BPAS PODCAST SEASON 2: 30th Aug '21 Episode 47: This is How it Feels (to beat Sutton)

[BPAS]

In this week's episode, Matt is joined by Mike Keegan, to talk about his new book This is How it Feels. Plus, we'll hear audio from Andy's day out at Sutton United and we'll discuss the events leading up to this week's meeting between representatives of OASF and PTB and OAFC owner Abdallah Lemsagam.

 

Please help us do the work we do by visiting https://www.oafcpodcast.co.uk/, subscribing and looking in our online shop. We'll be adding more products in the coming weeks and months and would be grateful if you purchased the odd one or two to show your support!

 

Follow the show on Twitter, Instagram & Facebook @oafcpodcast.

 

Download and listen to the podcast via the FanHub app, where content creators and fans alike are rewarded for getting involved #ctg. Read more about FanHub here: https://fan-hub.com/

 

You can find out more about Push The Boundary by visiting them at https://pushtheboundary.co.uk/ and following on Twitter @PTB_OAFC. Find out more about OASF at http://www.trustoldham.org/

 

Title music is by Manchester DJ and producer Starion find out more at https://redlaserrecords.bandcamp.com/

 

 

[trickyrickyholden]

Mike Keegan's new book arrived on Friday and is finished already. It's a really fantastic book and I would highly recommend. Lots of new insights into the regime under Royle. 

Also find yourself hoping for different outcomes to the end of the "pinch me" season.

I was too young to appreciate this season. I was 7 year's old when Dad took me to Wembley for the league cup, so its nice to get some feeling for how amazing it must have been.

 

Whilst reading it, must admit to a feeling of sadness with where the club has fallen to, both in terms of the quality of football and our reputation in the game.

 

Anyway ill be interested to hear Mike talk about the book on the podcast

[Magic Mikey]

6 hours ago, trickyrickyholden said:

Mike Keegan's new book arrived on Friday and is finished already. It's a really fantastic book and I would highly recommend. Lots of new insights into the regime under Royle. 

Also find yourself hoping for different outcomes to the end of the "pinch me" season.

I was too young to appreciate this season. I was 7 year's old when Dad took me to Wembley for the league cup, so its nice to get some feeling for how amazing it must have been.

 

Whilst reading it, must admit to a feeling of sadness with where the club has fallen to, both in terms of the quality of football and our reputation in the game.

 

Anyway ill be interested to hear Mike talk about the book on the podcast

Does he write about missing the goals in the Sheff Wed title winning match? 

[Chaddyexile84]

5 minutes ago, Magic Mikey said:

Does he write about missing the goals in the Sheff Wed title winning match? 

He writes about a certain Roger Palmer missing them as he got a taxi home at 2-0 down

[Magic Mikey]

46 minutes ago, Chaddyexile84 said:

He writes about a certain Roger Palmer missing them as he got a taxi home at 2-0 down

Not what I was looking for but still funny. Peterboroughesque behaviour from the black pearl. 

[basilrobbie]

Another interesting Pod, even for an outsider like me.

 

I obviously tuned  in mainly for the middle section. It left me musing about our own experience, and how we ended up fighting on multiple, parallel fronts.  The Trust obviously had to maintain the moral high ground in our public dealings, but organisations like the Tangerine Knights weren't quite so constrained. And from 2017 onwards we opened up new fronts ; the court case (publicising and analysing events therein), putting real, concerted pressure on the EFL ; reaching out to the quality press and into Parliament.

 

It felt right to us because we didn't want too many eggs in one basket ; the court case was something of a gift ; and we felt that we were part of a much, much bigger problem (rightly, as it turned out). The one thing you may have in your favour is that the EFL is currently fighting for relevance and I would imagine keeping a close watching brief on you. I wish you well.

[al_bro]

9 hours ago, BPAS said:

In this week's episode, Matt is joined by Mike Keegan, to talk about his new book This is How it Feels. Plus, we'll hear audio from Andy's day out at Sutton United and we'll discuss the events leading up to this week's meeting between representatives of OASF and PTB and OAFC owner Abdallah Lemsagam.

 

Please help us do the work we do by visiting https://www.oafcpodcast.co.uk/, subscribing and looking in our online shop. We'll be adding more products in the coming weeks and months and would be grateful if you purchased the odd one or two to show your support!

 

Follow the show on Twitter, Instagram & Facebook @oafcpodcast.

 

Download and listen to the podcast via the FanHub app, where content creators and fans alike are rewarded for getting involved #ctg. Read more about FanHub here: https://fan-hub.com/

 

You can find out more about Push The Boundary by visiting them at https://pushtheboundary.co.uk/ and following on Twitter @PTB_OAFC. Find out more about OASF at http://www.trustoldham.org/

 

Title music is by Manchester DJ and producer Starion find out more at https://redlaserrecords.bandcamp.com/

 

 

You could ask Abdallah tomorrow how the restrictive EFL loan, which puts the club under transfer embargo for three years, affects his 5 year plan.

[Magic Mikey]

Great listen as usual. I'm relieved to hear that Mike Keegan is getting a well earned holiday. Covering the Euros and the Olympics is an absolute bitch. That suntan won't top itself up. 

Seriously, I wish Mike every success with the book and I'm looking forward to reading it. 

[League one forever]

Lads, 

 

I understand that you want to talk to  the club, but the nature of the proposed meeting is frustrating. When Andy asked the outcomes of meeting the thoughts given by Matt and Will were completely unrealistic IMO
 

1. Egomaniac owners have never and will never under any circumstances show any humility or weakness, nor do they hold their hand up to humble fans and say, ‘you’re right, I’ve been foolish with how I’ve spent MY money. 
 

2. No matter how Bad Mo is, what is his brother going to say???? 
 

3. What level of plan would be acceptable for both fan groups? How do you keep the club to account - when it’s taken protests and boycotts to get one meeting with the owner in god knows how long? And do you trust them to keep to what they promise? 
 

I don’t. 

 

How can we build a relationship from a base of zero trust? 
 

When Andy played devils, and asked about the meeting I thought Matt sounded defensive, when he said what do you expect, we can’t drag them out of the club. No- and no one is suggesting or expecting you should mate. But it’s clear that the protests are working in building pressure and publicity so why can’t you echo that momentum?  What have you got to lose - no relationship with the club??? You’re not alone- the vast majority of the fan base is behind you, so why does an ‘official capacity’ have to mean a conflict between how I know you all feel, and what you have to be seen to be doing?

 

It’s crystal clear they don’t listen to talking, or asking, or probing. That time has passed. 
 

The most pressure they’ve felt is the recent protests and boycotts. 
 

Why can’t the meeting be (In a firm but professional way) this is where we are as a fanbase, this is what will happen if you don’t sell. (You won’t even get a 1 million never mind 5) Will you sell, if not, why not. These could be the consequences of you not selling- dwindling fan base etc. 
 

You all galvanised me, by feeling the time to talk had gone, and It’s feels like you feel you need to give them another last chance to explain- Why? What will it achieve?  I don’t care about the football anymore, I don’t care what league we’re in. It’s completely irrelevant to me. I want our soul back. I want our Hope back. And if that’s means two steps back for three forward then do be it. 
 

 

[Chaddyexile84]

5 minutes ago, League one forever said:

Lads, 

 

I understand that you want to talk to  the club, but the nature of the proposed meeting is frustrating. When Andy asked the outcomes of meeting the thoughts given by Matt and Will were completely unrealistic IMO
 

1. Egomaniac owners have never and will never under any circumstances show any humility or weakness, nor do they hold their hand up to humble fans and say, ‘you’re right, I’ve been foolish with how I’ve spent MY money. 
 

2. No matter how Bad Mo is, what is his brother going to say???? 
 

3. What level of plan would be acceptable for both fan groups? How do you keep the club to account - when it’s taken protests and boycotts to get one meeting with the owner in god knows how long? And do you trust them to keep to what they promise? 
 

I don’t. 

 

How can we build a relationship from a base of zero trust? 
 

When Andy played devils, and asked about the meeting I thought Matt sounded defensive, when he said what do you expect, we can’t drag them out of the club. No- and no one is suggesting or expecting you should mate. But it’s clear that the protests are working in building pressure and publicity so why can’t you echo that momentum?  What have you got to lose - no relationship with the club??? You’re not alone- the vast majority of the fan base is behind you, so why does an ‘official capacity’ have to mean a conflict between how I know you all feel, and what you have to be seen to be doing?

 

It’s crystal clear they don’t listen to talking, or asking, or probing. That time has passed. 
 

The most pressure they’ve felt is the recent protests and boycotts. 
 

Why can’t the meeting be (In a firm but professional way) this is where we are as a fanbase, this is what will happen if you don’t sell. (You won’t even get a 1 million never mind 5) Will you sell, if not, why not. These could be the consequences of you not selling- dwindling fan base etc. 
 

You all galvanised me, by feeling the time to talk had gone, and It’s feels like you feel you need to give them another last chance to explain- Why? What will it achieve?  I don’t care about the football anymore, I don’t care what league we’re in. It’s completely irrelevant to me. I want our soul back. I want our Hope back. And if that’s means two steps back for three forward then do be it. 
 

 

I agree with all of this and it does have a feeling of Chamberlain meeting Hitler but…

 

Lets hear what Abdallah has to say now protests are in his face and let’s tell him it’s time to go which I’m sure is what Matt plans - also a chance to tell him that tennis balls and pitch invasions will be the norm unless he does that very thing or at the least removes Mo 

[Ritchierich]

“We’ve had a shot” was the highlight of the day until Pidge scored...and that was the highlight of the day until Junior scored

[Ritchierich]

On Sheehan cupping his ears etc when we scored that was because a Latics fan (actually, a twat) had a right go at him just before half time...Sheehan engaged with him and pretty much shouted back “ why don’t you come and play?” Or something like that. He was really agitated and when the whistle went shortly after he was telling anyone who would listen on the way off the pitch (the new keeper especially) what happened.

 

We have to make sure we understand who is to blame for our situation. Imho it is Blitz, Corney, AlMo and a few others. It is not really any of the numerous Managers we’ve had in the last few years nor the dozens of players who have come and gone.

[Chaddyexile84]

8 minutes ago, Ritchierich said:

On Sheehan cupping his ears etc when we scored that was because a Latics fan (actually, a twat) had a right go at him just before half time...Sheehan engaged with him and pretty much shouted back “ why don’t you come and play?” Or something like that. He was really agitated and when the whistle went shortly after he was telling anyone who would listen on the way off the pitch (the new keeper especially) what happened.

 

We have to make sure we understand who is to blame for our situation. Imho it is Blitz, Corney, AlMo and a few others. It is not really any of the numerous Managers we’ve had in the last few years nor the dozens of players who have come and gone.

Remember Guy Branston saying something similar to a gobby prat who funnily enough didn’t mouth back to him 

[Andy b]

14 hours ago, basilrobbie said:

Another interesting Pod, even for an outsider like me.

 

I obviously tuned  in mainly for the middle section. It left me musing about our own experience, and how we ended up fighting on multiple, parallel fronts.  The Trust obviously had to maintain the moral high ground in our public dealings, but organisations like the Tangerine Knights weren't quite so constrained. And from 2017 onwards we opened up new fronts ; the court case (publicising and analysing events therein), putting real, concerted pressure on the EFL ; reaching out to the quality press and into Parliament.

 

It felt right to us because we didn't want too many eggs in one basket ; the court case was something of a gift ; and we felt that we were part of a much, much bigger problem (rightly, as it turned out). The one thing you may have in your favour is that the EFL is currently fighting for relevance and I would imagine keeping a close watching brief on you. I wish you well.

The court case was certainly a gift as was the owner’s public contempt for fans which meant it was easy to build a concensus. The owner’s behaviour united fans under a common cause and there was no denial he was bad for the club.

 

Other clubs arent so ‘lucky’. Owners often do just enough to stop a revolt and manage the decline (and extraction of funds) more strategically. Our last owner was a master of that but was as bad as our current one (many would disagree which is my point). 
 

A slow drawn out death, year on year incremental decline. Never enough to make headlines and never enough to galvanise fans into action. 

[Andy b]

9 hours ago, League one forever said:

Lads, 

 

I understand that you want to talk to  the club, but the nature of the proposed meeting is frustrating. When Andy asked the outcomes of meeting the thoughts given by Matt and Will were completely unrealistic IMO
 

1. Egomaniac owners have never and will never under any circumstances show any humility or weakness, nor do they hold their hand up to humble fans and say, ‘you’re right, I’ve been foolish with how I’ve spent MY money. 
 

2. No matter how Bad Mo is, what is his brother going to say???? 
 

3. What level of plan would be acceptable for both fan groups? How do you keep the club to account - when it’s taken protests and boycotts to get one meeting with the owner in god knows how long? And do you trust them to keep to what they promise? 
 

I don’t. 

 

How can we build a relationship from a base of zero trust? 
 

When Andy played devils, and asked about the meeting I thought Matt sounded defensive, when he said what do you expect, we can’t drag them out of the club. No- and no one is suggesting or expecting you should mate. But it’s clear that the protests are working in building pressure and publicity so why can’t you echo that momentum?  What have you got to lose - no relationship with the club??? You’re not alone- the vast majority of the fan base is behind you, so why does an ‘official capacity’ have to mean a conflict between how I know you all feel, and what you have to be seen to be doing?

 

It’s crystal clear they don’t listen to talking, or asking, or probing. That time has passed. 
 

The most pressure they’ve felt is the recent protests and boycotts. 
 

Why can’t the meeting be (In a firm but professional way) this is where we are as a fanbase, this is what will happen if you don’t sell. (You won’t even get a 1 million never mind 5) Will you sell, if not, why not. These could be the consequences of you not selling- dwindling fan base etc. 
 

You all galvanised me, by feeling the time to talk had gone, and It’s feels like you feel you need to give them another last chance to explain- Why? What will it achieve?  I don’t care about the football anymore, I don’t care what league we’re in. It’s completely irrelevant to me. I want our soul back. I want our Hope back. And if that’s means two steps back for three forward then do be it. 
 

 

I tend to agree that the focus of the meet has to be right. What is its purpose? The most effective use of the time is, in my opinion, to understand more about how AL’s departure could be facilitated. That involves a conversation about whether the club is for sale, on what terms and over what timeframe. He will keep his cards close to his chest of course but anything which we can learn which can then inform fans’ activities thereafter will be of use. 

Appealling to his conscience is futile, albeit getting things off our chests may be therapeutic. I’d resist that and talk about what we all want - a transfer of ownership and one which is good for the LONG TERM health of the club. 

[Matt]

9 hours ago, Chaddyexile84 said:

Remember Guy Branston saying something similar to a gobby prat who funnily enough didn’t mouth back to him 

 

Phil Starbuck at Springfield Park, Wigan.

[TheBigDog]

10 hours ago, League one forever said:

You all galvanised me, by feeling the time to talk had gone, and It’s feels like you feel you need to give them another last chance to explain- Why? What will it achieve?  I don’t care about the football anymore, I don’t care what league we’re in. It’s completely irrelevant to me. I want our soul back. I want our Hope back. And if that’s means two steps back for three forward then do be it. 

The way I view this meeting is that it is an opportunity to ask, face to face, all the searching and pertinent questions that need to be asked.

 

What is important is that the questions are the right ones and that if the lads do not get a proper response then the question is put to Abdallah again.

 

If he refuses to answer or fudges the answers then that in itself will speak volumes.

 

This may well be the boost that the faltering ‘boycott’ movement  needs - and let’s be honest the campaign has not really won over a majority of fans.

 

There is no point speculating on what Abdallah will say or how he will respond - let’s just do this.

[GlossopLatic]

11 hours ago, League one forever said:

Lads, 

 

I understand that you want to talk to  the club, but the nature of the proposed meeting is frustrating. When Andy asked the outcomes of meeting the thoughts given by Matt and Will were completely unrealistic IMO
 

1. Egomaniac owners have never and will never under any circumstances show any humility or weakness, nor do they hold their hand up to humble fans and say, ‘you’re right, I’ve been foolish with how I’ve spent MY money. 
 

2. No matter how Bad Mo is, what is his brother going to say???? 
 

3. What level of plan would be acceptable for both fan groups? How do you keep the club to account - when it’s taken protests and boycotts to get one meeting with the owner in god knows how long? And do you trust them to keep to what they promise? 
 

I don’t. 

 

How can we build a relationship from a base of zero trust? 
 

When Andy played devils, and asked about the meeting I thought Matt sounded defensive, when he said what do you expect, we can’t drag them out of the club. No- and no one is suggesting or expecting you should mate. But it’s clear that the protests are working in building pressure and publicity so why can’t you echo that momentum?  What have you got to lose - no relationship with the club??? You’re not alone- the vast majority of the fan base is behind you, so why does an ‘official capacity’ have to mean a conflict between how I know you all feel, and what you have to be seen to be doing?

 

It’s crystal clear they don’t listen to talking, or asking, or probing. That time has passed. 
 

The most pressure they’ve felt is the recent protests and boycotts. 
 

Why can’t the meeting be (In a firm but professional way) this is where we are as a fanbase, this is what will happen if you don’t sell. (You won’t even get a 1 million never mind 5) Will you sell, if not, why not. These could be the consequences of you not selling- dwindling fan base etc. 
 

You all galvanised me, by feeling the time to talk had gone, and It’s feels like you feel you need to give them another last chance to explain- Why? What will it achieve?  I don’t care about the football anymore, I don’t care what league we’re in. It’s completely irrelevant to me. I want our soul back. I want our Hope back. And if that’s means two steps back for three forward then do be it. 
 

 

 

They can only present the evidence too him its upto him to decide on his actions.

 

Also what he admits publicly and privately maybe two different things. He might say he doesn't want to sell and continue, but privately he may actually realise that this is a waste of his time and money and be trying to sell.

 

Either way I doubt he will be particularly honest.

[Pidge]

I think the time for questions is passed.  The meeting needs to simple.

 

“We represent the fans and true custodians of the club. The message from the fans is that the time has come for a new person to take over the club, (not unlike how the owner may change his football manager)

 

The fans want to save the club, not “kill the club” as has been suggested. The fans feel a new owner is the only way to a brighter future.

 

The consequence of this decision by the fans is that many have lost interest and will not come to matches regularly until the club has changed hands. Others are involving themselves in more direct action.  It would be in everyone’s best interests in the long run to facilitate this change.  The fans would get what they want, and the present owner will limit his financial loss.

 

So let’s talk about how we can achieve this!”

 

OR something along these lines.

[basilrobbie]

3 hours ago, Andy b said:

The court case was certainly a gift as was the owner’s public contempt for fans which meant it was easy to build a concensus. The owner’s behaviour united fans under a common cause and there was no denial he was bad for the club.

 

Other clubs arent so ‘lucky’. Owners often do just enough to stop a revolt and manage the decline (and extraction of funds) more strategically. Our last owner was a master of that but was as bad as our current one (many would disagree which is my point). 
 

A slow drawn out death, year on year incremental decline. Never enough to make headlines and never enough to galvanise fans into action. 

 

The court case was indeed a "gift", but it still had to be exploited, and that took a fair amount of organisation, skill and resilience. Just having someone in a London court room doing a full report wasn't always straightforward. And that was the "easy" bit.

 

I wouldn't over-state how united we were ; around 1,000 fans kept going in all the way through the boycott, and we were still trying to have a dialogue with the owner well over a year after it had started. So the idea being put forward that you should give it one more go doesn't sound unreasonable to me. I can understand why people might want to be able to say - and show - that you did everything you could before you escalate. 

 

The biggest hindrance we had was the Premier League money, which was a real double-edged sword. On the one hand what happened to it galvanised fans ; on the other, having it made it easier for the Oystons to dig in. 

 

I would love to know what the EFL are doing in your case. Their locus isn't immediately clear, I suppose, until and unless the owners can be shown to have demonstrably broken some rules. And that might be as much about off-field activity as not.  So I take your point about managed decline and how hard it is to confront To my mind, it strengthens the case for a boycott, as that is the easiest way to hurt them.

 

[Hometownclub]

What a great listen, well done, and have just ordered the book.

[GKing521]

16 hours ago, Chaddyexile84 said:

Remember Guy Branston saying something similar to a gobby prat who funnily enough didn’t mouth back to him 

I remember after Dan Gardner equalised at FGR in 2018 he ran over to the fans and I could hear him shouting "stop fucking booing"

[al_bro]

He will probably say the same as Corney used to say. The club is for sale if the right bid is made and it's someone who can take the club forward. Or something like that. 

 

I hope AL allows this meeting to be recorded. Not much chance I know.

[Chaddyexile84]

Come on @BPAShow did the meeting go since nothing else seems to be happening 

[BPAS]

10 hours ago, Chaddyexile84 said:

Come on @BPAShow did the meeting go since nothing else seems to be happening 

 

Please see below;

 

http://www.trustoldham.org/2021/09/01/meeting-statement-01-09-21/

 

We will of course be discussing this in more detail on Monday's pod.