lb0603

Who were the last team to play attractive football and get out of this division on a budget as small as ours?

 

I agree that Kelly will probably try something different it will work for first 6-8 games but we won't be able to afford a squad which has plans b and c to go with it when we get Sussed out...

 

Our budget allows for just enough players to play one system...as ugly as it is I would rather that be 11 6 foot + brutes that are solid playing 4-4-2... We haven't the budget to be clever and I think a simple solid approach might fair better and more consistent

Surely clubs with a supposedly smaller budget have to try and be clever in order to compete?

Don't kid your self that agents and negotiations only take place in January. If somebody wanted him they would have took him at a cut price with a contract that was due to end.

 

He also has fitness issues which are improving but just because LJ is a :censored: why didnt people believe him when he said the same. Winchester has a lot to prove yet. He will be here next season just like I said he would be here in Jan. I glad he will be but he needs to play one full season, be the driving force, keep improving and show his fitness is capable of stepping up a level

You're the one who brought up January - I'm just saying that someone will be willing to give us something for him. And don't you kid yourself that if a Championship club comes in that Winchester will turn around and say "no, it's alright I'll continue at Latics for now, thanks"

Also, he will have played one full season once this one ends.

 

Same bull was spouted about Winchester leaving in January since which he has signed a long term deal. some people really do overrate or underrate our players.

 

Yeah but the difference is now that they have 3 months to negotiate a proper price rather than rush one through in a month.

International footballer who plays every week, is a reasonable driving force in the middle and has age on his side. Somebodies going to take a punt.

Obviously you need to catch up. Players pick up injuries at bigger clubs, lose their way a little bit, sign for a smaller club, form picks up, they move on back to higher level.

 

That's generally how our transfer policy works.

So basically the one thing they all have in common (bar Winchester, who won't start the season with us next season) is that they're soft.

The thing Kelly and Mills have in common is that they don't fancy it when the going gets tough - they're mentally weak footballers and that's the reason they won't play at a higher level - that, coupled with the fact that they aren't technically good enough (If they were they would have been able to drag this team into the play-offs).

What people seem to forget is that the standard of League 1 this year is atrocious. If these players were really that good and could comfortably play at a higher level we'd have been with the top 5 who have run away with it. Judgment of them is being clouded and elevated (as it was with Johnson) by how poor the division actually is.

That crop you name are exactly the ones we HAVE to keep hold of if we want to challenge in this league. All could play at a higher level.

 

Then why aren't they?

Again, it was 16 points in the previous 13 and an FA Cup defeat, all with a pretty settled team, nobody was calling Johnson out for that run

I was.... granted not on here, but still

al_bro.

I agree with you, if you're using statistics incorrectly.

You wouldn't have a blanket analysis to fit every player. Using you're example of holding midfielders vs. creative midfielders the dominant KPIs that would be built into the analysis would change depending on what you're expecting from them tactically.

For example, for your holding midfielder you'd be maybe looking at interceptions made and general position play (because performance analysts do get this information) whereas with your creative midfielder you'd be looking at chances created and where he has possession, possibly. To determine whether they're successful or not wouldn't be down to subjective opinion; their performance would be analysed against relevant KPIs that should be obtained from a large pool of data that is readily available.

If statistics are used correctly from a large enough pool, the numbers just don't lie.

The data is available and it should be utilised (correctly).

Ashworth's appointment wouldn't change that, would it? I suspect the real reason, though, is that he's cheap. So are the other two.

It would if he's bringing in people above him as well.

Just an alternative view on the three reported candidates (mainly referring to Ashworth)....

Is it not possible that Corney has seen sense and is going for an approach that is more FC Midtjylland and Brentford (of next season) where decisions are going to be made through the use of statistical analysis and having several people involved in the decision making process (re. signings, tactics, post-match press conferences etc.)?

Because if that's the case, Ashworth may well have the most experience in man-management (which would be his main role) and therefore would actually stand out as the ideal candidate.

I know there'll be a lot of you who disagree with this approach because "that's not how football works" but, in truth, it should be. To paraphrase Billy Beane: In what other organization other than sport do you leave the fate of the company entirely up to a middle manager?

Every good team, during a season, has a bad run of 3 or 4 games.

Every bad team, during a season, has a couple of good runs of 3 or 4 games.

Latics took 9 points from a possible 9 against Southend, Carlisle and MK Dons. This adds to us taking only 12 points from another possible 48. Being nearly halfway through a season this strikes me as those 3 games being our good run of games thus meaning we're a bad team... and the results before those games included the injured lot and we still weren't picking up enough points. I think this shows that the return of our injured players as being the savoiurs of the season is unfounded, and ignore the hope of getting them all playing together regularly because it won't happen this season because injuries don't clear up at the drop of a hat. Plus football nowadays is a squad game and to quote Penney: "I'll have the squad in place by 29th June" - didn't he made his last signing on Thursday?

Onto his squad and signings...

9 permanent signings of which 5 were playing a level belowthis league last season, 3 were playing in League 1 but for arguably worse teams than us (and not regularly) and only 1 was playing to the same standard expected... and he's not made an appearence for us.

His loan signings... :censored: = very good

Blackman = not really done anything for me

Sheehan = presumably would have stayed if he'd wanted to?

Hills = meh

Flahavan = very good goalkeeper but, to me, underlines Penney's problem in viewing players. He's had to sack his own signing within 3 months because he got it wrong... who's to say he's not done that with the other 8?

Just a quick note on Heffernan too. He's not the solution to our goalscoring problem because you have to be creating chances to score.

My point here, really, is that the team's very poor and in a relegation fight and Penney's to blame for it with his idea of a "squad". And before I get the old resources argument back in my face... apart from Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Huddersfield whose budget can't we compete with? And why wait before you're deep in the s**t before getting rid of the problem?

All i can say he has barely kick a ball for 90mins at donny so give him a chance i think this move will go well for us.

Do Doncaster not train then?

All you have to do is look at the squad tonight and you can see that he's limited with the talent he has to work with. Ideally parker, smalley and colbeck would be on the bench at most! Once we get Tays, Pav, Holdsworth back we'll be scoring, in the mean time we need to find the goals from somewhere.

He signed Parker and Colbeck to be starters. You can't say he's got limited talent to work with when he's brought in the vast majority.

Explain to me how he was? Everyone was expecting the right footer to swing it in and then the left footer hits it in at the near post. Did you know that was coming? No and neither did anyone else. Dean Brill cant cover both posts and come to think of it neither can any keeper. What was he supposed to do? If you put a player on the post the first thing the attacking team do is stick 2 players infront of the keeper. Funny how when we concede every latics fan is suddenly a goal keeping coach. He was not at fault for that goal.

The ball should never be able to get AROUND the wall and end up in the net with a couple of yards to spare. It doesn't matter if you expect it or not, it should still be covered. The only reason the left footer took it wa because Brill had given him all that space to work with.

So you're saying he wasn't at fault for the goal?

Pogliacomi

Eardley Fitz Hall Clint Hill Bertrand

Liddell Neil Kilkenny Matty Appleby © Eyres

Wijnhard Hughes

Bench:

Chris Armstrong, Gary Kelly, Richie Wellens, Chris Porter, Haining, Taylor, Andrews.

After the failure of my 50/1 punt on Lee Hughes as the divisions top scorer last season, Blue Square are offering me a free bet to the value of one I place. I think my ill-advised banker will be Latics to beat County, anyone got any ideas for a slightly longer odds one? Can be Latics or not, and don't mind it being a long burner.

 

NB I don't understand betting. At all. So don't say anything complicated plaease

Hughes' about 7/1 to be League 2 top goalscorer - more likely than last year.

So you wont be bothering to go to any games this season then?

No, I play on Saturday.

So go on then, how many goals should a winger score in a season?

 

Is eleven not enough for you

 

Not when he's got 7 after about 10 games

I'll just pick one. The most wrong thing said in wrongtown.

Oh yeah, I forgot all those goals he's scored in his career

Feel free to disagree with me on this as I am usually quite harsh when it comes to football but I feel this team, potentially, could be in for a long season. Why?

Dean Brill - of what I've seen of him he's one of the best goalkeepers in the world... if the balls nowhere near him. He's big and loud but, unfortuantely, has shown, to em, a lack of ability.

The defence, as has been mentioned in many other topics is certainly a major concern. Especially if Lomax is in it.

The midfield and attack is an area people seem to be overlooking a little to me. There's, on paper, not alot of goals coming from midfield (and potentially the attack);

Furman... only scored 6 in 30+ games playing at Bradford (who weren't the worst team in League 2).

Whittiker... I'm hoping won't play but if he does will only bring a couple of goals to the team.

Taylor and Smalley... never really been prolific enough for wingers.

Worthington... don't expect goals from his role.

Purdie... don't really know enough about him to comment.

Holdworth... a right back on the wing never works going forward.

Abbott... will score alot of goals if he stays fit but, personally, I'm not holding out much hope for him playing all season.

Parker... averages 1 goal every 5 games which will gve him about 10 league goals which I don't believe is enough for a striker.

O'Grady... couldn't hit a cow's backside with a banjo.

Byfield (if he signs)... could go either way.

If the goals tally this season follows what the players previous records have been then I believe we aren't going to score enough (coupled with how many we're looking like conceding) to push ourselves into the top half of the table.

It only takes a couple of players to show me I'm wrong, however, and who knows.

A bad start though and we could potentially find ourselves in a bit of trouble.

The problem with changing your team every week is that the players don't get into a rhythm and the team will become disjointed.

Also, say Penney does do this (which I don't think he will). The team suitable for playing the passing teams wins, say, 3-0 but the following game we're playing a hoof ball team. Do you change the team?

CM in a strong reserve/youth team is a bit different to CM in League One.

United reserves/youth would beat our first team.

Lee - wide midfield - defo

Why did United play him in CM then?

I'm sure they have a better idea than anyone of us.

It's true, but it does not mean to say he is going to miss that many games for us, what if it was a genuine injury?

That is not his record for his whole career, just that time.

 

And as Penney worked with him, then he will know.

Interestingly, there were training method rumours! We've been there!

 

Also it says he is 30, I thought everyone on here said he was 26?! Is he trying to be Joan Collins and being elusve about his age!

He is 32 on 2nd December according to the site I got this from.

 

 

 

Abbott setback riles Penney

11 Sep 2008 - 14:16:47

 

Abbott setback riles PenneyDarlington striker Pawel Abbott faces a further three months on the sidelines with an ankle ligament problem.

 

The 30-year-old has not featured in the Quakers first team so far this term and his long list of injury problems were rumoured to be linked with the club's training regime.

 

However, manager Dave Penney told the Evening Gazette: "It's a huge blow for Pav and the club, but I want to stress that his run of injuries are nothing to do with our training methods.

 

"None of them has been the result of physical contact. He's had knee, hamstring, Achilles injuries, among other strains, and has now damaged his ankle when running with the ball.

 

"We ban tackling in training, and if we're playing matches in training, we stop them if the physical contact becomes a risk.

 

"We haven't rushed him back, and took him to Aldershot last weekend to integrate him back into the squad. Then this happens in training this week."

Reading this makes it seem like he's injury prone... which is a bigger worry than if it had just been one long standing injury

ye but on that basis you could say the same about hughes with his injury, still was good for us, might have just had an unlucky couple of seasons

But Hughes scored 15+ last season. Abbott's not done that recently.