oafc0000 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 im not deluded.not as much as you are by all accounts. if our debt is still the same as it was 3 years ago then yes we are :censored:ed!!!and tta's have missmanaged our club. if you cast your mind back a few years when they delivered a statement saying that for the first five years of there tenure they wouldnt be including any cup run money in there operating funds,this was as i beleive to be given to managers for players,or if none were available or good enough then to pay off some of our debt. this season we should(asccording to tta's)break even,the trottman money is a bonus,the cup runs have been a bonus,doesnt matter that we only get a hard core of 4k fans turning up,the money from cup runs and transfers has wiped our debt off,or very nearly. next season may be a problem revenus wise,with the stand coming down and reduced capacity,but thats next season,and there is no saying were not going to get a stupid offer for someone or go on another cup run and get tv money. I havent read anything from the owners saying we would break even this year! We wont have a player every year we can sell for that much money and we wont go on a cup run every year and unless we get at least 8,000 a game in the balance sheet will be in the minus. Thats from the TTA and I have heard nothing to go against that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspiral_Carpet Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 im not deluded.not as much as you are by all accounts. if our debt is still the same as it was 3 years ago then yes we are :censored:ed!!!and tta's have missmanaged our club. As far as I know, we haven't got any debt at all and haven't since TTA took over. Each Season, TTA set a budget and that is generally well in excess of expected income. As the Season progresses, history has shown that they dip further into their pockets to fund additions to the squad either permanently or on loan. We also seem to have a habit of paying off injured players. Cup runs; TV appearances etc will reduce those personal losses for TTA but in general, they have made that money available to the Manager for team strengthening. Running a football Club isn't just about paying for what appears on the pitch. There is also a massive amount of maintenance (floodlights; ground; pitch etc) all of which is to be paid for with an average crowd of 5600 or so. With the budgets set by TTA, the figure of 7800-8000 average home crowd is generally used as a break even point. The difference between the required average and actual probably leads to a loss to TTA of around £750k per year or £15k per week and that won't take into account any squad additions during the Season or unexpected expenditure. Nor will it include windfalls from Cup games, TV matches or the Trotman fee. The general understanding though was that the latter was available to Shez and was earmarked for the purchases of Leon Clarke and Neil Kilkenny. Hopefully, it will be available in the close Season when the new budgets are set. I don't recall TTA ever saying that we were on course to break even this year - or anytime in the near future to be honest. That is certainly the plan when the Stadium is redeveloped but in the meantime, as you say, it is more than likely that the weekly losses will increase due to reduced capacity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 (edited) As far as I know, we haven't got any debt at all and haven't since TTA took over. Each Season, TTA set a budget and that is generally well in excess of expected income. As the Season progresses, history has shown that they dip further into their pockets to fund additions to the squad either permanently or on loan. We also seem to have a habit of paying off injured players. Cup runs; TV appearances etc will reduce those personal losses for TTA but in general, they have made that money available to the Manager for team strengthening. Running a football Club isn't just about paying for what appears on the pitch. There is also a massive amount of maintenance (floodlights; ground; pitch etc) all of which is to be paid for with an average crowd of 5600 or so. With the budgets set by TTA, the figure of 7800-8000 average home crowd is generally used as a break even point. The difference between the required average and actual probably leads to a loss to TTA of around £750k per year or £15k per week and that won't take into account any squad additions during the Season or unexpected expenditure. Nor will it include windfalls from Cup games, TV matches or the Trotman fee. The general understanding though was that the latter was available to Shez and was earmarked for the purchases of Leon Clarke and Neil Kilkenny. Hopefully, it will be available in the close Season when the new budgets are set. I don't recall TTA ever saying that we were on course to break even this year - or anytime in the near future to be honest. That is certainly the plan when the Stadium is redeveloped but in the meantime, as you say, it is more than likely that the weekly losses will increase due to reduced capacity. Great post.....and is exactly as I understand it as well Alot of our supporters are in a cloud regarding our financial postion.... We are in the red of up to 15k a month....thats alot of money and the 3As are having to cover that. So I think its unrealistic / unfair to expect the 3As to invest in a much larger sqaud..... We will always have to put together a sqaud which is a mixture of decent / ok players and hope we dont get injurys and to be fair I think most of the teams in this league and others also work in this manner. Edited March 19, 2008 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senor_Coconut Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I think plenty of fans know exactly what sort of situation the club are in are, it's the same as 95% of clubs in the lower league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 (edited) I think plenty of fans know exactly what sort of situation the club are in are, it's the same as 95% of clubs in the lower league. I think for every one that does know there is one that dosent. Edited March 19, 2008 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scapegoat Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 In terms of the number of injured players - do we have a physio at the club full-time? It was a blank in the programme last week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Great post.....and is exactly as I understand it as well Alot of our supporters are in a cloud regarding our financial postion.... We are in the red of up to 15k a month....thats alot of money and the 3As are having to cover that. So I think its unrealistic / unfair to expect the 3As to invest in a much larger sqaud..... We will always have to put together a sqaud which is a mixture of decent / ok players and hope we dont get injurys and to be fair I think most of the teams in this league and others also work in this manner. the last 2 seasons should tell you just how small our squad is,and why we missed out last season and why we will probably miss out again this season,and if they dont invest in a decent size squad why we will keep missing out. you just cant wing it in the division with a small squad like what we have,and expect a serious promotion push. i think a decent physio is needed as well,far too many injuries over the last 2 seasons,is it down to genuine injuries picked up whilst playing,or down to poor training methods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 the last 2 seasons should tell you just how small our squad is,and why we missed out last season and why we will probably miss out again this season,and if they dont invest in a decent size squad why we will keep missing out. you just cant wing it in the division with a small squad like what we have,and expect a serious promotion push. i think a decent physio is needed as well,far too many injuries over the last 2 seasons,is it down to genuine injuries picked up whilst playing,or down to poor training methods. Sqaud sizes...... Oldham 27 Top 6 Swansea 33 Donaster 25 Carlise 29 Forest 31 Southend 27 Walsall 27 Once again ED your talking poo Everyone in this division is in the same boat apart from Forrest, Swansea and Leeds probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Sqaud sizes...... Oldham 27 Top 6 Swansea 33 Donaster 25 Carlise 29 Forest 31 Southend 27 Walsall 27 Once again ED your talking poo Everyone in this division is in the same boat apart from Forrest, Swansea and Leeds probably. once again you have to drag convo's down with derogitory remarks i dont give a brass farthing for other teams squads sizes,i was making a point of our squad.and in my opinion it is too small. the size has been small since dowies reign.and will probably continue to be a small squad until the ground is fully developed and the cash comes flowing in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 (edited) once again you have to drag convo's down with derogitory remarks you never do that do you I thought saying you was talking poo was a more pleasent way of saying your talking through your backside i dont give a brass farthing for other teams squads sizes,i was making a point of our squad.and in my opinion it is too small. Shouldnt that read....I dont care if you have proved me wrong....la la la lala im not listening.....la la la la la the size has been small since dowies reign. It wa small during Warnocks and Andys reign as well and will probably continue to be a small squad until the ground is fully developed and the cash comes flowing in. Do you think the cash is going to come flowing in once the ground is fully developed ?? I think breaking even is more likely...... Final point.....just how many players would you be happy with ? 27 sounds like a good number to me..... Edited March 20, 2008 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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