garcon Posted November 11, 2010 Share Posted November 11, 2010 Remembrance Sunday and the Poppy Appeal is and always was about Remembering those who gave their lives in World War I. Yes, naturally, we tend to expand it to those who've died in all conflicts, but if I were asked about it by a Muslim I would say that I was primarily remembering the sacrifices of those in the two World Wars, who died to protect the freedom we all enjoy in this country whether Christian, Muslim or Pastafarian. Perhaps more relevantly, for me there is absolutely no contradiction between remembering and respecting those who died serving our country and maintaining the stance that the Iraq war was illegal and the Afghanistan war is unwinnable and therefore pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy68 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 The last ten years has made me question my support... Overall the lads don't have a choice and do the bidding of the government so my support remains... but I struggle with the concept of "pride" and that our service men are "hero's" these days... There is nothing heroic about what happened in Iraq... Why, What happened in Iraq? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueJazzer Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Remembrance Sunday and the Poppy Appeal is and always was about Remembering those who gave their lives in World War I. Yes, naturally, we tend to expand it to those who've died in all conflicts, but if I were asked about it by a Muslim I would say that I was primarily remembering the sacrifices of those in the two World Wars, who died to protect the freedom we all enjoy in this country whether Christian, Muslim or Pastafarian. Perhaps more relevantly, for me there is absolutely no contradiction between remembering and respecting those who died serving our country and maintaining the stance that the Iraq war was illegal and the Afghanistan war is unwinnable and therefore pointless. 100% what he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slurms mckenzie Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 There isn't any difference between the extremist muslims who burned the poppies, and the Celtic fans who held up the anti-poppy banner on Sunday and sang songs of vile abuse to British soldiers at the Emerates Tournament this summer. These kind of actions are paradoxes in that people died, so that they are free to be able to perform these actions. The best thing in my opinion is to ignore these people, as opposed to give them the attention they crave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Why, What happened in Iraq? You been in a cave for the last 10 years ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razza699 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Only just seen this....not sure what I think really....first feeling is rage, then I mellow and think 'perhaps they have a point'.... For the first time ever I had a pretty strange thought today....I had my poppy on my coat as I usually do, driving to a job in a, well, muslim majority part of Manchester and I suddenly started to wonder if I should take my poppy off.....the people I was likely to be meeting would almost certainly be muslims and I was slightly worried that the poppy may not go down well. I would never have given this issue a second thought in the past, but, well, I don't know why I am sharing this...just seemed relevant/topical. what the hell is happening to this country if you start feeling this , whats it going to be like in 20 years ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy68 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 You been in a cave for the last 10 years ? No, far from it. I want you to tell me what you think happened in Iraq. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 (edited) No, far from it. I want you to tell me what you think happened in Iraq. Little kids blown apart ? You think all those bombs hit their intended targets ? Do you think all the targets were correctly identified ? Edited November 12, 2010 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 what the hell is happening to this country if you start feeling this , whats it going to be like in 20 years ? I think people are starting to learn that the "British Interest" is not always in the interest of all its people... The world has changed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy68 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Little kids blown apart ? You think all those bombs hit their intended targets ? Do you think all the targets were correctly identified ? Is that in the same way that suicide bombers define their targets? In answer to your question, no. You have to accept some collateral damage, no-one and nothing is perfect. Whilst I disagree with the primary reason (WMD) for Iraq, the secondary (Saddam and his boys) was a good runners up prize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 (edited) Is that in the same way that suicide bombers define their targets? In answer to your question, no. You have to accept some collateral damage, no-one and nothing is perfect. Whilst I disagree with the primary reason (WMD) for Iraq, the secondary (Saddam and his boys) was a good runners up prize. I am not some anti war loon... and I have respect for what our arm forces do and the sacrifice that is sometimes required... Hence my continued support with poppy appeal... I think the priced paid in Iraq was not worth it in the end and its really made me open my eyes to the British Interest, the role of our armed forces and what we should and should not be doing with them. As far as accepting collateral damage... I don't think all those lives lost have been justified... Collateral damage is a nice word for six year old little girls lying dead in the street. That :censored: needs a lot of justification. I shed no tear for Saddam, good riddance to the evil c*nt. Edited November 12, 2010 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy68 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 No. Not even similar. RoE are massively different Have you read them OAFCzone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outoftheblue Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Oh, to be attending that poppy burning demonstration. With a couple of grenades and the blind eye of authority turned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch_KTF Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Is that in the same way that suicide bombers define their targets? In answer to your question, no. You have to accept some collateral damage, no-one and nothing is perfect. Whilst I disagree with the primary reason (WMD) for Iraq, the secondary (Saddam and his boys) was a good runners up prize. Agreed, however it's far worse than that. A pretty unique position I recently found myself in meant I've seen what I consider primary evidence of totally unnacceptable brutality by U.S soldiers on civilians in Iraq/Afganistan. Far, far worse than anything reported on that recent 'Dispatches' show. I totally sympathise with the man in the streets view of the poppy burning, but I also know what their view would be of Afghan soldiers going into their relatives (peaceful) homes and ruining the lives of their entire family for a laugh, even if it was only a sick minority. Gun-toting, bible-bashing American nutcases yes, but then if there are no nutters 'serving' in the British Army for the wrong reasons then I'm a Dutchman. And besides, in the eyes of the people there us and the yanks are one and the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
help_shiny Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 what the hell is happening to this country if you start feeling this , whats it going to be like in 20 years ? Exactly! To be embarrassed to remember the 1 million plus British who died in both World Wars and then all those since in case it upsets someone. Hell in a hand cart. There's a German woman at my work, did I take my poppy off because she might be offended? Did I heck and would she have been offended anyway - no. And in the 10 million to one chance that she would have been then that's her problem not mine isnt it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 (edited) Agreed, however it's far worse than that. A pretty unique position I recently found myself in meant I've seen what I consider primary evidence of totally unnacceptable brutality by U.S soldiers on civilians in Iraq/Afganistan. Far, far worse than anything reported on that recent 'Dispatches' show. I totally sympathise with the man in the streets view of the poppy burning, but I also know what their view would be of Afghan soldiers going into their relatives (peaceful) homes and ruining the lives of their entire family for a laugh, even if it was only a sick minority. Gun-toting, bible-bashing American nutcases yes, but then if there are no nutters 'serving' in the British Army for the wrong reasons then I'm a Dutchman. And besides, in the eyes of the people there us and the yanks are one and the same. Also it is a joint operation... I don't think we can wash our hands of the behaviour of our partners... Edited November 12, 2010 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch_KTF Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Also it is a joint operation... I don't think we can wash our hands of the behaviour of our partners... Exactly. Had I been unfortunate enough to have been born within the part of the world we call Afghanistan I suspect I'd have a pretty low opinion of the British etc, and it probably wouldn't be based purely on religion, or 'extremism'. I suppose this is nothing new given centuries gone by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Exactly! To be embarrassed to remember the 1 million plus British who died in both World Wars and then all those since in case it upsets someone. Hell in a hand cart. There's a German woman at my work, did I take my poppy off because she might be offended? Did I heck and would she have been offended anyway - no. And in the 10 million to one chance that she would have been then that's her problem not mine isnt it? Oh the sweet sweet irony!! Read what you've written... "hell in a hand cart" when Muslims make you question wearing a Poppy. "Did I heck" when a German does it. There's no difference. That one in ten million chance for her is about 1 in 1.8 billion for muslims! 50 people burning a Poppy is not indicative of a population of 1.8 billion! This isn't complex. It's really simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
help_shiny Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Oh the sweet sweet irony!! Read what you've written... "hell in a hand cart" when Muslims make you question wearing a Poppy. "Did I heck" when a German does it. There's no difference. That one in ten million chance for her is about 1 in 1.8 billion for muslims! 50 people burning a Poppy is not indicative of a population of 1.8 billion! This isn't complex. It's really simple. Errr, have Muslims made me question me wearing a poppy? Read more closely. That was someone else. Secondly, at one point have I said that 50 people burning a Poppy represent the Muslims of the world? No I dont think I did, did I? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scratch2000uk Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 35 knob heads make you feel you should put your poppy away.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robboman Posted November 12, 2010 Author Share Posted November 12, 2010 Video of yesterdays disgrace for those who havent seen it (not like you would want to) http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newsvideo/...emorations.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_b_100 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Mmmmmm soon be christmas ... we can start it all over again when scools ban nativitiy and decorations .......... Then Easter then St Georges Day ... Then we can do remenbrence day again... We accept Ramadam and eid as a normal part of education can we not expect the same in return? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 Mmmmmm soon be christmas ... we can start it all over again when scools ban nativitiy and decorations .......... Then Easter then St Georges Day ... Then we can do remenbrence day again... We accept Ramadam and eid as a normal part of education can we not expect the same in return? Show me a single case of Muslims seeking to ban school nativities, decorations, Easter, St Georges etc. You're pandering to the rhetoric of the BNP, sparked by the occasional misguided ramblings of woolly minded "liberal" middle class white people who feel the need to be offended on other peoples' behalf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latic12345 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 I have respect for what our arm forces do Why? What can they do? Mine can lift and pick up stuff but yours sound really special... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robboman Posted November 12, 2010 Author Share Posted November 12, 2010 Show me a single case of Muslims seeking to ban school nativities, decorations, Easter, St Georges etc. You're pandering to the rhetoric of the BNP, sparked by the occasional misguided ramblings of woolly minded "liberal" middle class white people who feel the need to be offended on other peoples' behalf. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but did'nt they ban xmas decorations in Oldham a year or 2 (maybe 3) ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.