oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 (edited) Anyway, now the baby has had his spat lets get back to the reasonable debate we was all having... Edited March 18, 2010 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hometownclub Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Anyway, now the baby has had his spat lets get back to the reasonable debate we was all having... Cheers BTW its the reasonable debate we were all having... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 Cheers BTW its the reasonable debate we were all having... Thanks for you continued input... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hometownclub Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Thanks for you continued input... Thank you, but I could never reciprocate and thank you for yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 Thank you, but I could never reciprocate and thank you for yours. Which questions the very reason why you commented on a thread I started in the first place when the majority of your comments have been an attack on me... Don't bother to reply... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 In an attempt to move this beyond certain peoples egos... What do you think of the AV system Garcon etc ? http://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/article.php?id=55 I think it is a reasonable idea... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hometownclub Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 People can slag Labour off all they want but please don't vote Tory... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelaticsfan Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 oafc0000 + HomeTownClub, ok how old are you both? seriously? Im going to make a thread called "the naughty corner" you can argue it out there, I love my country but there is too much corruption, and maybe the media does like to exxagerate it, but some of the things they have done, should never have been done in the first place, whether its exxagerated or not, its wrong. the only time they listen to you and want your input is when its election time or the party is not in power Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 (edited) the only time they listen to you and want your input is when its election time or the party is not in power I think this depends on the individual. I have been to MP surgeries on four occasions and every time I was listened to and got reasonable answers (even if I did not agree with the answer a couple of times). I think if you want to be listened to you have to put yourself in a position where you can be heard. More people should tackle their MP head on from time to time. It can only help. Edited March 18, 2010 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hometownclub Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 oafc0000 + HomeTownClub, ok how old are you both? seriously? Im going to make a thread called "the naughty corner" you can argue it out there, You can get off your high horse, you've had your share of arguements on here. It's called debate or arguement (take your pick), it's what messageboards are for, if everybody agrees with everybody else then whats the point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Not just the electoral system itself, but the way it is manipulated to benefit the party in power. Constituency boundary changes are probably the most obvious example, but there's more to it than that. I yearn for the day we have a representative House elected by some version of PR - then maybe a party gaining 25% of the national vote will have 25% of the members of that House. Then maybe people will feel their vote counts, even if they live in a constituency with a huge majority in the current first past the post system. And even if that vote is for a minority party. Just removing the monopoly of the three main parties and having a few members in there from the Greens, UKIP and even BNP would completely change the complexion of the House. One of the problems, apart from how you meet the needs of both local representation and achieving a proportional split nationally, is that for it to work our entire government culture would need to change from today's adversarial approach to one of collaboration. And it's worth adding that, where such a system does work, collaboration does not necessarily mean having to accept a weak compromise designed to suit all and please no-one in terms of what is delivered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 You can get off your high horse, you've had your share of arguements on here. It's called debate or arguement (take your pick), it's what messageboards are for, if everybody agrees with everybody else then whats the point. You just came out with a load of personal attacks... Looked at your profile and shocked to see your age. A messageboard is about discussing someones OPINION and not attack the person. Which you did. I only ever talked about your opinion. I don't think you understand messageboards at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 (edited) I'm not convinced on the AV system, unless it is used to elect more than one member per constituency as is the case with MEPs. The trouble then, though, is constituencies would be huge and lose their local focus (unless you want 2000 MPs... ). Edited March 18, 2010 by garcon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 Not just the electoral system itself, but the way it is manipulated to benefit the party in power. Constituency boundary changes are probably the most obvious example, but there's more to it than that. I would agree with the boundary changes. Very naughty... You are always going to have MPs with similar belifes teaming up, with our without parties. Its how :censored: gets done I think calls to say the system is corrupt is a bit strong. Real corruption is a scary thing and you only need to look at africa to see real corruption in operation. I yearn for the day we have a representative House elected by some version of PR - then maybe a party gaining 25% of the national vote will have 25% of the members of that House. Then maybe people will feel their vote counts, even if they live in a constituency with a huge majority in the current first past the post system. And even if that vote is for a minority party. Just removing the monopoly of the three main parties and having a few members in there from the Greens, UKIP and even BNP would completely change the complexion of the House. One of the problems, apart from how you meet the needs of both local representation and achieving a proportional split nationally, is that for it to work our entire government culture would need to change from today's adversarial approach to one of collaboration. And it's worth adding that, where such a system does work, collaboration does not necessarily mean having to accept a weak compromise designed to suit all and please no-one in terms of what is delivered. The rise of the BNP worries me regarding PR otherwise I don't mind it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelaticsfan Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 You can get off your high horse, you've had your share of arguements on here. It's called debate or arguement (take your pick), it's what messageboards are for, if everybody agrees with everybody else then whats the point. I have had a fair few arguments on here, I dont like it when people get personal! all my arguments are purely debating the topic, If i ever met any off you i would be sat next to you in the pub and may even buy a round in, I will argue till im blue in the face for my point but wouldnt ever get on to the point of wishing people would not talk anymore, well, except a few who come on just to stir trouble, whats with the anger dude? seriously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 I'm not convinced on the AV system, unless it is used to elect more than one member per constituency as is the case with MEPs. The trouble then, though, is constituencies would be huge and lose their local focus (unless you want 2000 MPs... ). I think people would be more inclined to vote for Greens lets say and then have a cover vote for Labour... I don't want 2000 MPs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelaticsfan Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Collaboration is really important, but it needs to work on a mutual trust which doesnt seem to happen in this country Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 The rise of the BNP worries me regarding PR otherwise I don't mind it. Give them their chance I say. If their national vote is 1% that's 5 members in a 500 MP House. I have absolute confidence they'd screw it up and lose credibility (and votes). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Corruption amonst politicians has been rife for centuries, as communications, media etc has improved far more of it is now exposed and leaked out where previously it hadn't. The term "as crooked as a politician" immediately springs to mind. Even though I get what you say, please please do not try and say that politics somehow is as corrupt as it was a few 100 years ago. As for the media improving, I would say having a free press it a good example of lack of corruption in politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 Collaboration is really important If we get a hung parliament then that might actually happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 One could argue that today's corruption is much more subtle. No it isn't as rife, or as influential, but it is still there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 Give them their chance I say. If their national vote is 1% that's 5 members in a 500 MP House. I have absolute confidence they'd screw it up and lose credibility (and votes). I am all for exposing the idiots for the idiots they are... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 One could argue that today's corruption is much more subtle. No it isn't as rife, or as influential, but it is still there. I think ours is at a level where you can argue its competition for seats as much as it is corruption... Its not at a level which causes me to lose sleep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 If we get a hung parliament then that might actually happen It depends on the make-up of that hung parliament and whether Nick Clegg is a man of his word, but I think a hung parliament would almost certainly result in another general election 6 months later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 18, 2010 Author Share Posted March 18, 2010 It depends on the make-up of that hung parliament and whether Nick Clegg is a man of his word, but I think a hung parliament would almost certainly result in another general election 6 months later. Out of interest what did Nick Clegg say ? I thought he was holding his cards close to his chest ? Every Lib Dem MP won't be challenged on it at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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