Is it time for a meeting between ordinary fans, club officials and maybe council officials?

[danoafc]

After skimming over a number of posts looking at various elements of the current state of the club/funding/Failsworth etc, do we feel that it would be beneficial for a number of fans representatives - ideally from both the Trust and OWTB etc to sit down with the club and ascertain the EXACT position of the finances, where we are up to on Failsworth, what fans can do in practical terms to help - other than turning up in greater numbers at BP, and then report back the outcome of the meeting on here.

 

If fans in general can help the situation (and OWTB has proven to be a useful tool in mobilising fans as was shown by the march over the planning application etc), then surely we should at least try?

 

It could be that there's nothing more to be done and we just have to wait for the charity commission or whoever it is to make their decisions, BUT it would seem that we are standing on the edge of the abyss and I think that some absolute clarity in relation to all of the above issues would be useful.

 

Any thoughts?

[razza699]

After skimming over a number of posts looking at various elements of the current state of the club/funding/Failsworth etc, do we feel that it would be beneficial for a number of fans representatives - ideally from both the Trust and OWTB etc to sit down with the club and ascertain the EXACT position of the finances, where we are up to on Failsworth, what fans can do in practical terms to help - other than turning up in greater numbers at BP, and then report back the outcome of the meeting on here.

 

If fans in general can help the situation (and OWTB has proven to be a useful tool in mobilising fans as was shown by the march over the planning application etc), then surely we should at least try?

 

It could be that there's nothing more to be done and we just have to wait for the charity commission or whoever it is to make their decisions, BUT it would seem that we are standing on the edge of the abyss and I think that some absolute clarity in relation to all of the above issues would be useful.

 

Any thoughts?

didnt they do this in the open forum though ?

[Stitch_KTF]

Perhaps it's time Jacko and Lags were put to work?

 

[danoafc]

didnt they do this in the open forum though ?

 

I wasn't really thinking of that kind of meeting. I was thinking perhaps something a little more intimate where people were more likely to ask the 'difficult' questions. I'd hope for ABSOLUTE honesty and openness. Then perhaps the outcome of the meeting could be posted on here and any potential action/pressure arranged via OWTB etc.

 

I think the problem with open forums is that too many people are afraid to ask questions/make points, and you often get end up getting sidetracked by irrelevant guff.

 

I also realise that in essence this is precisely what the trust should be doing, but there seems to be a common perseption on here that this isn;t really happening.

 

All of this said, we could just go with Stitch's suggestion!

[HarryBosch]

After skimming over a number of posts looking at various elements of the current state of the club/funding/Failsworth etc, do we feel that it would be beneficial for a number of fans representatives - ideally from both the Trust and OWTB etc to sit down with the club and ascertain the EXACT position of the finances, where we are up to on Failsworth, what fans can do in practical terms to help - other than turning up in greater numbers at BP, and then report back the outcome of the meeting on here.

 

If fans in general can help the situation (and OWTB has proven to be a useful tool in mobilising fans as was shown by the march over the planning application etc), then surely we should at least try?

 

It could be that there's nothing more to be done and we just have to wait for the charity commission or whoever it is to make their decisions, BUT it would seem that we are standing on the edge of the abyss and I think that some absolute clarity in relation to all of the above issues would be useful.

 

Any thoughts?

 

nothing

[HarryBosch]

I wasn't really thinking of that kind of meeting. I was thinking perhaps something a little more intimate where people were more likely to ask the 'difficult' questions. I'd hope for ABSOLUTE honesty and openness. Then perhaps the outcome of the meeting could be posted on here and any potential action/pressure arranged via OWTB etc.

 

I think the problem with open forums is that too many people are afraid to ask questions/make points, and you often get end up getting sidetracked by irrelevant guff.

 

I also realise that in essence this is precisely what the trust should be doing, but there seems to be a common perseption on here that this isn;t really happening.

 

All of this said, we could just go with Stitch's suggestion!

 

and then do what with the information - moan?

 

(that's not a pop at you btw)

Edited October 15, 2010 by HarryBosch

[danoafc]

and then do what with the information - moan?

 

(that's not a pop at you btw)

 

I dunno 'Arry. Depends what the information is I suppose. If there's nothing to be done then there's nothing to be done. If fans can assist by putting pressure on the council, charities commisson by writing to them, protesting, petitioning etc then use OWTB to try and co-ordinate things?

 

 

[oafcprozac]

I dunno 'Arry. Depends what the information is I suppose. If there's nothing to be done then there's nothing to be done. If fans can assist by putting pressure on the council, charities commisson by writing to them, protesting, petitioning etc then use OWTB to try and co-ordinate things?

 

I've been up for doing this for a while and have sounded out a couple of fellow fans, who agree and like me are biding their time. I know Hardy was keen for the meeting with me, but this week's events have superceded any gripes over marketing. Far more serious questions need to be asked, but I think we should wait for the charity commission decision as the future of the club could be even more at stake rather than simple economic turmoil.

 

OWTB would be a good way of co-ordinating any protests, etc... however I'm not comfortable in involving the trust. Many have very good intentions within the Trust but I think their effectiveness diminished a long time ago. I know many will disagree and shout me down, but I intend to run with this, once we learn the Charity Commission decision. Positive or negative there are a hell of a lot of issues that have been skipped over.

 

 

What is encouraging is the number of fans that have had an epiphany this week. It looks like the penny is finally dropping...

Edited October 15, 2010 by oafcprozac

[garcon]

I wouldn't bother waiting for the Charity Commission decision - there are much bigger obstacles to the Failsworth project than that.

 

I agree the Trust have effectively become irrelevant. They chucked all their eggs in TTA's basket and are now facing the consequences.

[help_shiny]

I wouldn't bother waiting for the Charity Commission decision - there are much bigger obstacles to the Failsworth project than that.

 

I agree the Trust have effectively become irrelevant. They chucked all their eggs in TTA's basket and are now facing the consequences.

 

but what were they thinking, the whole ethos of the trust movement that has sprung up over the past 15 years or so is to have an independent voice and influence isnt it? All they've done is superceded the old supporters club, given all the fundraising straight to the owners and then sat back. There has never seemed to be any independence at all. If we were to go out of business it would be the Trust that would be expected to start again - can anyone forsee that? It's all very worrying. We should have had an independent voice asking serious questions of the ownership throughout the past few years and one that has 200 or 250k (how much was it again?) in the bank for the inevitable rainy day.

[jsslatic]

What is encouraging is the number of fans that have had an epiphany this week. It looks like the penny is finally dropping...

 

Not really. There's a difference between the majority of people who are aware of the financial difficulties we are in and just grin and bear it and hope someone comes in with some money or the Council pull their finger out their arse, and the rest who are also aware but moan and write things demanding to know information that quite frankly makes no iota of difference whether they know or not.

 

The club is losing a lot of money. BP is unsustainable and the future of the club is largely dependent on moving to Failsworth. SC doesn't have a bottomless pit of money.

 

Nothing is new. Nothing that has been announced this week has changed anything. All it's done is give those who like to bleat on about a situation they can't change further details with which to do so.

[laticsmarra]

In all business situations time is the key. At the moment this is the situation with Latics. If, and it is a big if, Failsworth is to be the saviour, time is burning a big hole in the pockets. As every month of delay goes by the financial black hole gets bigger and something needs to be done. I would support a meeting involving the council,not just someone in the Failsworth ward, but someone in Cabinet with real executive influence. At the end of the day many clubs have had support from their local council using public money and I know the structure is local, but public money whicever way you look at it is our money. The Oldham Council has much to answer for in the decline and almost total absence of leisure and sporting facilities in the town and they aren't getting any better at it. Latics is almost the last man standing and I imagine the Directors are punch drunk with it all. So maybe we do need to step in and generate some action. The delays,obstacles and lack of support over the last 15 years have led to this crippling situation and unfortunately we need support when the economy is on its knees. With all the job losses Oldham Council will have other priorities.

 

What makes the situation sadder is that we have better performances on the pitch which given some outside investment/help could re-kindle things.

[Diego_Sideburns]

The club is losing a lot of money. BP is unsustainable and the future of the club is largely dependent on moving to Failsworth. SC doesn't have a bottomless pit of money.

 

Nothing is new. Nothing that has been announced this week has changed anything. All it's done is give those who like to bleat on about a situation they can't change further details with which to do so.

 

Unfortunately that's it in a nutshell!

[danoafc]

Unfortunately that's it in a nutshell!

 

Ok, so are we saying that there is NOTHING that some 'fan pressure' can achieve? Pressure on the council/charities commission/local MP's etc? Is it not even worth having the conversation?

[Oh Heck C-Beck]

Not really. There's a difference between the majority of people who are aware of the financial difficulties we are in and just grin and bear it and hope someone comes in with some money or the Council pull their finger out their arse, and the rest who are also aware but moan and write things demanding to know information that quite frankly makes no iota of difference whether they know or not.

 

The club is losing a lot of money. BP is unsustainable and the future of the club is largely dependent on moving to Failsworth. SC doesn't have a bottomless pit of money.

 

Nothing is new. Nothing that has been announced this week has changed anything. All it's done is give those who like to bleat on about a situation they can't change further details with which to do so.

 

Excellently put.

[Diego_Sideburns]

Ok, so are we saying that there is NOTHING that some 'fan pressure' can achieve? Pressure on the council/charities commission/local MP's etc? Is it not even worth having the conversation?

 

I believe that pressure should only be exerted when requested by the Club, as with the planning application. Any independent pressure might be counter-productive.

 

Meanwhile don't be afraid to take up the Club's offer to ask questions of SC or AH.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Diego_Sideburns

[ghostofcecere]

Not really. There's a difference between the majority of people who are aware of the financial difficulties we are in and just grin and bear it and hope someone comes in with some money or the Council pull their finger out their arse, and the rest who are also aware but moan and write things demanding to know information that quite frankly makes no iota of difference whether they know or not.

 

The club is losing a lot of money. BP is unsustainable and the future of the club is largely dependent on moving to Failsworth. SC doesn't have a bottomless pit of money.

 

Nothing is new. Nothing that has been announced this week has changed anything. All it's done is give those who like to bleat on about a situation they can't change further details with which to do so.

Totally spot on............. and to add it's a shame so few turned up at the forum where many of the issues being negatively spun on here in the last few days where or could have been addressed.

[Forte_Baby]

Totally spot on............. and to add it's a shame so few turned up at the forum where many of the issues being negatively spun on here in the last few days where or could have been addressed.

 

Maybe the forum should be done on a match day or during the mid week at a central location which is easy for all supporters to access to.

[HarryBosch]

Ok, so are we saying that there is NOTHING that some 'fan pressure' can achieve? Pressure on the council/charities commission/local MP's etc? Is it not even worth having the conversation?

 

3000 to 4000 of us in a town of 100,000 voters?

 

 

Edited October 15, 2010 by HarryBosch

[Lags]

3000 to 4000 of us in a town of 100,000 voters?

 

Aye 3000 to 4000 vocal voters gets more attention than 96,000 silent majority. Way of the world brother.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Lags

[help_shiny]

Aye 3000 to 4000 vocal voters gets more attention than 96,000 silent majority. Way of the world brother.

 

Indeed. Look at what Charlton fans did - they created The Valley Party and got 10.9% of the vote in their local elections in 1990. That might not sound massive but it was enough to put a rocket up the council. Still, I dont think anyone is in a position to form a party as there's not much point unless there's a clear aim and without knowing where the money is coming from.......

[rudemedic]

Aye 3000 to 4000 vocal voters gets more attention than 96,000 silent majority. Way of the world brother.

 

For council elections you wouldn't even need that much, could be as little as 500. The bloke who nixed the stadium plans with some made-up stats (Bashforth was it), I don't think he's still there and off a bunch of Latics fans probably didn't help.

 

Problem is large sections of Latics fans aren't registered to vote in Oldham, there's a little bit of Rochdale hoping we do go under (it will benefit them)

[garcon]

Wrong again rudemedic!

 

Bashforth's still there (though he's no longer chair of planning committee). And his partner in crime (Harrison) got back in at the last election.

 

They're both in Royton South.

 

I don't think I'm letting on anything I shouldn't by saying that at the time of the failed planning application a handful had started discussing the prospects of putting up a 'Latics candidate', but for various reasons (not least the successful reapplication) the plan was dropped.

[jimsleftfoot]

3000 to 4000 of us in a town of 100,000 voters?

 

Turnouts are normally only 40% if that so 3 to 4k would make a difference.