stebuzz Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 what with the current downturn in the economy i think the start of the season could well stun most clubs outside the premier league with a distinct lack of bums on seats. of course the season ticket holders will turn up, but the floating voters will have lots of things they would rather spend the 20 quid on than watching the local club. also with the price of petrol there wont be so many away fans making those journeys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 all those people who dont turn up shouldnt have got themselves in debt then should they. Obviously there are the low paid,unemployed,etc who cant afford it, and i sympothise with them, but i certainly dont with those struggling to pay off debts who have overspent in the last ten years on credit cards and hire purchase. ill be enjoying my trips away next year, even if it does cost that little bit extra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) all those people who dont turn up shouldnt have got themselves in debt then should they. Obviously there are the low paid,unemployed,etc who cant afford it, and i sympathise with them, but i certainly dont with those struggling to pay off debts who have overspent in the last ten years on credit cards and hire purchase. ill be enjoying my trips away next year, even if it does cost that little bit extra Rather harsh I feel. I don't suppose you are planning to save up your wages to buy a house with a 100% downpayment are you? If for example someone who gets less overtime than they are used to at the same time as seeing their mortgage go up and the cost of living for their family increases, then something might have to give. It's not a sign of recklessness to have to cut back on the entertainment budget in hard times. Edited July 16, 2008 by leeslover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorvik_latic Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Rather harsh I feel. I don't suppose you are planning to save up your wages to buy a house with a 100% downpayment are you? If for example someone who gets less overtime than they are used to at the same time as seeing their mortgage go up and the cost of living for their family increases, then something might have to give. It's not a sign of recklessness to have to cut back on the entertainment budget in hard times. Plus people losing their jobs due to a downturn in the economy! Pretty quick to judge there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 you have read me wrong, or rather i didnt make myself clear. i would consider loss of a job, reduction in overtime etc as something i sympathise with, but what i do not sympothise with is those who have spent money on credit cards etc simply because they wanted to by a new sofa, or new car and had to have it there and then. ive always believed you should live within your means, and save up for everything i buy. (obviously i wont buy a house for cash, Ill get a mortgage, but this will be the only purchase i ever make on credit). In the past I have bought a car, high spec laptop and recently, flights to aus for cash. if i couldnt afford them, i wouldnt have them. simple as. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 you have read me wrong, or rather i didnt make myself clear. i would consider loss of a job, reduction in overtime etc as something i sympathise with, but what i do not sympothise with is those who have spent money on credit cards etc simply because they wanted to by a new sofa, or new car and had to have it there and then. ive always believed you should live within your means, and save up for everything i buy. (obviously i wont buy a house for cash, Ill get a mortgage, but this will be the only purchase i ever make on credit). In the past I have bought a car, high spec laptop and recently, flights to aus for cash. if i couldnt afford them, i wouldnt have them. simple as. You have foregone consumption in the past by not using credit, some people will be foregoing consumption in the future. It's only time preference... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 You have foregone consumption in the past by not using credit, some people will be foregoing consumption in the future. It's only time preference... but i have saved all the interest. I havent forgone anything anyway. i have enough savings to buy what i want when i want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 but i have saved all the interest. I havent forgone anything anyway. i have enough savings to buy what i want when i want. But you lost the benefit of having goods or services earlier - that's why interest is charged/accepted... You having no sympathy for people foregoing things now is only the mirror image of them having no sympathy for you not having things they did years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 i have never foregone anything though. when i was sixteen i worked none stop through the summer and got some savings together and have had these since. what i did say is IF i did want something and couldnt afford it i would save for it rather than put myself into debt. you have to admit some people make really bad choices. ok, i dont drive around in a brand new car, and am not bothered about spending £100 on a shirt to go out in town in. But my car gets me from A-B, and I dont walk about looking like a tramp, My lifestyle hasnt suffered because im a serial moneysaver. some might call me tight, but so be it. I just dont like spending money I dont have to. be it in interest, or keeping up with the jones' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddog Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 i have never foregone anything though. when i was sixteen i worked none stop through the summer and got some savings together and have had these since. what i did say is IF i did want something and couldnt afford it i would save for it rather than put myself into debt. you have to admit some people make really bad choices. ok, i dont drive around in a brand new car, and am not bothered about spending £100 on a shirt to go out in town in. But my car gets me from A-B, and I dont walk about looking like a tramp, My lifestyle hasnt suffered because im a serial moneysaver. some might call me tight, but so be it. I just dont like spending money I dont have to. be it in interest, or keeping up with the jones' Phill, just wondering, have you ever lived away from home? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Phill, just wondering, have you ever lived away from home? i have actually, i lived in milton keynes for a time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 i have actually, i lived in milton keynes for a time. Now THAT I have no sympathy for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Now THAT I have no sympathy for one of the main reasons i hate mk mongs. worst time in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spadam Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 one of the main reasons i hate mk mongs. worst time in my life. lol so theres going to be more and more businesses going in admin just be happy that we have TTA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 (edited) i have never foregone anything though. when i was sixteen i worked none stop through the summer and got some savings together and have had these since. what i did say is IF i did want something and couldnt afford it i would save for it rather than put myself into debt. you have to admit some people make really bad choices. ok, i dont drive around in a brand new car, and am not bothered about spending £100 on a shirt to go out in town in. But my car gets me from A-B, and I dont walk about looking like a tramp, My lifestyle hasnt suffered because im a serial moneysaver. some might call me tight, but so be it. I just dont like spending money I dont have to. be it in interest, or keeping up with the jones' I think more people should have a pop at people with financial worries. It's so charming. In fact, I'm inspired. I'm going down to a Citizens Advice debt centre right now so I can tell people face to face where they went wrong. Thanks Phil! Edited July 17, 2008 by 24hoursfromtulsehill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigfinLatic Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 I think more people should have a pop at people with financial worries. It's so charming. In fact, I'm inspired. I'm going down to the a Citizens Advice debt centre right now so I can tell people face to face where they went wrong. Thanks Phil! I was actually thinking the same thing, after reading Phill's inspiring words I was thinking why not have a go at people with other socially created ailments, such as Gambling addiction and Alcoholism.... Sure they will all appreciate such self-righteousness!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 I was actually thinking the same thing, after reading Phill's inspiring words I was thinking why not have a go at people with other socially created ailments, such as Gambling addiction and Alcoholism.... Sure they will all appreciate such self-righteousness!!! Gambling - I think every man should have one vice he isn't in the grip of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirinclassic Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 what with the current downturn in the economy i think the start of the season could well stun most clubs outside the premier league with a distinct lack of bums on seats. of course the season ticket holders will turn up, but the floating voters will have lots of things they would rather spend the 20 quid on than watching the local club. also with the price of petrol there wont be so many away fans making those journeys. Stebuzz is absolutely correct with regards to Latics, though the bigger picture, I'm confident, is much, much worse. It's not going to be as bad as '29 (The Great Depression) but the slow economic implosion we see unravelling is going to hurt millions of people. Banks will fold, jobs will go, prices will rise. Of course easy credit is one of the things that has caused this sorry mess, but it's by far the only one. And if Bush attacks Iran before he leves office (as he wants to), then the whole Western world - especially the UK as an island - will be going to hell in a handbasket. Prepare now. KC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfatjoe1 Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Just got back from Chicago. Watching the news is grim. Over 75,000 people lost their homes last month due to repossession!! It ain't getting better. Globalisation!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Just got back from Chicago. Watching the news is grim. Over 75,000 people lost their homes last month due to repossession!! It ain't getting better. Globalisation!!! Don't blame the retarded actions of bankers on Globalisation!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Don't blame the retarded actions of bankers on Globalisation!! This terrible period of, “Globalisation,” has coincided with the longest continuous period of growing prosperity, increases in employment, live expectancy and so on in history. Now we appear to be about to have the first recession in over a decade, people have forgotten that they used to happen all the time, with nothing very good in between them. Add to that hundreds of millions of people formally in the Third World lifted out of poverty, and it’s actually been pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 This terrible period of, “Globalisation,” has coincided with the longest continuous period of growing prosperity, increases in employment, live expectancy and so on in history. Now we appear to be about to have the first recession in over a decade, people have forgotten that they used to happen all the time, with nothing very good in between them. Add to that hundreds of millions of people formally in the Third World lifted out of poverty, and it’s actually been pretty good. That's a decade and a half in fact. The last recession ended after Lamont and Major pulled us out of the ERM, not before time. For some reason, that event is known as Black Wednesday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfatjoe1 Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 This terrible period of, “Globalisation,” has coincided with the longest continuous period of growing prosperity, increases in employment, live expectancy and so on in history. Now we appear to be about to have the first recession in over a decade, people have forgotten that they used to happen all the time, with nothing very good in between them. Add to that hundreds of millions of people formally in the Third World lifted out of poverty, and it’s actually been pretty good. I'm wasn't blaming globalisation and never really suggested it was terrible. I was merely pointing out the inevitable ripple effect of a globalised economy. To blame individuals (or even the government) is not entirely fair given the structure of the global economy. Not making any judgements... However, now you've raised the subject, an unfettered capitalist system is not a good thing and actually keeps millions in poverty. The unfair trade policies of the west exasperate the problems in Africa. Exploitation by the west at the expense of the poor is rife. Globalisation has made it much easier to get our sports gear from India from some kid 'earning' 50 pence a day. The flip side, western jobs have been lost to call centres in places like India because they're on 10% of the wages earned over here. The only real winners are the big corporations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfatjoe1 Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 That's a decade and a half in fact. The last recession ended after Lamont and Major pulled us out of the ERM, not before time. For some reason, that event is known as Black Wednesday. There have been several recessions, just not here. The tiger economies suffered badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 I’m not sure how you can have both unfettered capitalism and unfair trade policies? I agree 100% that our policies regarding the poorer nations are wrong, but the solution isn’t more political intervention that suits sectional interest groups in the First World at the expense of most of us and of the Third World, it’s genuine free trade. Very poor people NEED to be exploited by us to become richer. They take jobs making goods for export because that’s an improvement on the alternatives open to them. It’s like the industrial revolution in England, looking back it seems grim having children working in mills, but before that they would have been living in mudpits, slaving all day on farms, suffering far higher infant mortality, far less chance of education and so on. The children or grandchildren of today’s sweatshop workers might well enjoy a standard of living comparable to that which we have today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.