Futbol Club Barcelona Vs Manchester United

[monkeykieran]

I'm going for 2-1 Barcelona in extra time (Bojan to score winner after Ronaldo & Henry goals in normal time)

 

I hope so anyway

[oafc0000]

I think Manchester United are the better team... 2-1 Man U

[Diego_Sideburns]

I'm an 'ABU', but I think it's scandalous that a venue has been chosen for the Final, where the visiting fans need to be aware of the advice given by the Foreign & Commonwealth Office for their safety. It it was necessary to issue such advice to fans visiting England, the Final would be moved elsewhere.

http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travelling-and-li...fans/manubarca/

P.S. On the link picture, anyone know why Rooney is holding Giggs so that Fletcher can thump him?

[johnny punkster]

I'm an 'ABU', but I think it's scandalous that a venue has been chosen for the Final, where the visiting fans need to be aware of the advice given by the Foreign & Commonwealth Office for their safety. It it was necessary to issue such advice to fans visiting England, the Final would be moved elsewhere.

http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travelling-and-li...fans/manubarca/

P.S. On the link picture, anyone know why Rooney is holding Giggs so that Fletcher can thump him?

 

pretty much the main topic on the uk barca penya site this morning(give a link but its in the members only section)

another thought.

why moscow last year?-know problems with local hooligans,problem getting there,having to get visa etc.

why rome this year? -known problems with local hooligans,problems with gestapo/police.

brown envelope anyone?

[opinions4u]

pretty much the main topic on the uk barca penya site this morning(give a link but its in the members only section)

another thought.

why moscow last year?-know problems with local hooligans,problem getting there,having to get visa etc.

why rome this year? -known problems with local hooligans,problems with gestapo/police.

brown envelope anyone?

I'm sure that nice Mr Platini would never get involved in anything underhand.

[davebuckley06]

I'm an 'ABU', but I think it's scandalous that a venue has been chosen for the Final, where the visiting fans need to be aware of the advice given by the Foreign & Commonwealth Office for their safety. It it was necessary to issue such advice to fans visiting England, the Final would be moved elsewhere.

http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travelling-and-li...fans/manubarca/

P.S. On the link picture, anyone know why Rooney is holding Giggs so that Fletcher can thump him?

 

also if the violence that has been seen at this ground and other italian grounds over the past decade had been in england our teams would be banned from europe again

[oafc0000]

I'm sure that nice Mr Platini would never get involved in anything underhand.

 

There is known hooligan issue in every footballing country though...even this one still...

 

Didn't Russia go off with very few problems in the end ?

 

I would say Italy should not be getting anything like this though considering their fans appalling behaviour and policing in general though...

Edited May 20, 2009 by oafc0000

[johnny punkster]

I'm sure that nice Mr Platini would never get involved in anything underhand.

 

lol..you named him!

or "the poisoned french dwarf" as he's already been non de plume'd!

[opinions4u]

lol..you named him!

or "the poisoned french dwarf" as he's already been non de plume'd!

I thought I recalled him getting suspended from football for a period of months for something underhand towards the end of his playing career.

 

I know I've not mixed him up with Rossi, but it's possible I've got my wires crossed and I cannot find any reference to it when I Google the matter.

[Diego_Sideburns]

lol..you named him!

or "the poisoned french dwarf" as he's already been non de plume'd!

 

You've got something in common with him, Johnny - you have both been seduced by Barca's style!

http://goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2009/05/2...ball-philosophy

[rudemedic]

So the FCO have given out some advice warning people about the situation- will the idiots going take any notice? As far as I'm concerned no major city in Europe doesn't have these or similar problems, football is a passionate sport and sometimes these passions run over and into racism (Spain, Italy) or violence. I wouldn't mind betting that there will be less chaos in Rome than there was in Manchester when the blue side of Glasgow came calling last year. Passions are likely to run over again this year- especially as I think a lot of people are going without tickets- I'd much rather the final was in Rome where OK the police are a bit heavy handed but they aren't useless (unlike say Brussels) and it is someone else footing the bill as opposed to the Birtish tax payer (like manchester last year).

 

I'm not saying that I don't think its been a rum decision and some money may have changed hands (especially considering Platini's history and his Italian links) but to bad mouth Uefa for choosing a stadium in a country which hasn't hosted the final in ages, didn't look like having a team capable of making it, but is a major footballing power is a bit wrong.

 

To get back to the original topic- I'm going for a Barca win 3-1 (the third barca goal at end as Man u go in search of an equaliser).

[garcon]

or "the poisoned french dwarf" as he's already been non de plume'd!

Or Napoleon for short...

[johnny punkster]

You've got something in common with him, Johnny - you have both been seduced by Barca's style!

http://goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2009/05/2...ball-philosophy

 

pah!

a "jean-paul come lately"!

[Diego_Sideburns]

So the FCO have given out some advice warning people about the situation- will the idiots going take any notice? As far as I'm concerned no major city in Europe doesn't have these or similar problems, football is a passionate sport and sometimes these passions run over and into racism (Spain, Italy) or violence. I wouldn't mind betting that there will be less chaos in Rome than there was in Manchester when the blue side of Glasgow came calling last year. Passions are likely to run over again this year- especially as I think a lot of people are going without tickets- I'd much rather the final was in Rome where OK the police are a bit heavy handed but they aren't useless (unlike say Brussels) and it is someone else footing the bill as opposed to the Birtish tax payer (like manchester last year).

 

I'm not saying that I don't think its been a rum decision and some money may have changed hands (especially considering Platini's history and his Italian links) but to bad mouth Uefa for choosing a stadium in a country which hasn't hosted the final in ages, didn't look like having a team capable of making it, but is a major footballing power is a bit wrong.

 

Uefa spokesman William Galliard has said previously stewards would probably do a better job than the riot police who are in charge inside Italian stadia. However, Uefa has no control over this situation.

 

Stabbings by roving gangs armed with flick-knives happen often around the stadium, with violence flaring during ManUre’s last two visits to Rome. Fourteen Liverpool fans were stabbed when the club played in Rome, three Middlesbrough fans were knifed in 2006, sixteen ManUre fans were stabbed in 2007 and a bus-load of Arsenal supporters was ambushed by a group of AS Roma's Ultras (and a resulting injury to one fan) in March.

 

Inside the stadium, when ManUre visited AS Roma previously, video footage showed Roma fans approach the perspex shield that segregated them from the ManUre fans in an attempt to taunt and provoke the travelling supporters. Not one single Police officer in riot gear stepped in to disperse the intimidating tactical approach of the Italians. But just 15 minutes later, dozens of riot police funnelled down the terraces to beat many ManUre supporters senseless despite not encroaching any restricted areas that would have been deemed to have been inciting the opposing fans.

 

Ultras have a much bigger voice in Italy compared to most other leagues in Europe, and in most cases are well known to their clubs. They often use intimidatory tactics to get free match tickets, travel concessions to away matches and to have the freedom to run their own merchandising rackets.

 

Surely Uefa has a responsibility to hold its Finals in countries where stewarding is the norm rather than riot police and the Ultras are under the control of their clubs.

[futchers briefs]

Tight game predicted - Barcelona cautious in their usual attacking style, wary of man U's breaking prowess - I think the dirty reds will 'sneak the game 2-1.

[rudemedic]

Uefa spokesman William Galliard has said previously stewards would probably do a better job than the riot police who are in charge inside Italian stadia. However, Uefa has no control over this situation.

 

Stabbings by roving gangs armed with flick-knives happen often around the stadium, with violence flaring during ManUre’s last two visits to Rome. Fourteen Liverpool fans were stabbed when the club played in Rome, three Middlesbrough fans were knifed in 2006, sixteen ManUre fans were stabbed in 2007 and a bus-load of Arsenal supporters was ambushed by a group of AS Roma's Ultras (and a resulting injury to one fan) in March.

 

Inside the stadium, when ManUre visited AS Roma previously, video footage showed Roma fans approach the perspex shield that segregated them from the ManUre fans in an attempt to taunt and provoke the travelling supporters. Not one single Police officer in riot gear stepped in to disperse the intimidating tactical approach of the Italians. But just 15 minutes later, dozens of riot police funnelled down the terraces to beat many ManUre supporters senseless despite not encroaching any restricted areas that would have been deemed to have been inciting the opposing fans.

 

Ultras have a much bigger voice in Italy compared to most other leagues in Europe, and in most cases are well known to their clubs. They often use intimidatory tactics to get free match tickets, travel concessions to away matches and to have the freedom to run their own merchandising rackets.

 

Surely Uefa has a responsibility to hold its Finals in countries where stewarding is the norm rather than riot police and the Ultras are under the control of their clubs.

 

I'm not sure I agree. You yourself Diego spent quite sometime on here telling us that weren't there about an incident with some unjust stewards in Essex and how wrong it was- you've even bought it up today on the flag site. Stewards in the UK are well trained (certainly as well trained as in other countries), have to pass some sort of test (although when I sat and passed the test it wasn't hard- most sensible sports fans could pass it) but still these stewards caused a problem. Now you are saying stewards are the answer. Make up your mind.

 

The Champions League Final has to be in a stadium big enough so that the two sets of fans and all UEFA's dignitaries, corporate sponsors and various laggers and hangers on can get enough tickets. This usually means a stadium of over 70,000 (in fact I think it has to be in a stadium of that size according to their rules). This limits your options to (off the top of my head):

Wembley (hosting next year's, and I can see that being really popular with Barca fans, plus who's to say there won't be trouble between United and London)

Millenium (Cardiff have caused a ref to be hurt this year and I can see Barca being happy with that)

Old Trafford (Really Really popular with Barca fans this one, probably not that popular with United either judging by how many tickets they will get)

Stade De France (Hosted one recently, had some problems with rioting relating to racism recently but a good stadium for this sort of thing)

Bernabeu (Racist chanting and can see it being really popular with United and Barca fans- could see it kick off easily no matter who wins)

Camp Nou (same but the other way round as Old Trafford, plus problems with racism in Spain- although not necessarily in Catalyna)

Stadio Olympico (Rome) (You've voiced your concern about this)

San Siro (Similar problem to Rome with bonus problem of tiered stands and the problems that has caused)

Olympic Stadium Berlin (decent choice but imagine if Bayern Munich had got the draw which would probably have seen them through- the same one United got, big problem, plus Germans have had problems with racism and hooligans too)

Olympic Stadium Athens (Hosted a final recently I think, problem with hooligans and racism)

Istanbul (don't know the name- where Liverpool won it) (Leeds say no more)

The one they used last year in Moscow (Last year and all the problems they had or were expecting)

 

You are moaning about the Final being held in Rome but there are problems with all sorts of stadia and the last major final to be held there was possibly the World Cup in 90 (I think there must have been one since but can't think). Its the Italians 'turn' to host a big final like this. If you had smaller grounds then the number of tickets going to each side would be about 10,000 (not very popular that one). You have moaned and cited problems with Rome and I say what's the alternative considering it had to be finalised a couple of months ago.

 

[johnny punkster]

sorry,i'm a bit sleepy still,but whats all this "barca will be happy with that"?

no sure what point you're making here.

happy with size of stadium and if it was there this season?

if so,thats just crap...at stade de france,where i was lucky to be for the final,each club got no more than 20,000.the rest went to freeloaders,sponsors ,uefa etc etc.

 

as for rome,the problems faced for fans going there are a rome hooligan and policing problem.i have several good mates going there next week and they know the ins and outs of what do do,where to go where to avoid already,from someone who has already been there for a game.

 

the fact also 30,000 manu fans are expected there(each club got 19,000 tickets-barca fans don't have the same mentality,if they don't have a ticket why go to the place of the game-watch in your local at home!)gets me thinking that the roma hooligan element will looking out even more for victims."invading our patch"...you know they things hooligans think up.

and its the "the english are here!" issue.roma/englisg clubs have history..manu more than most.

 

thankfully for my mates going,barca don't,but they have also been issued with advise from the club where to avoid etc.there only problem on a personal level is opening their gobs at the wrong time and getting mixed up.

i really think the issue of "fan safety" wasn't looked at properly when giving the final to rome.ok,its "italy's turn"(if thats the way it works)but rome and its problems shouldn't have entered the equation...and why should a city who's club has been regularly charged by uefa over recent years,for crowd trouble,policing problems etc,be rewarded to host a champions league final???..."pass the brown envelope eh.."

 

i hope to dear life that nowt happens to anyone next week...but i won't be a bit surprised if news breaks of problems.

 

oh..the final is at burnacow in madrid next year...can't wait!

[OldhamSheridan]

Why would the Italians come out for a fight that doesn't involve them? To me it is very unlikely.

 

 

 

NB. Whatever you say about Real, their stadium is second to none and deserves European Cup/WAFFA Cup finals. Plus they're so crap there is no chance of it being a venue for the home team.

Edited May 21, 2009 by OldhamSheridan

[johnny punkster]

Why would the Italians come out for a fight that doesn't involve them? To me it is very unlikely.

 

lets wait and see.but as it only take 1 to start a fight,i'm sure there will be problems.

 

 

NB. Whatever you say about Real, their stadium is second to none and deserves European Cup/WAFFA Cup finals. Plus they're so crap there is no chance of it being a venue for the home team.

 

never been so i'm not commenting.

second to none?...it must be impressive!!! (smirks and scoffs!)

[OldhamSheridan]

never been so i'm not commenting.

second to none?...it must be impressive!!! (smirks and scoffs!)

 

It's steep (so much so that you have barriers in a seating section). This gives you a cracking view of the game. They have heaters in the roof. Decent leg room. It is a really great stadium. Madrid is also a really good place, so I see it as one of the premier stadiums in the world.

 

But they do have the Spanish police, so that knocks it head beatingly down a level I suppose.

[johnny punkster]

But they do have the Spanish police, so that knocks it head beatingly down a level I suppose.

 

ah...shouldn't you just rephrase that "the madrid police?"

of all the times ive been to barca for games,home and away,in over 14 years,ive never seen trouble.

never seen a policeman have to move quicker than snailpace,never seen them look like they wanted to be there. sometimes you just don't see them.

meanwhile,the reputation of the police force in madrid is something else.

[Stitch_KTF]

I'm not sure I agree. You yourself Diego spent quite sometime on here telling us that weren't there about an incident with some unjust stewards in Essex and how wrong it was- you've even bought it up today on the flag site. Stewards in the UK are well trained (certainly as well trained as in other countries), have to pass some sort of test (although when I sat and passed the test it wasn't hard- most sensible sports fans could pass it) but still these stewards caused a problem. Now you are saying stewards are the answer. Make up your mind.

 

The Champions League Final has to be in a stadium big enough so that the two sets of fans and all UEFA's dignitaries, corporate sponsors and various laggers and hangers on can get enough tickets. This usually means a stadium of over 70,000 (in fact I think it has to be in a stadium of that size according to their rules). This limits your options to (off the top of my head):

Wembley (hosting next year's, and I can see that being really popular with Barca fans, plus who's to say there won't be trouble between United and London)

Millenium (Cardiff have caused a ref to be hurt this year and I can see Barca being happy with that)

Old Trafford (Really Really popular with Barca fans this one, probably not that popular with United either judging by how many tickets they will get)

Stade De France (Hosted one recently, had some problems with rioting relating to racism recently but a good stadium for this sort of thing)

Bernabeu (Racist chanting and can see it being really popular with United and Barca fans- could see it kick off easily no matter who wins)

Camp Nou (same but the other way round as Old Trafford, plus problems with racism in Spain- although not necessarily in Catalyna)

Stadio Olympico (Rome) (You've voiced your concern about this)

San Siro (Similar problem to Rome with bonus problem of tiered stands and the problems that has caused)

Olympic Stadium Berlin (decent choice but imagine if Bayern Munich had got the draw which would probably have seen them through- the same one United got, big problem, plus Germans have had problems with racism and hooligans too)

Olympic Stadium Athens (Hosted a final recently I think, problem with hooligans and racism)

Istanbul (don't know the name- where Liverpool won it) (Leeds say no more)

The one they used last year in Moscow (Last year and all the problems they had or were expecting)

 

You are moaning about the Final being held in Rome but there are problems with all sorts of stadia and the last major final to be held there was possibly the World Cup in 90 (I think there must have been one since but can't think). Its the Italians 'turn' to host a big final like this. If you had smaller grounds then the number of tickets going to each side would be about 10,000 (not very popular that one). You have moaned and cited problems with Rome and I say what's the alternative considering it had to be finalised a couple of months ago.

 

You haven't thought it through mate.

 

[Diego_Sideburns]

I'm not sure I agree. You yourself Diego spent quite sometime on here telling us that weren't there about an incident with some unjust stewards in Essex and how wrong it was- you've even bought it up today on the flag site. Stewards in the UK are well trained (certainly as well trained as in other countries), have to pass some sort of test (although when I sat and passed the test it wasn't hard- most sensible sports fans could pass it) but still these stewards caused a problem. Now you are saying stewards are the answer. Make up your mind.

 

So on the one hand we have a steward at Colchester exceeding his authority and being dismissed for assaulting one of our fans. On the other hand we have the notorious Italian riot police who only 'control' visiting fans because they do not want to incur the wrath of the local Ultras.

 

I have made up my mind. Uefa has also made up its mind, but it chooses to turn a blind eye because it's Italy's turn to host the Final.

Edited May 21, 2009 by Diego_Sideburns

[monkeykieran]

I can think of at least 5 venues in the UK alone that would be preferable to both teams (and most teams in the competition). Then a few each in the Netherlands, France, Germany, even Portugal and Spain.

 

Italy is notorius for a reason, they need to prove through events like this that they can manage it I guess.

[rudemedic]

sorry,i'm a bit sleepy still,but whats all this "barca will be happy with that"?

no sure what point you're making here.

happy with size of stadium and if it was there this season?

if so,thats just crap...at stade de france,where i was lucky to be for the final,each club got no more than 20,000.the rest went to freeloaders,sponsors ,uefa etc etc.

 

Sorry maybe I should have been clearer I was being sarcastic when I said Barca will be happy with that. Your point about the Stade De France is just an example you need a stadium of at least 70,000 to host a the Champions League cup final just because of all the tickets that don't go to fans of the two teams. My point was simply if Diego had his way the final would be in Paris, Wembley, Cardiff, Berlin and Barca ad nauseum that leaves for this final Paris or Berlin. I will admit Berlin is a better choice than Rome (but in many ways since the final needs to be decided some time ago it might not have been) but I couldn't see a final in Berlin being trouble free and the same for Paris (with the added on that Paris has hosted the final recently).

 

People have said Rome shouldn't host the final (personally I'm more inclined to say that the Rome Ultras won't bother fighting someone that isn't playing Rome/Lazio unless they are being too aggressive) but where's the alternative? I'd take your word for it that Barca fans won't travel without a ticket (certainly not in the numbers Man U fans are supposed to be going). There won't be too many Roma/Lazio fans inside the stadium so where's the trouble going to be- with those fans who have travelled without tickets. Its quite simple if people without tickets didn't travel there would be a much greater reduced chance of trouble. This might also mean that those tickets which Uefa don't sell to the two teams which convieniently end up on the black market might just lie empty and UEFA see the folly of having so many seats for major finals given to their mates.