quark

Clearly, there is a lot of truth in this story. It all stems from one reporter, but that does not make it completely inaccurate. What is unfortunate is that it is all angled against Hughesy who was clearly involved in something but, from all the reports on this site, was not the instigator that the papers are making out - with his history, it is inevitable that stories will be written that way, however unfair that may be.

 

The club needs to issue a holding statement asap while it gets on with investigating the truth and then puts out a full statement along with the action that will be taken. If that involves fining, dropping and transfer listing one or more popular players, then I have no problem with that. What is being reported is shameful stuff and very damaging to the club. I hope that the club, however, will thoroughly investigate whether it is accurate that the management gave players two days off and allowed them out on the booze immediately before an important match and one in which the team produced a shambolic performance. It will be interesting to hear the board’s views of the management if that turns out to be accurate.

 

 

 

Shez points to the performances against Millwall and Leeds as a contrast to yesterday. But the fact is, after half-time at Millwall, we were completely outplayed and were every bit as much second best in midfield as we were yesterday. Very fortunate to take three points. Against Leeds, we fought hard and earned a point but they always looked a more quality team with much more danger coming from midfield than we can ever manage. Yesterday, we were hopeless. In none of those three matches have we looked like a promotion side and the only reason we are clinging on in the play-off zone is because we had that great run in the first six matches of the season.

 

Since the new year, our performances and results have been mediocre. Starting with the 5-0 defeat at Hereford, we have got 13 points from the last 11 matches and failed to score in six of them. This is closer to relegation form than promotion. And it all goes back to the manager, in my opinion. I believe we have a good enough squad to gain promotion. But good players are playing badly and young players are not being developed as they should. Shez is no doubt a good spotter of talent, but as a tactician he is poor with no apparent idea how to blend a team. It is for that reason that I think his time is up.

 

 

 

 

good evening quark...what was the away support ..and was there any bother

I would say 300-350. No trouble I saw.

Just got back to my laptop after being at the match. A fantastic finish today of course, but once the euphoria began to wear off, I had to admit we were a bit lucky to get three points. We were well on top in the first half but there was only one team in it for most of the second half. Once it got to 2-2, I really expected us to lose, Millwall were so much in control. But we started to make a chance or two in the last 10 minutes and the winning goal was a cracker. In fact all three goals came from excellent crosses with Taylor’s a really brave close-in header and Hughes’s quite beautifully taken.

 

Taylor was our outstanding player for me; so dangerous every time he had the ball. Hazell had a fine match and Maher was impressive – some faults but it is hard to see on this showing why he gets dropped. Kabba looked a potential asset – pace, good control and an eye to play others in.

 

But overall, we still do not look impressive enough. Even when we were on top, too many high balls were being hoofed forward as our main line of attack and once Millwall came back we seemed unable to win the ball in midfield or hold on to it when we did. I think they would be very disappointed to have got nothing out of it. Our big test will come on Monday night – win that and I will believe we can do something.

 

I look through the squad and feel that a high percentage of them could do a job in the Championship (of the 11 starters last night, I'd say only Budtz, Whitaker and Windass might not have next season at a higher level in them - but based on the 90 minutes last night, none of them showed the commitment needed to do it at a higher level).

 

I look through the squad and feel that we should be comfortably in the top two in this division.

 

I look through the squad and see depth, ability and under achievement.

 

I look to the bench and see a manager who doesn't get the best out of the players at his disposal.

This is as sensible a post as I have seen on this board today. We have a strong squad and some skilful players, but the management simply does not seem to know how to utilise their strengths to create a consistent team. I am not one for changing managers easily but the time seems to be coming rapidly. With proper motivation and consistent team selection, the present players would give us a real prospect of promotion. We are only going to achieve that, I fear, with a different man in charge.

 

If promotion did happen, that would bring its own problems. Our attendances, by Championship standards, are pitiful (we are in the top five after all, which should be some incentive to come) so there would be an expectation of further investment from TTA. I agree the three players picked out above would not have a future at that level, but other areas of the team would need to be strengthened if we were to compete - we would need a creative midfielder for one thing, and although Gregan and Hazell work fine in League One, the lack of pace there would certainly catch us out in the Championship.

After almost three years of Shez, we have good individual players but are no nearer producing a TEAM. We never play the same line-up two matches running. Loanees are preferred to good players. No wonder it is a shambles. Shez is a good spotter of talent but an inadequate manager. Yes, he’s gonna go.

Alessandra and Smalley haven't been given the opportunity to develop on their efforts from last season. They have both been undermined by some bewildering loans / team selections when they were two of the players who nearly got us there in the second half of last season. The failure to bring these two on in 2008/9 is close to neglect.

 

I think Shez has shown this season that he hasn't got the talent to take a decent side that extra step. I give him until May to sort it out. I then give TTA the task of replacing him appropriately should he fail.

Good to see the first point being made. It must be disheartening for the youngsters to see a management policy which implies that there is no confidence in them - players such as Ormerod and Windass are preferred who obviously have ability and experience but are patently lacking match fitness and coming to the end of their careers. If we were to get promotion, then talented young players such as Alessandra and Smalley are just the ones to blossom at a higher level. I cannot help but feel that Shez always feels more comfortable with an older player who has done it elsewhere.

I also agree with your second point that I have picked out above. Shez appears to be able to spot good players but not have the nous to develop a consistent team. He is now in his third season as manager. TTA have given him the financial backing to sign the players he wanted and we undoubtedly began the season with a squad good enough to make the play-offs at least. If we do not even achieve that, then whatever Shez’s abilities, it will be time for a change.

Two cracking matches. West Ham were probably the best team in the country at that point, but we fought back brilliantly in the first match after that freak goal (wonder what modern message-boarders would have had to say about that?) and missing a penalty all in the first 15 minutes. Went down for the replay and after Pennington’s goal (direct from a free-kick, the only goal he ever scored for the Latics, I think) West Ham did not get their winner until very late. We had a really good team then but a poor manager - with the right man, we would have gone up. On the other hand, that would have meant Ken Bates staying on with the club....

 

Lomax has played most of his games for Latics at left back.

 

Most of those games he has given what I would describe as a solid performance. I don't see him being a first choice player in a higher league, but he has shown that he can hold his own at this level.

 

Rarely getting past the half way line, rarely overlapping Taylor - there are gaps in his game. But still, until recently, solid.

 

Remember, this is the guy who passed the ball neatly between two Everton midfielders at Goodison Park seconds before Gary McDonald swung a leg at it just before half time. His ball to Byfield at Crewe was brilliant - that put us 1-0 up too.

 

Recent performances have seen sides put him under pressure and he hasn't handled it well. What have the coaching staff been doing with him during this time? How has the manager looked to rebuild his confidence?

 

At the moment the lad will know he's not playing well, scored an own goal recently and that the manager is looking to buy a full back to replace him. It's hardly building him back up is it?

 

 

 

As for Eardley, while there have been defensive lapses I think a lot of the stick he gets is based on potential shown over the previous two seasons not developing as fast as we'd have liked. He was instrumental in the win over Hartlepool. A terrific attacking force against Scunthorpe. And given that we have only lost 5 games all season it's not often we lose a match because of him.

 

In Lomax we have someone who can do us a job at this level given the right backing from fans and coaching staff. I agree he will never be Roberto Carlos but then I don't expect that at this level. As for Eardley, if I was him I'd get the hell out of the club as soon as possible. He's a player who, despite not having a fantastic season, can do a job for any team in this division and many in the Championship. He's a lot better than the stick he gets suggests.

 

Time for the coaching staff to pull their fingers out and address these issues.

 

Time for fans to look in the mirror and decide if they want to support the team or destroy it with excessive criticism during matches.

Intelligent, accurate assessment. It is bizarre that the good young players who come up through the club tend to be the ones who come in for the most mindless criticism on this site (Taylor last season, Smalley frequently, Eardley all the time). You make a number of good points, not least that Eardley should get away as soon as possible to a Championship club with quality coaching that would bring out the very best in him.

 

Looked to me like it was written by reading reports from the sundays, the commentary and the "live text".

 

Did they actually send a reporter?

The name on it was Tony Bugby. So where was Yarwood? Is last week’s thread about him leaving the Chron correct?

 

And I agree, a poor report.

Bob Ledger back in the 60s.

 

He also played on both wings, at full back, centre forward and midfield.

It was in a home cup-tie against Notts County when David Best was injured. And he did not let one in. Ledger, I am certain, was the only player ever to appear in all 11 positions for the Latics. Very popular with the 60s fans - he won the club’s first ever Player of the Year vote.

We could have crumbled and lost the game, but we didn't and how many times would we have bounced back last season? Our strengths, mentality and stamina wise, are looking good. A draw would have been taken before the game, that's what we got and we are still top.

You are absolutely right. I cannot understand why people get negative at the first sign of a problem. We are playing excellent football, scoring more goals than anyone in the division and we have the mental strength to match anyone. That three-goal blast today could have finished us off. Instead, we came back and could have won - and don’t forget we came back from two goals down against Millwall and Colchester. There is real steel in this team. For the first time since the Dowie play-off season, I genuinely feel we have a promotion side.

Since I could not make the match, I was going to send money to the fund. Just seen that match programmes are up on eBay. Seller says all money goes to Ernie. I would happily send my donation that way and get a programme which I would like to have. Can anyone confirm that the seller is genuine? I imagine this is OK, but I would like to be sure. Since I was intending to pay well over the £2 asking price, the last thing I want is to give the money to some chancer.

Culled this morning from a Scottish sports agency’s files:

 

GRETNA goalkeeper Greg Fleming is being chased by Oldham. The Scotland Under-21 shotstopper is wanted by Motherwell and Morton this summer. But the English League One play-off hopefuls are set to swoop. Fleming will be offered a three-year deal and is expected to try his luck in England.

 

No idea how accurate this is.

Maybe gifted was too strong a word, but he did most the net wide open for the third.

Personally, I thought it just a well-placed shot but this is no big deal. I think I was really reacting to your point because I am irritated at such an inexperienced lad being exposed like this in the first place. We have been without senior cover in goal for much of the season. Sheridan has publicly said he does not think Bell is ready so the management really should have lined up an experienced stand-in for Crossley long before the situation became a crisis. No way are we ever going to be a top-six side if on the run-in to th end of the season, we gamble on the fitness of a 38-year-old veteran.

Gifted Luton a goal last Saturday

Which one was that? The one where a striker turned Hazell at close range? The penalty for a foul by Hazell? Or the one where Eardley misjudged and gave the scorer a clear run in and time to pick his spot?

 

Give the kid a chance.

Credit has to go to Deane Smalley though. The only guy in a tangerine shirt who looked hungry. Never gave up, kept hassling and deserved a goal.

 

I agree that he was MOM by a distance. If only he had had any support. Constantine was IMO our worst player.

 

Feel that Stam should also be picked out for praise. In the first half shambles, his skilful reading of situations and interventions saved us from even worse.

 

Thompson looked decent, Taylor worked hard but ineffectively, Lomax not bad. Goalie looked raw but could not be blamed for any of the goals. Eardley’s distribution was not good, I agree, but he worked his socks off throughout the match having no midfield cover in front of him. Midfield was the biggest problem even before Jarrett was subbed.

Eric Gemmell was one of my early heros when I was a kid. I saw him score those seven goals, but he was not just a good goal scorer - he was a real old fashioned centre forward who led the line and was skilful at playing in others. And he was a good cricketer - played as a professional, I think, in the leagues for Levenshulme or Longsight.

Thank god for a bit of sense. I cannot believe some reactions on the board. Time was that seeing two of our players – one of them home-grown – selected for an international squad would have been an occasion to be proud instead of just giving people a chance to slag them both off.

 

The fact is that this season was always going to be iffy. We lost three key members of the play-off side when Wellens, Porter and Haining went and no one could have expected things to gel together as well as they have done for much of the season, albeit with a couple of good loan players. Like most people – and I am sure that includes Shez – I am dismayed that no reinforcements have arrived in January. Anyone signed now in the final couple of days will look like a panic buy, but it is still crucial that we get someone on board who can give us a cutting edge by getting good balls into the box. A David Eyres figure would presumably too much to hope for. But with proper service, I am convinced Hughes and Davies both have the ability to score a bundle of goals at this level.

I had forgotten the ‘Its hell with Groves‘ sticker - brilliant. Not sure whether that came first or the name of his boutique in Hollins Road which was called ‘Enfer With Alan Groves’ - using the French word for hell was considered a bit odd around Hollins way where I lived.

 

His amazing ability to go round a fullback has been well described but do not forget another trick at which he excelled - winning crucial free kicks. He was a genius at drawing the defender into a tackle, pushing the ball past him at the last minute and then going over the outstretched leg. Never failed to get a free kick or even a penalty. I remember him doing it twice in a vital night match against York the season we won the old Third Division. York were fellow promotion contenders, went ahead early and spent all night time-wasting. Grovesy’s brilliant falling over act won us a free kick which produced a goal and then a penalty, both converted by the unfailing left boot of Maurice Whittle. 2-1 win, thanks to the great man.

 

If it is any help for Dan Turner’s article, I still have a copy of the programme the Latics produced for a benefit match staged after Grovesy died to help out his teenage widow Debbie. I would be happy to lend it or send photocopies if you would like to see it, Dan.

Why dignify this libellous rubbish by reproducing it on this site? I was delighted to sign up with OWTB to get away from reading this kind of moronic, ignorant outburst. We all know that if Hughes had signed for Millwall, the same writer would instead have been defending him in the same mindless fashion.

 

My respect for Hughes grows by seeing the way in which he manages to handle the regular abuse. By now we should not be having to repeat the fact that he has served his sentence for a despicable offence and is entitled to the same treatment as any other ex-con - that is, a chance to rebuild his life and earn a living. It is unfortunate that as a professional footballer, he will never be able to escape this kind of idiot.

 

His performance today, particularly the superbly taken third goal, prove that he has so much still to offer to the game. It is morally right that a club, whether the Latics or whoever, should have given him the chance to continue his career.

I am down in Kent but there in spirit. Good luck, stick it to them.

The great Bob Ledger. The only man, as far as I know, to play in every position for the Latics. A surprisingly forgotten figure considering that when the club had its first ever Player of the Year poll in about 1966, Ledger won by a mile.

Name? Vernon

 

 

Location? Kent

 

 

How Long Supporting the Tics? 59 years (honest!)

 

 

Best away match you've been to? Littlewoods Cup quarter-final at Southampton 1990 . Drew 2-2 but a great performance and the night I began to believe fot the first time that we really could get to Wembley.

 

 

All Time Greatest Player? Bob Ledger

 

 

Biggest Rivals (in your eyes)? Man U