests, then maybe they could be if someone were to buy them. I think though that games played so far, have to be used in some way. A pools panel isn't a good option. They used to come up with some ridiculous results. End the season as it is and draw a team out of a bag for the playoff promotion slot.

 

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Haven't Bury been expelled? That's different to promotion and relegation not happening.

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Whichever way it goes, some clubs will be delighted and others rightly pissed off. There simply isn't a fair way of doing it. Scrap the season and you've mightily hacked off those that were pretty much nailed on for promotion, such as Swindon. You've also denied the clubs in the play off places the chance of a Wembley final and promotion from that. But what you have done is saved the likes of Bolton and Stevenage from relegation, so they'll be delighted.

 

Trying to work out points per game only works in part simply because, with games left, there's bound to be an imbalance of who played who, top v bottom etc. Then you have the freak results where a club struggling against relegation beats one of the clubs at or near the top. I haven't trawled all the results to see what that would create, but it's another spanner in the works IMO.

 

So, whatever is decided, you'll only satisfy some and piss off others. There isn't an easy answer. If I had to decide, hard as it is, let's just scrap the season. And that throws up another problem or two; promotion bonuses. They'll go out the window. Promotion from the National League to the heady heights of League 2 has gone as well. 

 

And I would imagine most players are more concerned about whether they still have a job rather than when their next game will be. There's an awful lot on the dole at the end of June unless something is done.

 

 

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