OAFC_ULTRA Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 22 minutes ago, League one forever said: Name me one club where a small group of supporters through a trust/or supporter group have affected any tangible change?? Name me one thing the PTB or Trust have ‘uncovered’ or any tangible difference they have made to the running of the football club? How many times does the club say it will work with the groups, then no one is available for six months?? They can’t affect anything, because it’s not their money and it’s a private business. You can stamp your feet all you want. But it’s always been that way. The Trust and PTB are paid lip service and mainly held in contempt. If you wanna get behind them because you admire their care and love for the club, crack on. But they are wasting their time to trying to get egotistical millionaires to listen to the paying punter. It’s been proved time and again, they don’t give a toss. Lets all just sit back and watch the club die then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 48 minutes ago, OAFC_ULTRA said: Lets all just sit back and watch the club die then Or. . . Wake up, and realise what you can and can’t affect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsworth blue Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 22 minutes ago, OAFC_ULTRA said: Lets all just sit back and watch the club die then PTB have actually gone out and there and asked fans to come forward with their intentions for 2020/21 in terms of attending/ purchasing season tickets and tried to get their opinions on what would maybe would attract fans back to BP. This information has been shared with the club and could be a tangible benefit if the club would use it to inform policy. PTB has actually shown both the club and the Trust how to effectively communicate with fans - for a while club comms improved, i think the Interim Trust Board are making good progress too in improving communication for the club's stakeholders including us the supporters PTB has been in touch with other Trusts and Supporters Associations and has developed knowledge of how other clubs' supporters have engaged with their club in times of trouble and has formed decent working relationships across the footballing community which may prove invaluable if the worst comes to the worst PTB were the first organisation to actually enquire about whether any supporters needed any support/ shopping etc. when COVID-19 lockdown came out - bit too much for a professional club to do that??? PTB have actually developed communications channels for current & former fans which far exceeds that held by the club and Trust (as far as i am aware), this means ex-supporters can be contacted in the event that their opinions may be considered. This keeps disillusioned ex-supporters in the loop and stops them from abandoning hope altogether that they may return to BP one day. PTB has been in touch with external organisations who have been linked with investing in other football clubs. I am not privvy to who or what and of course it may well be of no tangible benefit as they like the rest of us are hostage to fortune in terms of the owner's intentions/ the landlord's intentions. PTB has done lots of work in terms of community engagement which may be of significant tangible benefit once the owner leaves/ sells up.. either way i would suggest it is far superior than anything a professional football club might be expected to do. PTB has developed positive relationships with ex-players that has at least provided some decent humorous exchanges shared on social media for fans' benefit during periods of significant despondency amongst its supporters. I would much prefer PTB to highlight themselves what they perceive the benefits of their organisation to date. If the worst comes to the worst and OAFC do go bust or end up back in financial administration and be deducted points etc. (* whichever it is), PTB can at least hold their heads up high and say at least they tried to secure positive change. I live in Bury and well recall the outcry from Bury FC fans about why had no one asked their club any questions or tackled them - it was really heartbreaking seeing how they felt let down by the authorities but also by their own Trust which had failed to identify just how significant their issues actually were. Would you rather we just accept that there is nothing we as fans can do and just accept our fate whatever it is ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 1 hour ago, unsworth blue said: PTB have actually gone out and there and asked fans to come forward with their intentions for 2020/21 in terms of attending/ purchasing season tickets and tried to get their opinions on what would maybe would attract fans back to BP. This information has been shared with the club and could be a tangible benefit if the club would use it to inform policy. PTB has actually shown both the club and the Trust how to effectively communicate with fans - for a while club comms improved, i think the Interim Trust Board are making good progress too in improving communication for the club's stakeholders including us the supporters PTB has been in touch with other Trusts and Supporters Associations and has developed knowledge of how other clubs' supporters have engaged with their club in times of trouble and has formed decent working relationships across the footballing community which may prove invaluable if the worst comes to the worst PTB were the first organisation to actually enquire about whether any supporters needed any support/ shopping etc. when COVID-19 lockdown came out - bit too much for a professional club to do that??? PTB have actually developed communications channels for current & former fans which far exceeds that held by the club and Trust (as far as i am aware), this means ex-supporters can be contacted in the event that their opinions may be considered. This keeps disillusioned ex-supporters in the loop and stops them from abandoning hope altogether that they may return to BP one day. PTB has been in touch with external organisations who have been linked with investing in other football clubs. I am not privvy to who or what and of course it may well be of no tangible benefit as they like the rest of us are hostage to fortune in terms of the owner's intentions/ the landlord's intentions. PTB has done lots of work in terms of community engagement which may be of significant tangible benefit once the owner leaves/ sells up.. either way i would suggest it is far superior than anything a professional football club might be expected to do. PTB has developed positive relationships with ex-players that has at least provided some decent humorous exchanges shared on social media for fans' benefit during periods of significant despondency amongst its supporters. I would much prefer PTB to highlight themselves what they perceive the benefits of their organisation to date. If the worst comes to the worst and OAFC do go bust or end up back in financial administration and be deducted points etc. (* whichever it is), PTB can at least hold their heads up high and say at least they tried to secure positive change. I live in Bury and well recall the outcry from Bury FC fans about why had no one asked their club any questions or tackled them - it was really heartbreaking seeing how they felt let down by the authorities but also by their own Trust which had failed to identify just how significant their issues actually were. Would you rather we just accept that there is nothing we as fans can do and just accept our fate whatever it is ? All very credible unsworth. However you keep conflating effort/merit/hard work with tangible change. Some want to feel they did ‘something’ I accept that. But for what? You’re not being realistic. Do you think AL will take on any suggestion from the trust or PTB? Why does he say he’ll engage, then doesn’t? Why has he just sacked another manager? Why is isn’t the North Stand open? Because it’s HIS club. He’s not running a democracy. So all we can do to affect tangible change is vote with our feet. And before you come back again with, ‘oh let the club die then.’ It will never die, because there’s to much money and vested interests involved, and our situation is completely different to Bury in multitude of ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsworth blue Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 5 minutes ago, League one forever said: All very credible unsworth. However you keep conflating effort/merit/hard work with tangible change. Some want to feel they did ‘something’ I accept that. But for what? You’re not being realistic. Do you think AL will take on any suggestion from the trust or PTB? Why does he say he’ll engage, then doesn’t? Why has he just sacked another manager? Why is isn’t the North Stand open? Because it’s HIS club. He’s not running a democracy. So all we can do to affect tangible change is vote with our feet. And before you come back again with, ‘oh let the club die then.’ It will never die, because there’s to much money and vested interests involved, and our situation is completely different to Bury in multitude of ways. I am very realistic mate, i don't actually believe AL will engage either, i don't think he will for one moment. That is his right, maybe all we can do is either accept it and vote with our feet. PTB are running a democracy and it may well be that whatever they have been doing will result in the formation of a Phoenix club a' la Bury should Latics go under. Don't share your views on Latics never dying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaddyexile84 Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 7 minutes ago, League one forever said: and our situation is completely different to Bury in multitude of ways. It’s not the same but I wouldn’t say it’s completely different - Neither of us own our ground, both are in debt (them more than us) but we owe Blitz and presumably Lemsagem too if he pulled the plug a la Moore. I’m very cautious in suggesting we couldn’t go the same way - they were the litmus test and could well see the house of cards fall for many clubs. Lets not forget we were heading for admin until AL relented and then spouted 6 million we are yet to see... could well have been delaying the inevitable. With the loss of income from the OEC being closed (non matchdays) during the pandemic I can’t see Blitz being too patient around unpaid rent going forwards. I hate we have landlords but we do and therefore should be paying them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 4 minutes ago, unsworth blue said: I am very realistic mate, i don't actually believe AL will engage either, i don't think he will for one moment. That is his right, maybe all we can do is either accept it and vote with our feet. PTB are running a democracy and it may well be that whatever they have been doing will result in the formation of a Phoenix club a' la Bury should Latics go under. Don't share your views on Latics never dying Fair enough mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 21 minutes ago, Chaddyexile84 said: It’s not the same but I wouldn’t say it’s completely different - Neither of us own our ground, both are in debt (them more than us) but we owe Blitz and presumably Lemsagem too if he pulled the plug a la Moore. I’m very cautious in suggesting we couldn’t go the same way - they were the litmus test and could well see the house of cards fall for many clubs. Lets not forget we were heading for admin until AL relented and then spouted 6 million we are yet to see... could well have been delaying the inevitable. With the loss of income from the OEC being closed (non matchdays) during the pandemic I can’t see Blitz being too patient around unpaid rent going forwards. I hate we have landlords but we do and therefore should be paying them We don’t owe mystery off shore companies, nor we are we mortgaged against Blitz other companies. We owe Blitz. It’s far less complex than Bury, and if AL had the money he could have the entire club tomorrow. The recent court battle said it all. AL found the money when he had to but blitz had a contingency if he couldn’t pay and we went into admin. Then throw in FLG and the other recent bid for the club, they are plenty who are either invested or are waiting in the wings to invest. I said it at the time, but the North Stand will eventually save us, because Blitz will always keep us afloat so he doesn’t lose circa 7 million. Or the incumbent owner will pay him and we’ll be whole again. To many players and to much money for us to fail- by which I mean fold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaddyexile84 Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, League one forever said: We don’t owe mystery off shore companies Are we sure about that? Not being difficult but playing devils advocate - do we really know where AL is getting his money? Especially to suddenly pay in court and table an offer for the ground? If and it’s a big if he “buys” the lot I can see us swapping one landlord for another Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 Just now, Chaddyexile84 said: Are we sure about that? Not being. Difficult but playing devils advocate - do we really know where AL is getting his money? Especially to suddenly pay in court and table an offer for the ground? If and it’s a big if he “buys” the lot I can see us swapping one landlord for another Possibly. But again underneath that is somebody willing to put money in. Steve Dale put the square root of fuck all into Bury. I’m not saying it’s all roses, and we’ll be fine. I’m just saying that when people are willing to pay the bills for whatever reason, clubs don’t fold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaddyexile84 Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, League one forever said: Possibly. But again underneath that is somebody willing to put money in. Steve Dale put the square root of fuck all into Bury. I’m not saying it’s all roses, and we’ll be fine. I’m just saying that when people are willing to pay the bills for whatever reason, clubs don’t fold. That’s a fair enough comment - let’s just hope someone keeps paying the bills and yes - Dale is a world away even from the loons at our club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whittles left foot Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 3 hours ago, Chaddyexile84 said: Not being difficult but playing devils advocate - do we really know where AL is getting his money? Nobody knows-but it also gives the option that he could be loaded and unwilling to pay the asking price doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAFC_ULTRA Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 15 hours ago, unsworth blue said: PTB have actually gone out and there and asked fans to come forward with their intentions for 2020/21 in terms of attending/ purchasing season tickets and tried to get their opinions on what would maybe would attract fans back to BP. This information has been shared with the club and could be a tangible benefit if the club would use it to inform policy. PTB has actually shown both the club and the Trust how to effectively communicate with fans - for a while club comms improved, i think the Interim Trust Board are making good progress too in improving communication for the club's stakeholders including us the supporters PTB has been in touch with other Trusts and Supporters Associations and has developed knowledge of how other clubs' supporters have engaged with their club in times of trouble and has formed decent working relationships across the footballing community which may prove invaluable if the worst comes to the worst PTB were the first organisation to actually enquire about whether any supporters needed any support/ shopping etc. when COVID-19 lockdown came out - bit too much for a professional club to do that??? PTB have actually developed communications channels for current & former fans which far exceeds that held by the club and Trust (as far as i am aware), this means ex-supporters can be contacted in the event that their opinions may be considered. This keeps disillusioned ex-supporters in the loop and stops them from abandoning hope altogether that they may return to BP one day. PTB has been in touch with external organisations who have been linked with investing in other football clubs. I am not privvy to who or what and of course it may well be of no tangible benefit as they like the rest of us are hostage to fortune in terms of the owner's intentions/ the landlord's intentions. PTB has done lots of work in terms of community engagement which may be of significant tangible benefit once the owner leaves/ sells up.. either way i would suggest it is far superior than anything a professional football club might be expected to do. PTB has developed positive relationships with ex-players that has at least provided some decent humorous exchanges shared on social media for fans' benefit during periods of significant despondency amongst its supporters. I would much prefer PTB to highlight themselves what they perceive the benefits of their organisation to date. If the worst comes to the worst and OAFC do go bust or end up back in financial administration and be deducted points etc. (* whichever it is), PTB can at least hold their heads up high and say at least they tried to secure positive change. I live in Bury and well recall the outcry from Bury FC fans about why had no one asked their club any questions or tackled them - it was really heartbreaking seeing how they felt let down by the authorities but also by their own Trust which had failed to identify just how significant their issues actually were. Would you rather we just accept that there is nothing we as fans can do and just accept our fate whatever it is ? PTB are doing a good job and asking the questions and applying the pressure that is needed. My original post was a reply to someone who seems to think PTB is a waste of time as they clearly feel the club should just carry one doing what they are doing and answer to no one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsworth blue Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 52 minutes ago, OAFC_ULTRA said: PTB are doing a good job and asking the questions and applying the pressure that is needed. My original post was a reply to someone who seems to think PTB is a waste of time as they clearly feel the club should just carry one doing what they are doing and answer to no one sorry Ultra, my response should have been to him - apologies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_bro Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 Acting chair's two week review. Very impressive communication. https://trustoldham.co.uk/2020/08/21/acting-chair-two-weeks-review-week-ending-21st-august/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, al_bro said: Acting chair's two week review. Very impressive communication. https://trustoldham.co.uk/2020/08/21/acting-chair-two-weeks-review-week-ending-21st-august/ Said on twitter, I'd pay a years iFollow to watch her going through the books with Abdallah and Shaheed! #ReclaimTheTrust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Sinnott Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, al_bro said: Acting chair's two week review. Very impressive communication. https://trustoldham.co.uk/2020/08/21/acting-chair-two-weeks-review-week-ending-21st-august/ She's obviously got her head screwed on. I still think it is beyond repair, but PW might just give them a bit of a fighting chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, Lee Sinnott said: She's obviously got her head screwed on. I still think it is beyond repair, but PW might just give them a bit of a fighting chance... Yeah, it still needs the right people in place before it has any chance of moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 8 hours ago, OAFC_ULTRA said: PTB are doing a good job and asking the questions and applying the pressure that is needed. My original post was a reply to someone who seems to think PTB is a waste of time as they clearly feel the club should just carry one doing what they are doing and answer to no one Nice Try. It’s a shame you can’t debate an alternative view to your own without making things up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsworth blue Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 2 hours ago, singe said: Yeah, it still needs the right people in place before it has any chance of moving forward. I am very impressed at the work of the Interim Board so far, credit where it is due. Underdog - Thanks for going back in an acting capacity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAFC_ULTRA Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 1 hour ago, League one forever said: Nice Try. It’s a shame you can’t debate an alternative view to your own without making things up. Its a shame you think people trying to find out what is going on at the club is a waste of time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
League one forever Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, OAFC_ULTRA said: Its a shame you think people trying to find out what is going on at the club is a waste It is- but what you seem to have difficulty in understanding is the blame for that lies with the club- not PTB or the trust. What are these burning questions that have they had answered off the club? What pressure have they applied that has had any affect on the club, and it’s decision making? The answer to both is - none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singe Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 10 minutes ago, League one forever said: It is- but what you seem to have difficulty in understanding is the blame for that lies with the club- not PTB or the trust. What are these burning questions that have they had answered off the club? What pressure have they applied that has had any affect on the club, and it’s decision making? The answer to both is - none. The Trust has already got the club to substantially revise their accounts. And that is despite the Trust Rep. A focused and aligned Trust, withe the right people e on board, and with FSA backing can more substantially influence and steer than it ever has. It has the Governance rights to do more than it has in the past. PTB are galvanising fans. All takes time. If the Trust was benign, impotent and insignificant the owner would not be trying his little coup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disjointed Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 12 minutes ago, League one forever said: It is- but what you seem to have difficulty in understanding is the blame for that lies with the club- not PTB or the trust. What are these burning questions that have they had answered off the club? What pressure have they applied that has had any affect on the club, and it’s decision making? The answer to both is - none. TBF, PTB were slowly ramping up the courses of action when Covid 19 put paid to any further steps. Football ground to a halt so Al and his cronies were given breathing space. Time will tell if the owners may have listened although given the length of time it would be hard to judge what action has been most effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAFC_ULTRA Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 43 minutes ago, League one forever said: It is- but what you seem to have difficulty in understanding is the blame for that lies with the club- not PTB or the trust. What are these burning questions that have they had answered off the club? What pressure have they applied that has had any affect on the club, and it’s decision making? The answer to both is - none. I dont have difficulty understanding anything, other than you coming to that conclusion when I havent voiced an opinion on any of the issues raised in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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