BP1960 Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 IMO much of Latics problems at home, stem from midfield. The 2 central midfielders often come up against 3 from the opposition, the 2 Latics wide men rarely tuck in to help out, this often leaves the opposition with a free man in acres of space to dominate possession. This formation can also also lead to long clearances from the defenders as the central midfield 2 and the 2 wide men are often lodged around the half way line and invariably don't come short to receive the ball. Strangely enough, the manager when he played was one at the best in receiving the ball from defenders and constructing from the back. There's the dilemma, but have Latics the players to provide the solution? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 IMO much of Latics problems at home, stem from midfield. The 2 central midfielders often come up against 3 from the opposition, the 2 Latics wide men rarely tuck in to help out, this often leaves the opposition with a free man in acres of space to dominate possession. This formation can also also lead to long clearances from the defenders as the central midfield 2 and the 2 wide men are often lodged around the half way line and invariably don't come short to receive the ball. Strangely enough, the manager when he played was one at the best in receiving the ball from defenders and constructing from the back. There's the dilemma, but have Latics the players to provide the solution? This hits the nail on the head for me - we can no longer afford to play with two wingers, simple as that. Time to try an extra man in midfield - and fer gawds sake give Lee a go!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EASTLEY Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 This hits the nail on the head for me - we can no longer afford to play with two wingers, simple as that. Time to try an extra man in midfield - and fer gawds sake give Lee a go!!!! So hypothetically what about 3 CHs - Gregan/Stam sweeping at the back + Rubes, two wing backs to give us width(2 from Taylor/Eardley/Lomax/Lee/Smalley though I know Chris Taylor isn't the best defensively you couldn't drop him IMO) and three in centre mid(one playing behind the other two - from Maher/Whittaker/Allott/Lee/Stephens )and two up front from Hughes/Lewis/Dean/Wolfy/Byfield. Not really sure about Deano in this mix though don't think he has done too much wrong. If Hughes and Taylor go then it might also be made for Dan Jones I'm not saying we should do this - but maybe its an option? Opinions ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigfinLatic Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 This hits the nail on the head for me - we can no longer afford to play with two wingers, simple as that. Time to try an extra man in midfield - and fer gawds sake give Lee a go!!!! The answer was presented to Shez in yet another of the good performances which he decided to uttelry forget by the next saturday... away at cheltenham (forget the frst half!) we came out with a 433 and absolutely battered them, held the ball, and all our midfield played well... ------Eards Calamity Ruubes Lomax --------Allott----Maher---Whitts ----Deano--------------------Taylor ---------------Hughesy------------ However as soon as the match finished that formation was forgotten, and the creaking 442 came back into play... There's the dilemma, but have Latics the players to provide the solution? I think we do... however whether we have the right man to selcet the players and pick the formation and tactics is another matter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 (edited) The answer was presented to Shez in yet another of the good performances which he decided to uttelry forget by the next saturday... away at cheltenham (forget the frst half!) we came out with a 433 and absolutely battered them, held the ball, and all our midfield played well... ------Eards Calamity Ruubes Lomax --------Allott----Maher---Whitts ----Deano--------------------Taylor ---------------Hughesy------------ However as soon as the match finished that formation was forgotten, and the creaking 442 came back into play... I think we do... however whether we have the right man to selcet the players and pick the formation and tactics is another matter... I would make just a slight adjustment, Whitaker playing centrally just behind Hughes with instructions to shoot on sight. ------Eards Calamity Ruubes Lomax --------......Allott----Maher-- ----Deano--------------------Taylor ................... Whitts..................... ---------------Hughesy------------ Edited December 21, 2008 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 I would make just a slight adjustment, Whitaker playing centrally just behind Hughes with instructions to shoot on sight. ------Eards Calamity Ruubes Lomax --------......Allott----Maher-- ----Deano--------------------Taylor ................... Whitts..................... ---------------Hughesy------------ your probably right....teams coming to bp have worked us out every game almost,so to come out n play that formation will have them on the back foot straight away and shock them. however for some reason the manager doesnt agree and is probably scared to do it for fear of reprisals......in his world nothings wrong except for no leaders....for me he needs to lead by example and carry it on through the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 So we have lacked leadership and have been over run in midfield are we all in agreement that Kevin Maher a captain at Southend and of proven pedigree at this level has to start against Crewe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 So we have lacked leadership and have been over run in midfield are we all in agreement that Kevin Maher a captain at Southend and of proven pedigree at this level has to start against Crewe. sadly it isnt us that needs to be convinced is it.....for what its worth we all know it has to be changed.... the fact he didnt do anything wrong to lose his place makes it all the more puzzling as to why he isnt prefered,especially as he is one of shez.z signings. maybe instead of us all emialing the club with our ideas oh how to increase our attendance and other worthwhile marketing ideas....we should en-mass email the club regarding changing the playing formation!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futchers briefs Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 When killkenney wasn't playing well, we came up with 'play him just off the striker, he'll be dangerous there', when Lidds went through the same patch - same response - now Whitaker is doing the same and yet again, we want him to play off the front man?? If you want to play 4 4 2, you have people who are good enough in that position - if they are not good enough, you bloody well drop 'em and not accomodate them elsewhere!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 sadly it isnt us that needs to be convinced is it.....for what its worth we all know it has to be changed.... the fact he didnt do anything wrong to lose his place makes it all the more puzzling as to why he isnt prefered,especially as he is one of shez.z signings. maybe instead of us all emialing the club with our ideas oh how to increase our attendance and other worthwhile marketing ideas....we should en-mass email the club regarding changing the playing formation!!! I reckon he will start though Email the club on mass regarding formation changes well that would be like not bothering with a manager and just have a big brother vote on who plays and in what formation we play. Who goes you decide........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 if they are not good enough, you bloody well drop 'em and not acnh plaued corectycomodate them elsewhere!!! The point is Whitaker is not being played where he is most effective, that is high up the pitch using his ability to ghost in and have a crack at goal. He cannot do this in the present formation as he has to help out Allott in the overrun central midfield. Release him from that task and you will see a different player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 The point is Whitaker is not being played where he is most effective, that is high up the pitch using his ability to ghost in and have a crack at goal. He cannot do this in the present formation as he has to help out Allott in the overrun central midfield. Release him from that task and you will see a different player. And a lot more goals conceded too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OminousPoultry Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 The point is Whitaker is not being played where he is most effective, that is high up the pitch using his ability to ghost in and have a crack at goal. He cannot do this in the present formation as he has to help out Allott in the overrun central midfield. Release him from that task and you will see a different player. ...and the reason the midfield is overrun is because there is usually 2 of them versus 3 opposition players. 2 wide men who don't do a share of defending or come inside is a luxury. BigFin/BP got it right - except maybe start without Deano/Lidds and have Lee in a 451 and have the option of an alternative during the game. Orient worked it out at half time. Pity Shez can't change it during the game. His Plan B was to change a winger for a winger and a striker for another. No tactical change until the 90th minute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigfinLatic Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 however for some reason the manager doesnt agree and is probably scared to do it for fear of reprisals......in his world nothings wrong except for no leaders....for me he needs to lead by example and carry it on through the team. Totally agree... however the thing is, he has already used this system once, and it bloody worked! My main problem wiuth sheridan is the learning piece... what he learns from one game appears to be totally forgotten by the next... When we started this season another thing we thought was that we had the players to be flexible, both from one game to the next, and during games themselves - in terms of formation and personnel. I have fundamentally no problem with 442... however if it blatantly isnt working he needs to have the bottle to change it... As has been said, the game was crying out for this formation on saturday, and nothing happened.... as at brighton, as at yeovil... I dont mind if he starts with what he believes in, as along as there is a plan B when that goes arse over tit.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 IMO much of Latics problems at home, stem from midfield. The 2 central midfielders often come up against 3 from the opposition, the 2 Latics wide men rarely tuck in to help out, this often leaves the opposition with a free man in acres of space to dominate possession. This formation can also also lead to long clearances from the defenders as the central midfield 2 and the 2 wide men are often lodged around the half way line and invariably don't come short to receive the ball. Strangely enough, the manager when he played was one at the best in receiving the ball from defenders and constructing from the back. There's the dilemma, but have Latics the players to provide the solution? I concur. Suprising really as both Lids and Taylor could both give a decent game in the middle. If they really want to play passing football the movement needs to more fluid so that we can pass in triangles. Therefore both Taylor and Liddell need to not stick so strigently to their positions. Player 1 out of the two as a more central player and one as a winger could work as long as they were disciplined and interchanging this through the game would confuse the opposition. Though it could just as well confuse us if they get it wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Totally agree... however the thing is, he has already used this system once, and it bloody worked! My main problem wiuth sheridan is the learning piece... what he learns from one game appears to be totally forgotten by the next... When we started this season another thing we thought was that we had the players to be flexible, both from one game to the next, and during games themselves - in terms of formation and personnel. I have fundamentally no problem with 442... however if it blatantly isnt working he needs to have the bottle to change it... As has been said, the game was crying out for this formation on saturday, and nothing happened.... as at brighton, as at yeovil... I dont mind if he starts with what he believes in, as along as there is a plan B when that goes arse over tit.... He doesn't takes risks enough and when he does he makes probably too many changes so it comes off badly. If Shez cannot learn how to do this then he won't get too much further in management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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