wiseowl

Strange world we live in. Whilst I agree with your general sentiment (oafc1955), why is it whenever someone expresses an opinion (sometimes valid) that doesn't agree with the majority of human sheep, they need to be removed from whatever platform? Free speech is fundamental to a democracy. We are turning into a communist state in many regards. I`ve decided to abandon all social media now - including here - it's just such an unbalanced place with little leftie cliques everywhere.

All donations are welcome, of course, but let's not get carried away with a donation of about £1600 from people with a combined net worth of circa £175m. It's the equivalent to someone with a net worth of £250,000 (i.e. equity on his house and savings etc) chipping in £2.26.

22 minutes ago, nzlatic said:

Where did I say that?

You didn't - I apologise. Teach me to skim read! 

3 hours ago, nzlatic said:

I find it a bit hypocritical to cite results and not performances when arguing that ST should have been kept on, but then also advocating for DU to have been sacked at the end of last season when he'd just delivered a 20+ game run of results that were top 3/4 standard.

 

I think the main thing though is we now have someone in who the majority of fans will feel confident in his ability to get us going in the right direction consistently.

I'll repeat again - I think MM is the man for the job now. Doesn't stop me from thinking ST/NR were very harshly treated - and I don't think that was down to their management of the team. They achieved an amazing turnaround from what had gone before. Happy to leave it now - the debate has been (generally) good - thank you.

2 hours ago, Monty Burns said:

MM couldnt save us or the players from listening to ourselves. but he's seen it and is now acting 'without emotion' as he says. but he defo has certain emotions, l can hear it in his voice.

 

Definitely. His interview after the Ebbsfleet debacle was very highly charged with emotion. Although he does a reasonable job of masking it.

2 hours ago, Dave_Og said:

 

So you'd definitely have kept ST/NR?.

2 hours ago, oafc1955 said:

6 games isn’t long enough to judge, neither is 8…..the decision to choose the next manager was the club’s, they chose Mellon….what point are you making?

Yes - I would have given ST/NR longer and I said so at the time - why wouldn't that have been a sensible move after the pair instantly "stopped the rot" and went 6 unbeaten? Not a bad footing on which to have given them the rest of the season was it?

The club took the decision to part ways - thereafter, I have no problem with the MM appointment. Hope that clarifies.

I think our "management" timings have been awful i.e. should have binned off DU at the end of last season and given a new manager time to implement ideas during the close season. Equally, don't chop and change too rapidly like we have this time in mid-season; just doesn't work.

Ultimately, I suspect "relationships" had far too much sway in a) the initial appointment of DU et al  b) the delay in sacking him/them and c) the subsequent premature binning of the unbeaten duo of ST/NR (and this left a bad taste for me).

It can't be denied that ST/NR got more out of this squad than anyone else - including MM to date. We'd never have got a Fylde or Ebbsfleet hammering under them, in my opinion. Most people are now accepting that MM needs fresh players in. Let's hope the money is found for that. I desperately want us to get out of this league ASAP because it's a bloody awful standard to watch. I also want the home attendance for the club to be maintained/improved and you can feel it starting to ebb away (this Sat's true attendance will be interesting).

I hope the right people are now making the right decisions, based on objective criteria.

13 hours ago, GlossopLatic said:

 

It is a small sample size though. But I do think breaking teams down at home is a problem for us, infact in preseason I did highlight this could be an issue for us.

 

We can also throw in home performances against Halifax Solihull and Dorking if we add those 3 under mellon then from those 6 winnable home games we've taken 3 points from a possible 18. Bread and butter games that promotion chasing teams find a way to win, by either smashing them to pieces, or if thats not possible beating them by the odd goal, either way they find a way to secure 3 points. 

 

I'm not convinced at all that Thompson and Redfearn had the answers here. I could put the form we showed  down to a post manager sacking bounce. Mellons C.V. is far superior to either of them when it comes to managing teams at this kind Ievel to promotion.

I did caveat regarding the small sample size (as you did regarding the home and away stats under MM). I don't have a problem with Mellon as it's obvious he is capable of managing. What I find baffling, though, is the view amongst many that ST/NR wouldn't have cut the mustard. We never sank to the depths of a Fylde away or an Ebbsfleet at home during their tenure, and really tightened up at the back. They went on an immediate unbeaten run after the DU debacle - and we sacked them!

People say to me (about ST/NR) "they only managed 6 games, so it's no reliable measure". Then in the next breath they are saying, "Mellon's only had 8 games - he needs more time."

Blatant double standards and I just cannot understand the ambivalence towards 2 fellas who brought us out of the dark ages.

1 hour ago, oafcmetty said:

Let it go

Let what go metty? Just pointing out what (I think) are interesting stats - on the back of some relevant stats posted by someone else. We are letting a lot more goals in - whilst scoring a little less. 

On 11/26/2023 at 9:01 AM, GlossopLatic said:

It's a very small sample size but in the 8 games (including the FA cup game against Newport) Mellon has taken charge our home and away form seems in contrast

 

Home P3 W0 D2 L1 

Away P5 W3 D0 L2

Right to raise it because it's gnawing at the back of the mind of many fans. Another interesting statistic (and also caveated with the small sample size) is that under Thompson/Redfearn we conceded 0.66 goals per game. Under MM we are conceding 2 goals per game. That's just over 3 times as many goals conceded, on average.

With regards to goals scored, on average, ST/NR come out at 1.83 and MM at 1.63 per game.

7 minutes ago, JoeP said:

 

Sounds about right - an expensive learning curve for Frank et al.

 

Mellon gets a free hit for me for at least the next year.  Not only does he have to deal with fan expectation, he's got to deal with the (albeit well intentioned) mistake in appointing Unsworth.

 

If we'd have stuck with Shez and given him no budget, I reckon we'd probably be in a not dissimilar position to where we are now - and had cash in the bank to spend!

I think if we'd stuck with Shez and given him a reasonable budget - we'd be in a far healthier position today.  Quote from the Oldham Times in July 2022 :-

Royle, who has been named as a director just over 40 years after his appointment as Oldham boss, says the immediate aim for the club is to "get out of this division".

And he is backing Sheridan to achieve it.

"We've got to get out of this division as soon as possible, and it's a hard division," said Royle.

"We can do it. John knows his stuff, he knows what he wants, which is important."

15 hours ago, JoeP said:

He talks sense..

 

Mellon On Defeat At Home - News - Oldham Athletic

He's seething there and quite emotional at times too. He knows we need rid of quite a few players and fresh ones in. Unfortunately, according to what I have been told before, the amount of money wasted on the "ex-Everton" experiment means purse strings are a lot tighter than they were. 

15 hours ago, simplythemostimportantkick said:

Another performance like that and you’ll deffo be boycotting?

I boycotted under DU because I could see from an early stage he was not a good manager. I was spot on. Persisting with him has knocked us back a year or two.

I don't think the same about MM - although I accept some performances under him have been as poor as many witnessed under DU (including yesterday's shambles).

Did I mention I was going to boycott ?

No, I said my overwhelming emotion after the game was one of sadness. There are a lot of MM doubters - because home performances have been average to very poor. I went to the last 2 away games and saw what we are capable of - and NEVER saw that under DU. 

My overwhelming emotion after today is one of sadness. Had we notched a victory - even a scruffy one and followed that up in the next 2 home games, we'd have been nicely poised AND KEPT THE ATTENDANCE ON PAR. I heard too many people saying today that they'd had enough of home games for a while - and that's a worry.

As poor a display as you'll see that today - utterly bewildering after Barnet. 

A lot of poor performances from individuals but midfield is still the glaring weakness. Honestly think we need 2 in there (and been saying it for a while, so not knee jerk). Not quite sure what Lundstram has brought to the party - plays the easy sideways or backward ball most of the time.

We also need Hobson's quality at the back - they ran through us with ease today.

16 hours ago, Dave_Og said:

Frank's last game before he sets off on his boat. Be nice to send him off with a smile 

Drove past Alexandra Park this morning - saw him doing his last practice session on the boating lake - good luck, Frank 

5 hours ago, Monty Burns said:

l got a bit misty eyed reading this asif it was one of my memories!!

Cheers Monty  When we thrashed West Ham 6-0 in the semi 1st leg (and Neil Adams ran Julian Dicks a merry dance) I got home to find I`d been burgled - seriously burgled. The thieves had used a van and took much of my furniture as well. The police, however, grew very suspicious of my report because I was pacing up and down and couldn't stop smiling. After a few minutes, the 2 officers looked me straight in the eye and one asked me why I seemed so happy following such a traumatic crime. My reply was, "We've just stuffed West Ham 6-0 mate in the first leg of the semi-final - who wouldn't be happy?!" I slept on my living room floor that night as the burglars had taken both my beds. Happy days indeed!

17 minutes ago, Frankly Mr Shankly said:

 

I'm confident of the play-offs, but we are a bad injury away from putting a huge hole in that. We're going to be quite reliant on Norwood and Gardner and an injury to either / both has the potential to derail us. We have to bve mindful of that and that the recent form has been largely - but not exclusively - down to their performances.

Agreed. Which is why they (and others) should be rested for the tinpot trophy. Couldn't bear the thought of some non-league clogger breaking Norwood's shin! 

10 minutes ago, Littlemoor Lad said:

They can't defend and it could be a Grave ending 

I see what you did there - very clever play on the placenames! 

17 hours ago, Tractors Passing Through said:

Here's the topic for what it's worth.     Some fans won't remember it but it actually happened and what a team you put together back then.     For some reason couldn't see any mention of it.      Sorry if this has gone through twice, there was a message when posting about 'server problems' or something.  

 

Today - tonight - is the anniversary of the   3 - 1   League Cup win over Arsenal.      34 years back in 1989, I don't know where the time goes to.     Was still at school back then but that season alone, Oldham made what the Final itself and took Manchester United to a replay in the other semi-final.      You very nearly made two domestic finals, and what with the promotion to the 1st division the year after, it's kind of nice to look back on times like that.   

 

Anyway that night in 1989 today, Oldham had players like Mike Milligan, Ritchie, Frankie Bunn, Ian Marshall, Olney was it, just names I can remember from that time and they were League Champions and what a night it was.    I bet (Latics) fans of a certain age can still be thrilled about what occurred that game.    Not only that you beat a good Leeds team over two games and West Ham  6 - 0  in the semi-final,  typing it out now it all comes flooding back the memories.     Joe Royle as manager, the plastic pitch, Oldham having the best two seasons of their history.    It were great, even for neutrals. 

 

Just wondered what people's memories of that Arsenal game were.     I know you'd do almost anything to go back and relive again those times and great Latics team, and while you can't, at least we can look back and say those results and teams really did happen.    For a while, it were great.       Maybe you won't reach those heights again but for those of us who were there and can look back and remember, it was a night and season of Oldham's history that was remarkable.     Really gave neutral fans a lift and wanted the team to do well.     Ok ?    Thanks.  

Spooky! I went to the Barnet game last night with an Arsenal fan who lives in Reading. I first met him on a course we were both on in 1989 and he came to BP for the game you have mentioned above (with 2 others). I took them to Chadderton Fish Bar before the game, where they were amazed (disgusted?!) to see Oldhamers having gravy on their fish, chips and peas! It was a great night and they couldn't believe how we spanked them (albeit on plastic of course). They had a soft spot for Latics thereafter and I stayed with them in Reading for the weekend before the Notts Forest final. We took in the Reading versus Bury match on the Saturday (with me in my Latics wembley top) before all 4 of us went to the final on Sunday. Very happy memories and as they waved me off on the coach from Victoria, they burst into several renditions of "Oooooooooooh Roger Palmer" in their southern accents. Superb stuff.

14 hours ago, League one forever said:

The consistency of performance is really starting to come good. As I’ve repeatedly said it would. . .

You have - fair play to you as I hadn't seen it. I went with an Arsenal fan last night (and sat amongst the Barnet fans) so it was an interesting perspective. He thought Barnet were comfortably the better team first half but thought our second half performance was excellent. Barnet fans generally were commenting how they had literally "fallen off a cliff" over the past 3 games (i.e. including ours) and that the inconsistency was so frustrating.

That's the key for us now; consistency (and keeping Norwood free of injury). Massive shout out for Fondop - many calling for him "never to play again", "he's a liability" etc. after his sending off in the Solihull home defeat. He was an absolute powerhouse last night - and impressed over a full game. 

I previously commented how we had initially regressed under MM (although I always supported and had faith in him getting it right). Glad to say he's proving to be a wily old soul. Great stuff - very well done indeed and I just hope we get an extra 1,000 or so on the next home gate and create a decent atmosphere (been missing lately at BP). The feel good factor is creeping back !

We must still acquire a reliable playmaker in midfield. People are now talking to me about how key Dan Gardner is. That shows how weak we are (creatively) in the middle. Sort that and, yes, the play-offs are achievable.

Use this purely as a competition to play the yoof team (if allowed?). If not, play as weak a team as possible and exit the thing ASAP. 

Can you imagine, for example, Norwood getting a serious injury partaking in this competition? Would cost us dearly.

Absolutely nothing to lose by blooding him in some way have we? Nobody is ripping up trees at the moment, so let's give young talent a chance.

1 hour ago, GlossopLatic said:

 

From the football side of things the focus should be promotion this season not building for the next one. If we miss out so be it we will deal with it and try and cone back bigger and stronger next season. We won't necessarily get a choice of when we go up we will have to take it at the first opportunity and if their is a chance this season I say we do everything we can to make it happen.

Agree. Get us out of this dire league. Weary of seeing only a few dozen away fans huddled on a terrace - just not conducive to creating a competitive atmosphere. Most teams are utter dross - still can't quite get my head around why we aren't beating them. We need a good run of form now to a) keep the fans on board numbers wise and b) get us into the play-offs.

36 minutes ago, Dave_Og said:

All that proves is that short term stats prove very little 

Whilst agreeing with the sentiment generally, that's probably part of the reason they kept hanging on with DU and why we are where we are now (i.e. "He will come good soon, not enough time to judge him etc.). Sometimes, it's blindingly obvious when someone is unsuited to a position. Whoever was responsible for his recruitment has probably knocked us back a couple of seasons regarding our development on the playing side. The real folly was in getting rid of him part way through a season (i.e. should have gone last season). Caused a lot of unsettlement within the squad and left MM with a bit of a mountain to climb. Unfortunately, most of the money for mountaineering equipment had already been spent.

28 minutes ago, JoeP said:

 

It is interesting how different people view it.  I thought passing-wise Saturday was the worst of the season in the first-half.  

Agree - having read many comments, it's  like 2 different games were played in alternate universes. Some were encouraged by what they saw as a pattern of play developing. Personally, thought we were tediously slow in trying to build anything and largely ineffective. Eastleigh had too much time to re-group and organise their lines. At times, our passing was atrocious and I thought Norwood had his worst game for us thus far. I think the flat atmosphere generally indicates there was precious little to shout about. Distinct improvement needed if we really are aiming for the play-offs. MM speaks well and I`m certain he knows what is required and will get us to where we need to be. We might have to re-assess the timeframe around that though (i.e. depending on funds available).