Summerdeep

That made me laugh! Didn't a teenage 'businessman' take over Aldershot in the early 1990s, only for the whole thing to unravel soon afterwards with the club ending up in liquidation?

DELETED. Why is there no 'delete' option on this site? Or is there?

Re outfield players as stand-in goalkeepers: on 4 December 1971, Latics played a Div 3 fixture at Blackburn. This was just seven days after our 0-6 home thrashing by Aston Villa. With the score at 0-0 midway through the first half, Harry Dowd received a serious injury (broken bone in his hand, I think) and had to leave the field. Maurice Whittle took over in goal for the rest of the game, and played an absolute blinder. We won 1-0, and Jim Williams dubbed him 'Maurice The Magnificent' in his Monday evening match report in the Chronicle!

'Querendum', not 'querundum'. https://www.verbix.com/webverbix/go.php?D1=9&T1=queror

Nimium in pueritia fumavisti, ut mihi videtur!

In the version I heard many years ago, Ramsey tells Marsh "You'll be in the starting eleven, Rodney, but I might be pulling you off at half-time", to which Marsh replies, "Christ, Alf, I didn't realize you liked me that much!".

Maurice Whittle, aged about 15, pictured in a Wigan schoolboys team (front row, in the middle). https://www.wiganworld.co.uk/album/photo.php?opt=7&id=30528&gallery=Wigan+Schoolboys+FC&offset=0

I lived in Walthamstow for 27 years, but never got round to visiting the dog track. Went down the M11 a few times to the Newmarket races though.

Yes, McVitie was a very accomplished player for us, and scored quite a few vital goals. Noteworthy among these was his excellent 25 yard strike against Bristol Rovers at Eastville on Easter Saturday 1974, which was captured on BBC 'Match of the Day' cameras. Also the two goals he scored in an amazing game at Sunderland in 1975 when we came from 2-0 down to salvage a draw - we only escaped relegation by a couple of points that year, so that was a crucial match. McVitie's signing had an interesting aspect in that the Latics had been in negotiations with WBA for much of the summer of 1972 with a view to acquiring his services, but John Lowe repeatedly refused to agree to Albion's £15,000 valuation for the player, so the deal collapsed. The 1972-73 season started disastrously with a 4-1 hammering at Chesterfield, and in what looked like a bit of a panic move, we hurriedly signed McVitie, just in time for him to make his debut in another poor performance in the League Cup at Bolton (lost 0-3). Jim Williams remarked in his Oldham Chronicle match report that McVitie was by far the Latics' best performer, but that he must have been wondering afterwards what he had let himself in for.... What was interesting though was the revelation that the sum paid for him was £22,500. A 50% price hike in a matter of weeks? No wonder they say inflation was out of control in the 70s! There was further drama involving McVitie when he was rushed to hospital a few weeks later for emergency surgery on a perforated ulcer, and it wasn't until the following March that he returned to first team action. His involuntary absence gave Andy Sweeney his big chance to establish himself in the side, but unfortunately he wasn't altogether successful in this. I think George went back to play for his home town club Carlisle after that, and was still turning out for Queen Of The South in the Scottish League until well into his mid-thirties. I read once that he became a milkman after his football career ended, and not so many years ago he was writing a weekly football column for a local Carlisle newspaper, maybe he still is? McVitie's partner on the other wing for the early part of the 1972-73 season by the way was Johnny Morrissey, but maybe the less said about him the better...

Jim Fryatt once gave a lift home in his car to a schoolfriend and me after we missed the coach back home from an away match at Stockport. This was the game played on 25 September 1970 which ended in a 1-1 draw. Fryatt was captain for the night against one of his many former clubs. What struck me was just how old and cramped the car was for a 'star player'. It can't have been worth more than £200-£300 and I think it may have been a Vauxhall Viva or something similar. I also remember him smoking a lot of cigarettes, with the car windows closed, LOL. He had his wife and a small child with him, and all he said to the two of us throughout the journey was "Did you enjoy the game, boys?". I read an interview with Fryatt in one of the fanzines which came out in the 1990s, and he said that he was surprised that anyone in the town still remembered him, which I found a bit strange to say the least!

Thanks for the reply and point taken. The fact remains though that he played 100 games for Stoke City's first team, mostly in the top division, before his 23rd birthday, so it must have been felt at the time that he was up to the required standard or very close to it.

Someone earlier mentioned Paul Bernard's career ending in disappointment, but what about Keith Bebbington? The more I think about it, the sadder and more incomprehensible it seems. Here was a guy who in his early twenties was a semi-regular member of a side in the top flight of the Football League, who had played alongside Stanley Matthews and who had scored a goal in a League Cup final. And yet there he was, still aged just 26, playing for us in 1969-70 against sides like Workington, Bradford PA and Hartlepool. Things obviously improved a bit for him with the advent of Frizzell as manager and promotion to Div 3, but I think that by the summer of 1972 Keith must have given up on any serious career ambitions if he was prepared to move to Rochdale. They were on a steeply downward trajectory by then, with home attendances around the 2,000 mark, and were relegated in 1973-74 with just two wins in the entire season.

^ I think Bebbington joined the club in the close season of 1966. Bates and McIlroy must have done an impressive job to persuade an established first teamer at Stoke City (100 appearances, and aged just 23 at the time) to come to a Third Division club. Three years later Bebbington found himself in a side that was second bottom of the old Fourth Division and on the transfer list at his own request. He almost went to Blackburn in February 1970 in a straight exchange deal for Jim Fryatt, but the Latics insisted on a cash adjustment in their favour as well, and ended up buying Fryatt for around £8000. I think Bebbington went to Rochdale in the 1972 close season in exchange for Ronnie Blair.

^ So the Latics received around £1 million for Bernard in the mid-1990s? That was very serious money at the time and could have been put to good use, but clearly wasn't! I remember watching a newly relegated OAFC side playing at Fulham in September 1997 against a side just up from the old Fourth Division (or whatever it was called back then), and getting slaughtered. The fans probably thought things couldn't get much worse from then on, but there was another quarter of a century of decline (at least) to come, lol.....

^ Yes, 'bursting out of his skin', I can see what you mean by that, I only saw his performances in his last year or so at the club, and my recollection is that he often looked a bit 'wheezy', with very puffed out cheeks. I've even occasionally wondered about his state of health and fitness at that stage of his career - he was only 28 when Frizzell released him on a free transfer, but he doesn't seem to have played any professional football after that. I had the impression also that Reg didn't have the outright pace and ball control to be a fully effective winger. At Southport he was a 20 goals per season man, so maybe his best position was inside forward or even centre forward. His Wikipedia entry describes him as both a centre forward and a midfielder. Then again, it's a pretty poor article, which doesn't even mention his Latics career. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reginald_Blore

Just noticed this! https://www.southportfootballclub.co.uk/2021-inductee-reg-blore/

Bowie played his last game for the Latics in a 1-0 defeat at Aston Villa on 10 April 1972. He picked up a serious injury which required a cartilage operation. His release on a free transfer wasn't popular with the fans, and Jimmy Frizzell appeared to be unhappy about it as well, refusing to make any comment to the press on the matter. According to the Oldham Chronicle's Jim Williams, it was the club chairman John Lowe who made the decision. The fact that his career with Rochdale lasted only one month suggests that he never regained full fitness.

Been looking at an AFC Bournemouth fans forum, and it seems that Groves was a popular figure there, but not universally so, as this post by a member called 'The Flying Picket' illustrates: "He could run, dribble and shoot, but he could not cross, which as a winger he was supposed to do. He was also a showboater on the pitch, which upset his fellow pros. We bought him for £30K to £40K and sold him to Oldham some fifteen months later for £10K (enough said), who then sold him on to Blackpool for £30K. He was nothing but a waster who got involved in some shady car deals. Did he also not run a car lot in Ashley Road?" LOL That comment about his crossing ability, or lack of it, is interesting though. After the friendly match against SC Internacional in February 1975, their coach is reported to have been impressed by Groves's overall abilty, and said that he would have been good enough to be in the Brazilian national squad if he'd been able to cross the ball!

I know this is quite an old post, but I still thought it worth replying to say that your memory is not playing tricks. Groves did indeed run through at least five or six attempted tackles before scoring in that Blackburn game at Ewood (2nd March 1974). Funnily enough he started out on the right touchline, then jinked his way to the 'D' on the edge of the penalty area before unleashing an unstoppable shot. The really satisfying thing was that the goal came in the 90th minute, and Rovers had no chance to get back into the game. Some Latics fans had a really rough time at that match, and our coach got a brick through the window as we left town. From the sublime to the ridiculous....our very next away match was at Chesterfield, who were on a great run themselves and well in contention for promotion. In a very tight contest, with hardly any chances created by either side, Chesterfield led 1-0 in stoppage time, when the Latics finally unlocked their defence: a cross from the right found Groves unmarked in the six yard box, with the keeper nowhere to be seen and the goal at his mercy. It was your classic 'tap in', but Groves tried to be too clever and chip the ball just inside the far post. Needless to say it drifted a few inches wide, and I don't think there was even time for the goalkick to be taken. That ended our legendary run of 10 consecutive wins that season.

Just noticed that there's a brief reference in Groves's Wikipedia entry in relation to the alleged Trevor Hartley incident. This does cast further doubts upon the reliability of Redknapp as a witness though, as he states that it occurred after Groves had scored a goal - Latics' scorers that night were Blair, Robins and Garwood (2), but not Groves. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Groves I think it's perfectly possible that Groves and Hartley may have had issues between them, and that there may have been some kind of minor incident (eg as the sides left the pitch), but that Redknapp exaggerated and embroidered it in later years for dramatic effect. As for Groves being unhappy about leaving Bournemouth, it's interesting to listen to this interview with Ian Wood, who seems to suggest that the opposite was the case (from the 6:25 mark): Bournemouth had a formidable side under John Bond 1970-73, but when Bond moved to Norwich early in the 1973-74 season, he took all their best players with him (Powell, Jones, Boyer, Machin, Benson) and Groves was the only decent footballer they had left by February 74. They were actually relegated in 1974-75.

Just discovered this thread - some interesting reminiscences about Alan Groves here! There's one story about him that I've heard several times over the years, and would be interested to know whether anyone else has heard it. The story goes that when Groves was transferred to Latics in late February 1974, he was reluctant to leave Bournemouth and was angry at their manager Trevor Hartley for selling him. The next time the clubs met, Groves came into possession of the ball, but instead of moving towards the Bournemouth goal, dribbled with it towards their dugout and blasted it at full power straight at Hartley, accompanied by aggressive gestures and expletives. If this really happened, it could only have been in the match at Boundary Park on 19 March 1974, as Groves was still a Bournemouth Player when the sides met at Dean Court on 2 February. The sides never met again until the late 1980s. Personally, I'm a bit doubtful about this story. I think the original source for it is probably that dodgy geezer Harry Redknapp, whom I heard telling it in a radio interview, though I've also seen versions of it on fan forums and in at least one newspaper article. I was among the 13,000 crowd at Boundary Park that night, and don't recall seeing any such incident, nor have I heard any other Latics fan mention it. I would also have thought Frizzell would have taken stern disciplinary action against Groves, such as dropping him or even transfer listing him for such a breach of discipline. But interesting all the same. Has anyone else heard this story?

Wow, very interesting footage, first time I've seen it! Can't be earlier than the middle of the 1970-71 season if Harry Dowd was playing (signed for us late 1970), but I also think that's Paul Clements who can be seen in the no 7 shirt at around the 4:40 mark, so that would place the game in 1971-72. It can't be any later than June '72, as Jim Bowie is undoubtedly featured in the earlier clip, and he was released on a free transfer in that month.

I used to have Football Director on the Commodore 64. In 1988 I won the old First Division title as manager of the Latics, with a team that included Ruud Gullit, Romeo Benetti, Gary Lineker and Cyrille Regis. Took me 42 seasons to do so however, and it went to the final game of the season, where a 1-1 draw at Crystal Palace secured the spoils. Sorry to derail this thread somewhat, lol.

Was reminded on seeing this thread that my first visit to Boundary Park was on 18 March 1969 for a Tuesday night match against Northampton. The weather was absolutely foul, with rain bucketing down, and it was amazing that the game was ever allowed to start. In the second half, with most of the pitch underwater and Northampton leading 1-0, the referee abandoned the match in unplayable conditions. There can't have been many more than 1000 spectators in the ground, and it could well have been significantly fewer. If the match had been completed, it would almost certainly have been the lowest ever attendance for a league game at BP at that time. The game was replayed on 29 April, and the attendance was still one of the smallest ever (2073). The 1-1 draw meant that Northampton were relegated to the 4th Division by just one point. Latics were already down of course. Three years earlier Northampton had been in the top flight and had achieved creditable home draws against Man Utd and Liverpool.

Er, yes indeed.... And now for something completely different. A slightly fuller version of Latics v Watford, 29 Dec 1973, from LWT's 'The Big Match'. Terrible miss by George Jones - thank goodness Garwood established himself as a first team regular in the second half of the season, otherwise I think we might have missed out on promotion. Eddie Large wasn't on the Latics or the Watford bench, by the way...