Stadium Redevelopment and Oldham Council

[danoafc]

I'll be posting something elsewhere too nearer the time, but this is also a good time to remind people that the majority of the residents who were against the development are in Royton South. One of the two councillors who was at the forefront of the residents' rabble rousing was Phil Harrison. It just so happens that it is Harrison's seat that is up for election on May 1st.

 

For those Latics fans who live/vote in Royton South, this election is your opportunity to vote Harrison out. But please don't waste your time by voting Conservative. To get rid of Harrison, vote for Diane Williamson, Liberal Democrat. I'm not just saying this - she has a genuine chance of ousting Harrison, and few extra votes from Latics fans might just do the trick.

 

I cannot make any promises on Diane's behalf with respect to how she might view the development herself. As a good councillor, she would be obliged to take on board the concerns of locals. However, better a fresh start with someone new than re-electing someone who we know has 'form' against the club.

 

Garcon, perhaps you can help with this. This is a genuine question as I honestly can't remember, but weren't the Lib Dems involved in a reasonably big way in the Sportspark 2000 proposal going tits up? I don't knwo why I have this in my head, whether it's based in fact or on something I once read or heard (and lets face it, it can't all be true can it).

 

If anybody else has any 'facts' on this I'd be happy to hear from them.

 

Cheers

 

Dan

[jataal07]

I'll keep this simple for you.

 

If you feel that a Councillor has represented your views well - vote for them.

If you feel that they voted in a manner that opposes your stance - vote for someone else.

 

If you vote for someone because you known them and because they have been on the council a long time, then you are wasting your vote my friend.

 

If the future of professional sport in Oldham is something that you feel is important for us and also future generations, then get rid of the politicians who fill these posts - regardless of how long they have been allowed to get away with mis-representing their voters.

 

For the record, "the ground was always going to be passed second time round" is a pathetic comment. Tell that to Brighton and Hove Albion fans.

 

as tempted as I am not to reply to such an arrogant, condescending post, I feel I must come back on a couple of points.

 

Firstly, without knowing me please dont say things like "ill keep it simple for you", i could quite easily find that very offensive.

 

If Cllr Harrison wasnt representing his voters by representing them at the planning meetings, what was he doing? The people of Royton South approached him with their concerns etc, he acted on this, ok, even if you dont agree with him, he cannot be accused of mis-representing his constituents surely? So, if he was representing his voters (of which i am not one, as i live in a different area of Oldham), surely i wouldnt be wasting my vote if i could vote for him?

 

Finally, when did i say it was general comment about it being passed 2nd time round?i made no mention of B&H Albion. I was being specific to Oldhams case. I knew, as many others also suspected, it would get passed 2nd time.

[garcon]

dan, the Sportspark 2000 thing often gets raised in that context.

 

The truth is, the legally binding covenant on Clayton Playing Fields killed the project, and that would have happened with or without Lib Dem support.

[leeslover]

dan, the Sportspark 2000 thing often gets raised in that context.

 

The truth is, the legally binding covenant on Clayton Playing Fields killed the project, and that would have happened with or without Lib Dem support.

I can’t remember off the top of my head who it was, but quite a few of us got a letter back off a Lib Dem Cllr during the application saying that he was a bit fed up of the assumption that the Council do nowt for the club, and saying that it was the Lib Dems who were behind Sportpark.

[Rick]

as tempted as I am not to reply to such an arrogant, condescending post, I feel I must come back on a couple of points.

 

Firstly, without knowing me please dont say things like "ill keep it simple for you", i could quite easily find that very offensive.

 

If Cllr Harrison wasnt representing his voters by representing them at the planning meetings, what was he doing? The people of Royton South approached him with their concerns etc, he acted on this, ok, even if you dont agree with him, he cannot be accused of mis-representing his constituents surely? So, if he was representing his voters (of which i am not one, as i live in a different area of Oldham), surely i wouldnt be wasting my vote if i could vote for him?

 

Finally, when did i say it was general comment about it being passed 2nd time round?i made no mention of B&H Albion. I was being specific to Oldhams case. I knew, as many others also suspected, it would get passed 2nd time.

 

If you find someone disagreeing with your views and responding in a direct manner "very offensive", I suggest that you keep your views to yourself. I in no way apologise for tone of my reply.

 

Nobody can please all the people all of the time and this is why no-one has ever won a seat by 100% of the vote - so my statement stands.

 

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone else's

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone because you know them personally

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone who representents a political party (that you always have and always will vote for - regardless).

 

The right to democracy in this country was fought for and I find your attitude to voting extreemly disappointing.

 

I am also very disapponted with your attitude about the stadium plans. I am in no doubt whatsoever, that if there was not the massive public show of support for the plans (including the march), the proposals would have been kicked out at the second attempt.

[jataal07]

If you find someone disagreeing with your views and responding in a direct manner "very offensive", I suggest that you keep your views to yourself. I in no way apologise for tone of my reply.

 

Nobody can please all the people all of the time and this is why no-one has ever won a seat by 100% of the vote - so my statement stands.

 

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone else's

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone because you know them personally

Vote for someone who you feel represents YOUR views - not someone who representents a political party (that you always have and always will vote for - regardless).

 

The right to democracy in this country was fought for and I find your attitude to voting extreemly disappointing.

 

I am also very disapponted with your attitude about the stadium plans. I am in no doubt whatsoever, that if there was not the massive public show of support for the plans (including the march), the proposals would have been kicked out at the second attempt.

 

the reason i found it offensive was because of the implication that as i put my view across, i am somehow "simple". i have never and will never find anyone disagreeing with me offensive, as you correctly state, that right to democracy was fought long and hard.

 

also, i never actually said cllr harrison pleases all of the people all of the time, i was merely stating the fact that he represented the first group of his electorate who approached him.

 

my attitude to voting? by saying that somebody who has been in a job for the best part of 20 years cant be that bad, i am not saying that i would vote for him because i know him.

 

and lastly, the reason i am so confident the plans would be passed second time is that a close member of my family was on the planning comittee, and the public show of support, although impressive and worthy, did not impact on his/her decision, it was purely down to dialogue from both sides after the first meeting. (apologies, i should probably have declared this interest earlier)

[Guest oa_exile]

.....and lastly, the reason i am so confident the plans would be passed second time is that a close member of my family was on the planning comittee, and the public show of support, although impressive and worthy, did not impact on his/her decision, it was purely down to dialogue from both sides after the first meeting. (apologies, i should probably have declared this interest earlier)

 

............... so are you on here as a Latics fan or just having a nosey to see if your "Close family members dialogue" will reap him some votes from Latics fans ?

Just wondering , since I now know that the support I showed to OAFC and that fine day was for nothing as it was already a forgone conclusion after the first meeting , according to you of course.

[Rick]

the reason i found it offensive was because of the implication that as i put my view across, i am somehow "simple". i have never and will never find anyone disagreeing with me offensive, as you correctly state, that right to democracy was fought long and hard.

 

also, i never actually said cllr harrison pleases all of the people all of the time, i was merely stating the fact that he represented the first group of his electorate who approached him.

 

my attitude to voting? by saying that somebody who has been in a job for the best part of 20 years cant be that bad, i am not saying that i would vote for him because i know him.

 

and lastly, the reason i am so confident the plans would be passed second time is that a close member of my family was on the planning comittee, and the public show of support, although impressive and worthy, did not impact on his/her decision, it was purely down to dialogue from both sides after the first meeting. (apologies, i should probably have declared this interest earlier)

 

I appreciate the declaration of interest which is what I was fishing for in the first place.

 

This is a football message board and not a political canvassing medium. I believe that the right to vote and proper use of such right is vital in developing this country into a place where we all feel that we get an equal voice in shaping the way we are governed. Therefore comments about how you have always voted for one particular political party and always will whilst never considering other parties' policies does not sit well with me - particularly when you consider that there are many young people who read and partake in these forums.

 

I have my own political preferences and there are parties that I would never ever vote for, but I have voted for different parties in different elections - all depending on who I feel will best represent my views. I suppose you could say that I agree with democracy in its purest form, but abhor the party political system that we have manufactured.

 

I am sure that your family member would have amended their vote at the second chance as you have stated, but still think that to believe that the decision of the committee as a whole would have been overturned without the mass of voter power displayed a little naive.

 

On a last note while we are on politics. A friend of mine once gave me this sentence which (for me) sums up the deficiency of democracy as a whole.

 

 

"Representation only means the denial of participation"

 

 

Food for thought methinks.

[jataal07]

was half way through typing a response to oa_exile's post and deleted it in error (it was quite war and peace so wont be typing it again!) - will teach me to post on here and work at the same time!

 

apologies for implying the march was a waste of time, i admire displays of unity such as this.

 

exile - i am on here as an oldham fan. dont assume its a "he" i am related to, all i will state is that its not either cllrs harrison or bashforth, but wont be saying who it is!

 

rick - you are right, it was incorrect of me to state the whole of the committee's decision was over-turned for whatever reason without knowing all of them. i dont think i did say that explicitly, but i can see how the post could read like that.

 

also, if it has come across like i am canvassing, fair enough i hold my hands up and apologies unreservedly, i would never wish to influence anybody unduely, i dont think i have done this but again, with this being written text, any message can be taken in any context by different people. i am glad that the cllr i am related to doesnt do door to door canvassing anymore, only leaflets, because i value my personal safety far too much! and also i hate being jumped by people on my way to work asking me to donate to charities/sign petitions etc.

 

i agree in certain respects with your dislike of the party systme as it is - forcing people as we seem to do in so many walks of life to be a part of something rather then encourage individual thought, but thats a discussion for another thread in another part of the forum (and ive just finished my work for this evening so ill be logging off for a beer shortly)

 

i do consider other parties policies it just so happens that 99/100 times my feelings/beliefs tie in with the party i chose to vote for. i replied to this thread not to influence other people but to reply to ill-informed comments such as "trying to kill the club", or the accusation that cllrs dont care/are only in it for the money - in the case of the person i am related to, seeing the amount of time they spend on council business (again - im not speaking for all cllrs but the ones i know seem to be the same) it is far from a case of "in it for the money".

 

summing up (because im knackered and i want that beer!), apologies for any misunderstanding and rick - im sure we could have a bloody good discussion about the rights and wrongs of the political system etc etc, its refreshing to see a well composed response on this board, the majority just seem to mock, insult etc, im sure we would disagree and agree on numerous points - no hard feelings!

[Rick]

was half way through typing a response to oa_exile's post and deleted it in error (it was quite war and peace so wont be typing it again!) - will teach me to post on here and work at the same time!

 

apologies for implying the march was a waste of time, i admire displays of unity such as this.

 

exile - i am on here as an oldham fan. dont assume its a "he" i am related to, all i will state is that its not either cllrs harrison or bashforth, but wont be saying who it is!

 

rick - you are right, it was incorrect of me to state the whole of the committee's decision was over-turned for whatever reason without knowing all of them. i dont think i did say that explicitly, but i can see how the post could read like that.

 

also, if it has come across like i am canvassing, fair enough i hold my hands up and apologies unreservedly, i would never wish to influence anybody unduely, i dont think i have done this but again, with this being written text, any message can be taken in any context by different people. i am glad that the cllr i am related to doesnt do door to door canvassing anymore, only leaflets, because i value my personal safety far too much! and also i hate being jumped by people on my way to work asking me to donate to charities/sign petitions etc.

 

i agree in certain respects with your dislike of the party systme as it is - forcing people as we seem to do in so many walks of life to be a part of something rather then encourage individual thought, but thats a discussion for another thread in another part of the forum (and ive just finished my work for this evening so ill be logging off for a beer shortly)

 

i do consider other parties policies it just so happens that 99/100 times my feelings/beliefs tie in with the party i chose to vote for. i replied to this thread not to influence other people but to reply to ill-informed comments such as "trying to kill the club", or the accusation that cllrs dont care/are only in it for the money - in the case of the person i am related to, seeing the amount of time they spend on council business (again - im not speaking for all cllrs but the ones i know seem to be the same) it is far from a case of "in it for the money".

 

summing up (because im knackered and i want that beer!), apologies for any misunderstanding and rick - im sure we could have a bloody good discussion about the rights and wrongs of the political system etc etc, its refreshing to see a well composed response on this board, the majority just seem to mock, insult etc, im sure we would disagree and agree on numerous points - no hard feelings!

 

 

No hard feelings whatsoever. I think between us we have probably been able to bring about a bit of balance.

 

Enjoy your beer

 

 

CHEERS