League one forever

Come on Guy. The bottom line is, the players it would seem have no interest in playing for him at the minute. The players will ultimately be the ones who get us promoted, Mellon nor the fans can start a war with them. Otherwise we really are in big trouble. Mellon says- if you can’t change the player change the player. Then says - it’s really difficult because of the contracts. Which illustrates the point perfectly. He might as well say- I’ve tried, but they’re all shit, but I can’t move them on so god knows what will happen.

I agree with you from a professional pride point of view, it should be the case. But it’s just not the reality. There will be contracted players in that squad next season who we can’t shift and have been told they’re not good enough this season. If you were brought in to play after that- would you be at your best? The best case scenario is those players are at a minimum and aren’t involved in the match day squad. The worst case scenario is we still need some of them, because the budget won’t allow their replacement. Whatever happens in the summer, he needs to sit down with some players still here and make sure they’re on side. Otherwise they’ll just Jack it in again when things get tough, or he tell them some home truths.

A lot of this squad will be here next season, they will put it in for Mellon next season after he’s said they’re not good enough?

While I like his honesty- there does feel like a bit of retrospective arse covering Joe. These players that are so bad, had us 5th. They had top 3 form for a while. They had the best away form in the league for weeks on end. We didn’t hear any of this in Jan or early Feb. Did he perform a miracle from Oct to Feb?? I’m not having that a lot of them are now suddenly shit. He says he’s not above criticism, but doesn’t like direct questioning of his methods. . he has to reflect and ask why they’ve down tools on him. Because that’s exactly what’s happened, they don’t look interested. Remember - You do not have to be good to finish 7th. The worry is, he wheels and deals but the scars of this season and his approach with the players are still there. At no point can you sack a squad. The players will always win. If they stick with him, I think it could take two years to sort- and I don’t think the fanbase will have the stomach for it.

You’re right it shouldn’t happen. . . But it happens all the time at clubs, players don’t like the manager or style or how he talks to them, they down tools. Who knows what’s happened on the dressing room- but when you’re the manager comes out and publicly says a lot of them aren’t good enough- I think you can safely say there’s trouble in the camp.

It’s very good point. The players keep hearing variations of - you’re not good enough- yet had us 5th in the table. Maybe they’ve grown tired of keep hearing they’re not good enough, and have downed tools.

You didn’t. I did- I was giving an example of how long we may wait with your expectations, and the unrealistic nature of not expecting anything to happen in the first two years. Eh? Neither are you, and yet you talk in absolute terms of how a football club works - when in reality you have no idea. I’ve never claimed to know- I can only go what off DR says in public at fans forums, to OASF, to the pod - you then look and see how that affects what happens on the pitch. Which is our only barometer. So of course I’m looking at what happens on the pitch- it’s the sole reason why we bother supporting them. No, sorry- a new owner does exactly that. Football is a very small world, and word very quickly gets out that Oldham have money - don’t seem to remember us struggling to give Scunthorpe 100k for nuttall and pay him good wages and deal with his agent. Agents will be falling over themselves to offer us players, why - because we pay good money, our recruitment and length of contract tell you that. Our scouting network was sorted in the first few months, and has produced nothing. Our coaching set up below first team is very good with muzza and chucks doing a great job with the youth. So that doesn’t wash. I actually think we’re agreed here. Mellon needs to take responsibility for his part, but he is not solely responsible for the mess we find ourselves in and it needs everybody The Rothwells - DR - the board - Mellon in the summer to tell some home truths.

Agreed, it felt like a watershed moment didn’t it. He said a lot of stuff there that can’t go back in the bottle. Don’t know what you think, but it felt to me like he was challenging the board - as if to say, it’s either me or them. Back me or sack me.

I disagree. When you wipe a company’s debt, give it multiple new staff and give it a very large cheque to move forward with - you want to see that business get results/ make improvements after two years. What you don’t say is, don’t worry - I don’t expect anything for 5 - 10 years. What you allude to is the micro, what I am talking about is the macro. Recruitment, player profile and age, sell on value, contracts given, youth pathway- we have failed miserably. Furthermore all this ‘normalcy of business’ doesn’t happen at a lot of other clubs. Strange that. You’re going to extremes again to validate your narrative. . . no one is saying torch it all. It’s a lot more simple than that- and Mellon has started the ball rolling with that interview. Since Frank came in - the football operation has been and is a mess. Not because of what they inherited, but because they‘ve made poor decisions in the last two years alone. This is on DR, the board, and Mellon, - not to say sack them- but to say they have done a poor job and it needs addressing asap. As Mellon says some very honest conversations need to happen.

In his post match interview he's pretty much saying what we are Spot on. He’s saying it’s a mess, and he doesn’t escape criticism. Seems pretty bang on to me.

There shouldn’t be a lot to fix. . . Frank fixed the legacy nearly two years ago. We have one of the highest gates. We have one of the best budgets. But since Frank came in - decision after decision on the football side has been woeful. That’s nothing to do with Chris Moore, Simon Corney, or AL. There are clubs far far worse of than us, who manage their football much better. The culture of excuse has to stop, and people at the club need to take accountability and fans need to stop looking to blame things that happened years ago.

I actually loved that. No hidden messages, no skirting around the edges. Just saying it as it is, and start those honest conversations need to happen asap.

Fair enough. I talking about the much wider issues, not some our fans - who I agree shout / scream absolute bollocks at times.

As is any lacking any fair and/or balanced critical eye over things. For every fanatical ‘everything is shit fan’ there is a fanatical ‘everything will come good/what you whinging about’ fan. You will never say, this isn’t good enough, or question why. You will always find a reason an excuse for why things aren’t going well. The whole football operation is badly run, you can dress it up how you want but the decision making speaks for itself.

Agreed Bosh. It’s not just Mellon. ( Who is now under big pressure for his part) The whole football operation has been really poor for two seasons, and the evidence reflects that. After all the money spent, we’re left an underperforming bloated and hugely imbalanced squad. If I was Frank or the family I’d be asking questions of everybody on the football side- not just Mellon.

Agreed Joe. Said this a few weeks ago.

Yeah I saw that- when Dave asked him. Think they might’ve upset him when they said on socials that he walked out of post match presser without taking their questions. Don’t think he likes questions that aren’t the - generic - easy to bat way stuff he gets from Alan.

Spot on.

Or some fans are - to quote Mellon ‘looking with their eyes’ The contradictions here are baffling. We have 6 centre backs. No right back No cover for Kitch We have 7 strikers One wide player. The reasoning is - Stats are used to gather information on required players and then passed to the manager. . . Ok. . . So, it can only be one of one two things then, either the stats are passed onto the manager for players in positions we already have, (and weirdly it doesn’t produce stats for right backs) or the manager is requesting players in positions we already have and the board keep sanctioning it. That isn’t guesswork- just look at the squad dynamic- it’s a mess. We then have Mellon changing his tune from saying - We have to respect the money the family have spent, and get the best out of what we’ve got. (Which he did to be fair, it’s gone downhill since he made the signings) To I know what a good player looks like. We don’t have a right back. (Despite signing a RWB for his preferred shape at that time) We’ll have to wheel and deal in the summer. The football operation - which means, how we scout and recruit, profile and age of player, sell on value, youth coming through- has all been poor. It really needs addressing this summer, and it needs to start with some acceptance that the club have spunked a lot of money for very little return.

I totally agree with that. It’s really hard with Mellon because to be fair to him he is a scapegoat at times for what has been a poor football operation for the last two seasons. On the flip side- he knew the squad dynamic when he came in. He knew it was lopsided, and he has been given 7 chances to make some changes and it hasn’t really worked so far. He repeatedly said when he came in, that he had to respect the money that the family have already spent, and now is stating how difficult the summer will be. (I think he’s right on that score) I wonder whether he’s the right manager at the wrong time. If he had come in after shez, it would be very interesting to see what squad we had now. Whereas after the Unsy debacle he’s hamstrung, and ultimately that affects results . . but rightly or wrongly fans won’t look at the bigger picture if he isn’t winning.

If results allow them that opportunity. . He gets this summer, if things don’t approve to agreed expectations he and shouldn’t get another window. Of his signings I’d say. Stones was class. Garner/Hammond/Conlon have been a mixture of ok/shown glimpses. Walker Dallas Sav haven’t worked out. One belter out of seven isn’t great, and as 55 says the ratio of good to ok to bad will need to really improve.

Doesn’t that apply to any clutch of signings at anytime? There’s nothing to suggest that signing in the summer will mean more of them work. I’d say if you sign any group of players, a couple do really well, a couple do ok, and a couple don’t work out.

Give over. I’m challenging your point- on a football forum. I have no interest in winding you or anyone up, or tripping people up. That would be sad. I do enjoy talking Latics and I come back to what people type - it’s called debate, and if you read my last post I agreed with you on a couple of points. When I didn’t agree, I said why. Fine. I think we should be further along in lots of different ways on the football side by now, but we’ll agree to disagree. Nope. What I do is follow results, and when we’re winning- I’m delighted. I even defend poor football and very poor home form if overall he’s doing well- which he was. When we can’t buy a win I start to question why- which is completely normal. Did you actually read my last post? I specifically said - this isn’t a sack Mellon thing. I haven’t ‘condemned him’ or thrown my toys out about him for treading water. I said it’s a reflection on what I see as a poor football operation and Mellon is only a part of that. I then went onto say I hope they have a meeting in the summer to clear the air or reset. Never claimed to be wise, nor trying to be clever, that’s a cheap shot. I think recruitment has been largely poor since they came in, you don’t. Fine. Agreed, and I do think he will be restricted by what has been a poor football operation. Hopefully he can wheel and deal.

I was talking about Southend- and how they done well in difficult circumstances, and how we have done poorly in good circumstances. You then said ‘you don’t think our board had it shit with the chuckle brothers’ if that isn’t comparing then what it is? If you’re not interested in Southend, and what can be achieved on a fraction of what we have- just ignore my post? You say this. Then this. (Which I agree with) No manager can build anything if results don’t meet expectation. He has said himself his target was the playoffs. He hasn’t don’t it. So far he’s failed- he might yet come good. Let’s hope so. Eh? It was all we talked about. Unsworth - Why no right back. Why no cover for Kitch. Why no wide players other than green. Why do we keep signing strikers when we are short in midfield. Do we need 6 centre backs. Mellon. Why no cover for Kitch. Why no wide players. Why sign a rwb for 3-5-2 then say he doesn’t have a right back. Why did we sign Garner You may agree or disagree with the above but plenty were questioning the at times nonsensical recruitment decisions. I’m very fair in my expectations- 7th this season without promotion was solid progress. I don’t think that’s unreasonable or being impatient. 12th to 10th is not solid progress, it’s treading water for a club with our budget.

Poor comparison. Our owners moved us away from what Southend are still going through. . . The equivalent to Southend and Maher would be AL still being here and someone like Pete wild doing great job in horrible circumstances. Both our last two managers work for fabulous owners and a settled club. On your last paragraph - I wasn’t make a sack him point. Mellon is just a moving part in what has been a poor football operation for two seasons. Board decisions. Recruitmemt. Player performance. In my view things are disjointed on the football operation. With lots of contradictions. I hope in the summer there is a big meeting between the family, the board, Mellon, and senior players to hold each other to account and have some honest conversations about where mistakes have been made.