Sir David of Pennyshire

[JoeP]

YAAAWWWWWWNN

but they will continue to reduce if we keep the same one

 

Really? I disagree.

 

If the team finish this season strongely and carry it on to next season, I reckon many of the missing 1,000 will come back.

[ShakerT]

Will we get more people at the games with Muppet in charge next season? no! There are too many stay aways, How many people do you know who won't set foot in the place because of the current manager? The good business sense is the extra 10k through the gate every week with a decent manager at the helm!

 

I will eat the biggest slice of humble pie if he comes good, but coem on can you see it?

[razza699]

Will we get more people at the games with Muppet in charge next season? no! There are too many stay aways, How many people do you know who won't set foot in the place because of the current manager? The good business sense is the extra 10k through the gate every week with a decent manager at the helm!

 

I will eat the biggest slice of humble pie if he comes good, but coem on can you see it?

haha you think 10K people are staying away from BP just because of Dave Penney ?

 

Edited April 15, 2010 by razza699

[garcon]

Unless it was Paul Scholes I doubt any new managerial appointment would bring the stayaways flooding back from match one. That will only happen, whoever is in charge, if the team begin to look like they're in a promotion fight.

 

Having convinced myself we were going down I've been impressed that the team seem to have knuckled down and delivered the crucial results when they mattered most - not there yet, but they've dragged their sorry arses to the brink of safety. Far too late to do anything other than avoid relegation, but maybe just a sign that this squad, with a few changes over the summer, might be capable of better things next season, under Penney.

 

Maybe we have the chance of starting the second year of some kind of plan in August, rather than throwing everything out - including the manager - and starting all over again, again.

[Lookers_Carl]

Will we get more people at the games with Muppet in charge next season? no! There are too many stay aways, How many people do you know who won't set foot in the place because of the current manager? The good business sense is the extra 10k through the gate every week with a decent manager at the helm!

 

I will eat the biggest slice of humble pie if he comes good, but coem on can you see it?

 

I am guessing the 10k is actually a typo and you meant 1k,

 

But regardless, not a chance will a new manager put 1k on the gates, a few hundred tops!!!!

 

Although this does not change the fact that the performances this season have been completely unacceptable, and whoever is in charge next season should be under no illusions that a big improvement in performances (starting with a more positive approach to the game) is expected.

[razza699]

Could have meant £10k? which is not unrealistic to be fair. A big division of opinion on DP. To some extent board cant win....as if he goes will never know if he stays ...told you so...will be heard as soon as any poor performance???????

Under what manager in the last 10 years have we averaged 10k?!

[Lookers_Carl]

Could have meant £10k? which is not unrealistic to be fair. A big division of opinion on DP. To some extent board cant win....as if he goes will never know if he stays ...told you so...will be heard as soon as any poor performance???????

 

Ok assuming he did mean £10k (shaker would you be prepared to clarify whether the 10k in your post was referring to average attendance or money throuth the gates)

 

Again I will say there is zero guarantee that attendances will go up significantly if Penney is dismissed.

[oafcprozac]

I am guessing the 10k is actually a typo and you meant 1k,

 

But regardless, not a chance will a new manager put 1k on the gates, a few hundred tops!!!!

 

I've been bored to tears for most of this season after watching the most uninspired, insipid performances of any Latics team I have ever seen. However, the realists amongst us knew we'd struggle, I thought we'd be lower mid-table and flirt with the relegation places, at times it has been a little too close for comfort but 15 points from the last 30 has seen us pretty much safe, despite an horrendous injury record, 4th division under-achievers being signed and hardly playing for 6 weeks. Penney hasn't helped himself with his aloofness and his safety first tactics. I can understand why he's took the caustious approach but it's been dire to watch. On the bright side when we've had a go at teams we've looked decent and his decision to give Stephens an extended run has reaped rewards - we've finally found someone who can take a set-piece, Lee's stepped up to the plate and after missing out to Shez on Breckin his bringing Gregan back in has reaped dividends. Even Smalley looks more up for it after getting a boot up the arse.

 

However, there's been a lot of parallels with 95/96, insipid football, :censored:e performances and a manager becoming alienated from the fanbase. On the plus-side a promising midfielder (Hughes) and a young full-back (Serrant) came to the fore and we were safe with a game to spare. BUT the year after the budget was cut further and we started awfully before recovering and eventually succumbing to the inevitable.

 

 

TTA need to decide if they want another season of struggle, and not pass the buck by blaming the fans (our budget this season was a bottom 8 budget, I said in pre-season we would struggle)- relegation would be a disaster for the club and one that we would be unlikely to recover from. Penney needs a budget that can enable the team to progress. The tree has been, chopped and chopped since Moore's departure in 2006, chop again and it will fall!

 

I'm tempted to get another season ticket, BUT I want TTA to cough up and allow the team to progress, not tread water. I want more full-time players at the club that are ours. not half-arsed loanee after loanee. It was clear to see the squad was weak, before a ball had even been kicked - we were short of striking cover, had no back-up keeper and no defensive cover. How the hell can you hope to compete when for the last four years we have started a season with a squad bereft in vital areas? (Every deadline day we are panicking over a striker signing, it's just not on!)

 

As for Penney, yes he's pissed me off but he's kept us up - I'm prepared to give another shot at it next season. let him bring some quality in instead of bodies for the sheer hell of it, I was convinced we were going down 3 weeks ago, now we need to plan that we are not simply delaying the inevitable and having the same worries this time next year.

 

Penney's no mug, but he needs to win over the fans by playing a little more expansively. Get the team scoring goals and throw in a bit of excitement and I don't care what the stayaways say (some won't come back no matter what - not like Oldhamers to bear a grudge is it?) many will come back out curiosity and sheer boredom of being stuck at home, shopping etc...

Edited April 15, 2010 by oafcprozac

[bensonio]

Paul Scholes & Sean Gregan. Joint Player/Manager team.

 

Sorted.

 

Scholes?!

 

I wouldn't gamble on him, simply due to him not havin any managing experience. Even on the pitch he never screams out he's aleader leader of men. You can use the 'experience in europe' card but we don't need that...we need 'experience in lower leagues and budget tighter than a nuns crotch'.

 

For me, my opinions have started to change about DP. At start of season I said I'd be happy mid-table finish and it's where we're starting to head. I'd give DP til xmas. No manager (apart from anyone taking City's job) can find their ideal first team in one summer. Hence why last summer DP came in, looked at what he had an had to make do with what cash he got. He made signings, some not great (I was expecting Parker of the play offs, and i'm sure many more of you did too)

 

As for his many signings bein mainly full backs and defensive midfielders...dont forget when we brought him in...just after the team just closed down as a unit and let Hereford among others thrash us, he's maybe looked at stopping that (which lookin at our goals against stat he has done).

 

Now is the time to get rid of deadwood and baggage as he'll now have a good idea of who can do what jobs when required, who wanst to play for him etc. Then go and sign some attacking players, if possible after the Richards sale, be able to splash out on an established finisher in our league to partner Abbott.

 

As for him not being passionate about the club/fans - TTA brought him in to do a job, an it wasnt to be anyones best friend, it was to bring discipline back to the team among other things, so he's had to play the 'bad guy' in the fans eyes, because someone had to to stop the rot carrying on from last season.

[slystallone]

Unless it was Paul Scholes I doubt any new managerial appointment would bring the stayaways flooding back from match one. That will only happen, whoever is in charge, if the team begin to look like they're in a promotion fight.

/quote]

 

 

Not popping at you directly Garcon; but where has this notion that Scholes would make a good manager / would even want to be a manager come from??

 

From what I know of the man; he is a shy bloke who likes a life away from the spot-light (I have seen him drop an pint of OJ after getting flustered by a couple of people letting on to him asking for photos etc).

 

I simply cannot see PS standing before the press before & after games week in; week out. Nor would he relish the prospect of standing on the touchline running the gauntlet of fans chants & abuse etc.

 

Plus; lets face it – it’s ‘head in the clouds’ anyway to think he’s ever going to don the blue jersey for us; let alone taking on the ‘mission impossible’ job that is the managers job here.

 

 

E4e

PIPEDREAM

[garcon]

Unless it was Paul Scholes I doubt any new managerial appointment would bring the stayaways flooding back from match one. That will only happen, whoever is in charge, if the team begin to look like they're in a promotion fight.

 

 

Not popping at you directly Garcon; but where has this notion that Scholes would make a good manager / would even want to be a manager come from??

 

My tongue may have been hovering somewhere near my cheek when I wrote that. In the real world there is no notion that he would make a good manager, or even want the job. But just imagine for a moment that he did take the job - there'd be an instant flood of hero worshipping lemming idiots back to Boundary Park to support their new legend. Well, for a few weeks at least - until even they realise that their hero won't magically transport the club back to the Premiership by winning two divisions in the same season...

[ShakerT]

Under what manager in the last 10 years have we averaged 10k?!

 

The 10k was monies! no ugandan dollars, actual sterling! not attendance blimey I do live in the real world.....well sometimes!!!

[oafc-latics]

new contract for scholes at utd so that idea has gone. guess we'll have to stick with penney...

[Bring Back Ronnie Moore]

He was given 2 years, we should honour that and see what he can do in his second year. I seem to recall Kenny Jackett having Millwall down the bottom end of the table in his first season and had them in the playoff final in his second and now challenging for auto in his third. Likewise this is Danny Wilson's second season at Swindon and he's also got them up challenging for the automatic spot, whilst last season they were quite far down the table (although I'm aware he only took over at Christmas last season).

 

[Midsblue]

Penney will be here next season.

 

What is combined salary for Penney, Gray and Collett for last year of their contract? £180k? Maybe more?

 

If 500 ST holders didn't renew, which I seriously doubt, because they stayed then that's £150k. That's a big IF too because we're effectively down to the diehards now and they will renew regardless of who's in charge because not renewing leaves a huge hole in their weekends, social life and life as a whole.

 

Despite dislike by many...I would say 20% of ST holders maximum...our injury record will safeguard Penney for next season IF we stay up. Only relegation will deliver his P45.

 

All depends on what Corney's expectations are next season and what budget is available. If Penney wheeling and dealing on the player front is productive and has more luck with injuries then we'll see some improvement.

 

However, how much improvement is needed for Penney to remain here until June 2011? Automatic promotion? Play-Off place? Top 10 finish?

 

For attendance to increase there are only two options -

 

1. Seriously cut ST prices to boost sales and the owners fund the team out of their own pocket hoping that they get repaid through concession sales and promotion.

 

2. Keep ST prices as they are but increase the budget out of their own pocket and buy themselves out this league with the hope that a promotion push next season will increase attendances via pay on the day punters and then ST renewals/purchases for the 2011/12 season.

 

Whichever way, the owners have to dig deep I'm afraid and accept that balancing the books is one thing but spending some of their personal fortune will only guarantee success as Penney doesn't seem to be the kind of manager who can unearth talent on the cheap. Danny Wilson has done it at Swindon but needed funds to make signings from lower leagues.

[slystallone]

Penney will be here next season.

 

What is combined salary for Penney, Gray and Collett for last year of their contract? £180k? Maybe more?

 

If 500 ST holders didn't renew, which I seriously doubt, because they stayed then that's £150k. That's a big IF too because we're effectively down to the diehards now and they will renew regardless of who's in charge because not renewing leaves a huge hole in their weekends, social life and life as a whole.

 

Despite dislike by many...I would say 20% of ST holders maximum...our injury record will safeguard Penney for next season IF we stay up. Only relegation will deliver his P45.

 

All depends on what Corney's expectations are next season and what budget is available. If Penney wheeling and dealing on the player front is productive and has more luck with injuries then we'll see some improvement.

 

However, how much improvement is needed for Penney to remain here until June 2011? Automatic promotion? Play-Off place? Top 10 finish?

 

For attendance to increase there are only two options -

 

1. Seriously cut ST prices to boost sales and the owners fund the team out of their own pocket hoping that they get repaid through concession sales and promotion.

 

2. Keep ST prices as they are but increase the budget out of their own pocket and buy themselves out this league with the hope that a promotion push next season will increase attendances via pay on the day punters and then ST renewals/purchases for the 2011/12 season.

 

Whichever way, the owners have to dig deep I'm afraid and accept that balancing the books is one thing but spending some of their personal fortune will only guarantee success as Penney doesn't seem to be the kind of manager who can unearth talent on the cheap. Danny Wilson has done it at Swindon but needed funds to make signings from lower leagues.

 

 

<Cough> Simon Cox sold for 2 Million <Cough>

Always helps that!!

[Lookers_Carl]

<Cough> Simon Cox sold for 2 Million <Cough>

Always helps that!!

 

Okkkkkk so lets flog Chris taylor, bidding starts at 2 mill.............

 

[ShakerT]

There is another option sack Penney and get some of the say aways back!

[razza699]

There is another option sack Penney and get some of the say aways back!

yeh we know you said 10K stayaways wasnt it?

[bensonio]

<Cough> Simon Cox sold for 2 Million <Cough>

Always helps that!!

 

Yeah...what helps is the owners not taking the money and putting it in their pocket and putting it towards more signings...as his post was pointing out?

[Erratic_Latic]

The biggest problem this season has been too much change all in one go, so the whole club felt unfamiliar. New management team, completely new squad save Greegs / Taylor / Whits / Hazell, combined with the 3-sided ground, following on from several years of relative stability under Shez where you recognised the majority of the starting line-up and felt comfortable with them.

 

Was never going to be an easy season for a new manager working with a team of strangers. It's started getting better. Let him have another season and see where he takes us.

 

Changing manager again now would make things worse.

 

[Lookers_Carl]

The biggest problem this season has been too much change all in one go, so the whole club felt unfamiliar. New management team, completely new squad save Greegs / Taylor / Whits / Hazell, combined with the 3-sided ground, following on from several years of relative stability under Shez where you recognised the majority of the starting line-up and felt comfortable with them.

 

Was never going to be an easy season for a new manager working with a team of strangers. It's started getting better. Let him have another season and see where he takes us.

 

Changing manager again now would make things worse.

 

I would agree with that.

 

And would also add realistically, if we were to change manager, our options would be extremely limited, as decisions need to be made on the players we have at our disposal currently, and the chances are a new manager would probably have to sit down and watch a fair number of match DVD's in order to assess his current squad, which would probably have a knock on effect of us playing catch up when it comes to summer signings. Hence realistically I think our options would be Gannon (on the basis he has seen this team play a few times) or an internal appointment,

 

Gray: More fan friendly but would he really be any different to Penney, and would fans see this as a worthwhile change?

TP: Not interested?

Dux: Would he make a manager? would putting a rookie manager in charge of a team with a small budget just be asking for relegation?

Gregan: Same as dux but would we need him on the field for at least another season (or as long as we can get out of him?)

 

If the potential loss of fans/season ticket sales didn't come into it, I would be in favour of giving him the summer and reassessing the situation 10 games in, but not before really pushing the boundaries of what constitutes to 'a bollocking' and make it clear that a repeat of last seasons performances is not on the cards. But unfortunately, the potential loss in fans is an issue, and makes the decision that much harder

[oafcmetty]

What the club seems to be lacking, imo, is a long term strategy beyond that of 'tread water till new stadium is delivered'.

 

As I see it there are a number of roads to go down:

 

1) Youth - something similar to Stockport under Gannon. Bring in young lads from other local clubs, and from a good scouting network. Train, play, then sell for a profit. Invest profits in buying a better quality of youth, and improve gradually.

 

2) Invest - owners splash a bit of cash, buy players capable of putting up a challenge - sort of like Udders this year.

 

3) Tread water - what we're currently doing. Keep budget at a pretty low level, but enough to allow us to stay in the division, nothing more.

 

Whilst we're doing #3 it's kind of irrelevant who is manager.