15 year old army cadets attacked for selling poppies in Manchester

[OAFCM35]

http://www.itv.com/news/granada/update/2014-11-02/army-cadet-suffers-burns-in-attack-after-selling-poppies/

 

 

[Matt]

Misleading title. Should be:

 

Cadet suffers burns in attack at bus stop waiting to go home

 

Still, a nasty attack. They should lift the perpetrator.

[OAFCM35]

Misleading title. Should be:

 

Cadet suffers burns in attack at bus stop waiting to go home

 

Still, a nasty attack. They should lift the perpetrator.

He was clearly attacked for selling poppies regardless of if he was attacked selling them or a few minutes after selling them. This is not a isolated incident either ever year volunteers selling poppies are attacked most of which are young cadets are elderly ex service men!

[Ackey]

He was clearly attacked for selling poppies regardless of if he was attacked selling them or a few minutes after selling them. This is not a isolated incident either ever year volunteers selling poppies are attacked most of which are young cadets are elderly ex service men!

Hang on. Where does "clearly attacked for..." come from!? There's literally nothing clear about this beyond a single newspaper article (which by the way also notes the attacker appeared delirious in some way shape or form!)

 

What this person has done is deplorable. Turning it in to a political point is awful all the same - you're devaluing the injury suffered by this person to serve your own agenda.

[Stevie_J]

Hang on. Where does "clearly attacked for..." come from!? There's literally nothing clear about this beyond a single newspaper article (which by the way also notes the attacker appeared delirious in some way shape or form!)

 

What this person has done is deplorable. Turning it in to a political point is awful all the same - you're devaluing the injury suffered by this person to serve your own agenda.

You could have picked up on the 'not a isolated incident' bit too. I'm not doing it, as I can't be arsed having one of these arguments.

[Ackey]

You could have picked up on the 'not a isolated incident' bit too. I'm not doing it, as I can't be arsed having one of these arguments.

I was going to but I wanted stats on that first so that my assertion had some value - however I can't actually find any statistics on the number of assaults on poppy sellers and thus I will have to wait for OAFCM35 to provide his source.

[Guest Scratch2000uk]

Found one. http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/royal-british-legion-cadet-threatened-to-be-shot-by-taliban-for-selling-remembrance-sunday-poppies-in-derbyshire-1-6920417

[OAFCM35]

Let's bury our heads in the sand and pretend it's not happening until someone presents graft and pie charts!

 

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-201378/Hammer-attack-poppy-seller-79.html - 79 year old volunteer attacked with a hammer in Aylsebury

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221106/Poppy-sellers-chaperones-string-attacks-collectors-year.html - Young cadets spat at - Bradford

 

http://m.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/royal-british-legion-cadet-threatened-to-be-shot-by-taliban-for-selling-remembrance-sunday-poppies-in-derbyshire-1-6920417 - Young cadets threatened to be "shot by the Taliban" - Derbyshire

 

 

Shall I continue or are you just going to put these down to coincidence?

Edited November 3, 2014 by OAFCM35

[Ackey]

Found one. http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/royal-british-legion-cadet-threatened-to-be-shot-by-taliban-for-selling-remembrance-sunday-poppies-in-derbyshire-1-6920417

I was hoping for statistics, chaps, as opposed to articles. I'm not disputing these events are taking place merely trying to understand their context.

[OAFCM35]

I was hoping for statistics, chaps, as opposed to articles. I'm not disputing these events are taking place merely trying to understand their context.

If the statistics arnt there what would you like us to do? Every year I'm hearing stories of poppy sellers being attacked and war memorials being defaced its disgusting!

[Guest Scratch2000uk]

I was hoping for statistics, chaps, as opposed to articles. I'm not disputing these events are taking place merely trying to understand their context.

 

I'd be surprised if there are any. Not that i'm going to bother looking.

[Ackey]

If the statistics arnt there what would you like us to do? Every year I'm hearing stories of poppy sellers being attacked and war memorials being defaced its disgusting!

It is - of that you have my 100% agreement. However we should not make wide reaching assumptions or judgements based on stories, we should make them on evidence.

[Guest Scratch2000uk]

Absence of evidence isn't always evidence of absence.

[Matt]

With this instance alone, bad or biased reporting could make the whole situation worse.

 

The Express reports that 'Army cadet, 15, suffers burns in aerosol attack while selling poppies'...and then goes on to not mention that at all. Everybody else pretty much reports that he had been selling poppies, and was attacked at the bus stop waiting for a bus sometime later. Peeling away the rubbish, basically the boy who was minding his own business was viciously attacked by a man with a lit aerosol can. A despicable crime, and I hope he gets nabbed.

 

Let's bury our heads in the sand and pretend it's not happening until someone presents graft and pie charts!


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-201378/Hammer-attack-poppy-seller-79.html - 79 year old volunteer attacked with a hammer in Aylsebury

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221106/Poppy-sellers-chaperones-string-attacks-collectors-year.html - Young cadets spat at - Bradford

http://m.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/royal-british-legion-cadet-threatened-to-be-shot-by-taliban-for-selling-remembrance-sunday-poppies-in-derbyshire-1-6920417 - Young cadets threatened to be "shot by the Taliban" - Derbyshire


Shall I continue.....

 

I'm afraid it isn't those who you're pointed this post at who has their head in the sand. The rest of the thread (quoted here) is just confirmation bias logical fallacy - and this is the thing, you could similarly look for attacks on kids, women and men whilst they were doing something else too, there are thousands unfortunately - but being attacked with a fishing rod in Dunstable or a snooker cue in Whitby for doing something that doesn't fit the agenda isn't good for your bias.

[Guest Scratch2000uk]

With this instance alone, bad or biased reporting could make the whole situation worse.

 

The Express reports that 'Army cadet, 15, suffers burns in aerosol attack while selling poppies'...and then goes on to not mention that at all. Everybody else pretty much reports that he had been selling poppies, and was attacked at the bus stop waiting for a bus sometime later. Peeling away the rubbish, basically the boy who was minding his own business was viciously attacked by a man with a lit aerosol can. A despicable crime, and I hope he gets nabbed.

 

 

I'm afraid it isn't those who you're pointed this post at who has their head in the sand. The rest of the thread (quoted here) is just confirmation bias logical fallacy - and this is the thing, you could similarly look for attacks on kids, women and men whilst they were doing something else too, there are thousands unfortunately - but being attacked with a fishing rod in Dunstable or a snooker cue in Whitby for doing something that doesn't fit the agenda isn't good for your bias.

 

I'd agree the Express article is misleading, then again, some other news outlets are just as guilty of showing bias when it comes to reporting their version of events.

 

**edit**

 

To be fair, i think anyone doing/had been doing good deeds or charity work usually gets it mentioned in news articles.

Edited November 3, 2014 by Scratch2000uk

[OAFCM35]

With this instance alone, bad or biased reporting could make the whole situation worse.

 

The Express reports that 'Army cadet, 15, suffers burns in aerosol attack while selling poppies'...and then goes on to not mention that at all. Everybody else pretty much reports that he had been selling poppies, and was attacked at the bus stop waiting for a bus sometime later. Peeling away the rubbish, basically the boy who was minding his own business was viciously attacked by a man with a lit aerosol can. A despicable crime, and I hope he gets nabbed.

 

 

I'm afraid it isn't those who you're pointed this post at who has their head in the sand. The rest of the thread (quoted here) is just confirmation bias logical fallacy - and this is the thing, you could similarly look for attacks on kids, women and men whilst they were doing something else too, there are thousands unfortunately - but being attacked with a fishing rod in Dunstable or a snooker cue in Whitby for doing something that doesn't fit the agenda isn't good for your bias.

Are you honestly trying to tell me that this young lad was attacked for no reason what so ever?

[Matt]

Are you honestly trying to tell me that this young lad was attacked for no reason what so ever?

 

Nope, but that's a possibility. I'm saying there is an agenda here, and your trying to confirm that with similar incidents. I don't see you being outraged by any other attack by anybody else - for any other reason, give it a rest - you're trying too hard.

[OAFCM35]

 

Nope, but that's a possibility. I'm saying there is an agenda here, and your trying to confirm that with similar incidents. I don't see you being outraged by any other attack by anybody else - for any other reason, give it a rest - you're trying too hard.

I got asked to present those incidences

 

Funny how you don't want to talk about them thou isn't it?

[Matt]

I got asked to present those incidences

 

Funny how you don't want to talk about them thou isn't it?

 

Don't have to. Although I will point out the moving goal post logical fallacy too, you're really racking the points up tonight.

 

*looks for your outrage about Ann McGuire - doesn't find it*

[OAFCM35]

Don't have to.

Don't want to more like

[Matt]

Don't want to more like

The guy didn't have ebola as well did he?

[OAFCM35]

The guy didn't have ebola as well did he?

What's that got to do with anything?

[Matt]

What's that got to do with anything?

You've got the right to an opinion, and I'm glad that it'll be largely ignored on here. I'm also glad that those who chose not to ignore it saw it for what it is.

 

We all agree it was a dispicable crime, nothing else needs to be said. Why hate any more?

 

I'm out.

[OAFCM35]

You've got the right to an opinion, and I'm glad that it'll be largely ignored on here.

We all agree it was a dispicable crime, nothing else needs to be said. Why hate any more?

The only hate I've shown on here is to those who attack poppy sellers! What's wrong about that?

[rudemedic]

The only hate I've shown on here is to those who attack poppy sellers! What's wrong about that?

Have you thought that the person who attacked the young lad, might have (undiagnosed) mental health problems? Thereby, the attack was not necessarily the fault of the perpetrator.