How is rooney anywhere near the england side?

[pukka]

It's much, much deeper than a manager and a formation. Except for a brief and somewhat patchy respite under Tel, and that fluke 5-1 in Munich, England have played boring, rigid football for as long as I can remember.

 

I can't see how it will take less than a generation to actually improve the quality of football we play. And that's if the necessary changes were made. Which they won't be.

 

In fact I'll boldly predict, right now, England will win nothing in the lifetime of anyone on this forum.

 

 

Did you watch the "can England win the next world cup" show gary lineker did? It should have been named "what do england have to do to win a world cup in the future?" because it was showing how Spain have achieved what they have and looking at the German improvement.

Spain - It started in the early 90's when Cruyff took over Barcelona. He set up the barca academy as is now. That approach was taken by Real Madrid later. Now all age groups in spain play the same way and are coached similarly. If you go to Andalucia to watch an under 16's training session they do the same thing as at Barcelona (just to a different standard). Its took 20 years for it to achieve what it has.

 

Germany in 1998 had an awful world cup and the same in Euro 2000. In 99 they did a similr thing to revamp their youth system. Ozil etc are the first batch of kids to come through.

 

 

Coaches need to coach kids on how to control a ball, play games where technique is needed rather than brute force. Give kids confidence to just go and play and Big clubs shouldn't be taking so many kids on. They get lost in the system. Barca / Madrid / Munich take on 1/3 the amount of youngsters English academies do.

 

There isn't any reason why england cant do well. They set off from a better starting than Spain did in 1990.

Edited October 13, 2010 by pukka

[garcon]

Yep, saw the programme and I'm a big supporter of the Spanish system and would advocate something similar in England - our equivalent to Cruyff and Barca is Wenger and Arsenal.

 

Another statistic from that programme - there are 24,000 UEFA qualified coaches in Spain. There are 3,000 in England.

 

It can be done, and I fully agree with you in terms of what needs to be done.

 

However I think we're starting from much further back than Spain and Germany did. First of all we have to change an entire culture, starting with the FA and going throughout the grassroots of the game. And even though a huge majority of those in the game can see that, I just don't think it will happen. Too much at stake for those in situ at Soho Square.

[jsslatic]

.

Edited October 13, 2010 by jsslatic

[pukka]

You are probably right on timeframe - I was mainly talking about infrastructure and facilities.

 

The culture needs to change. The powers that be look at short term gains, rather than the bigger picture.

Edited October 13, 2010 by pukka

[leeslover]

 

you can still leave your door open , just dont expect your TV to be there when your back

BT usually has some of the Youth Team lads round his place, no chance of him getting burgled.

[rudemedic]

Yep, saw the programme and I'm a big supporter of the Spanish system and would advocate something similar in England - our equivalent to Cruyff and Barca is Wenger and Arsenal.

 

Another statistic from that programme - there are 24,000 UEFA qualified coaches in Spain. There are 3,000 in England.

 

It can be done, and I fully agree with you in terms of what needs to be done.

 

However I think we're starting from much further back than Spain and Germany did. First of all we have to change an entire culture, starting with the FA and going throughout the grassroots of the game. And even though a huge majority of those in the game can see that, I just don't think it will happen. Too much at stake for those in situ at Soho Square.

 

In some ways I'd agree I'd start with the FA. The number of problems I have with how the FA run could turn this into one of my MEGA posts, so I won't go there.

 

However, I would then start at the top of the English Domestic game, they've all gone out to other European countries and gotten some of the best young talent at 16 (when we can give players a professional contract I think) in a highly dubious manner but not technically illegal. I would shut that loophole now. For example, Fabregas, despite being a Spanish national counts as an Arsenal domestic player, Barca would have never let him go, as demonstrated by the number of times they've been linked to getting him back. However, in England we can offer players a professional contract before they can in their home countries, so for a year (at least) Fabregas was going to be earning money in England as opposed to getting room and board at the now legendary Barca training facility. He made the choice I think most would make and went to Arsenal, despite being a confirmed Barca fan.

 

At United I think of a case which is worse (they did almost exactly the same with Pique and City are linked with a mega-million move for him). They signed Macheda at such a young age one of his parents needed a job to allow him to move, United got Macheda's Dad a job on the ground staff at OT.

 

Obviously Chelsea had the thing with Kakuta but in a couple of years when he's old enough he will count as a "home-grown" player.

 

None of the above have chosen to play for England. So the clubs get the benefit but the country looses out. If the FA fix that then maybe we might produce a young talent like Rooney in the next few years.

[mikejh45]

In some ways I'd agree I'd start with the FA. The number of problems I have with how the FA run could turn this into one of my MEGA posts, so I won't go there.

 

However, I would then start at the top of the English Domestic game, they've all gone out to other European countries and gotten some of the best young talent at 16 (when we can give players a professional contract I think) in a highly dubious manner but not technically illegal. I would shut that loophole now. For example, Fabregas, despite being a Spanish national counts as an Arsenal domestic player, Barca would have never let him go, as demonstrated by the number of times they've been linked to getting him back. However, in England we can offer players a professional contract before they can in their home countries, so for a year (at least) Fabregas was going to be earning money in England as opposed to getting room and board at the now legendary Barca training facility. He made the choice I think most would make and went to Arsenal, despite being a confirmed Barca fan.

 

At United I think of a case which is worse (they did almost exactly the same with Pique and City are linked with a mega-million move for him). They signed Macheda at such a young age one of his parents needed a job to allow him to move, United got Macheda's Dad a job on the ground staff at OT.

 

Obviously Chelsea had the thing with Kakuta but in a couple of years when he's old enough he will count as a "home-grown" player.

 

None of the above have chosen to play for England. So the clubs get the benefit but the country looses out. If the FA fix that then maybe we might produce a young talent like Rooney in the next few years.

 

Some decent points made there, but how many homegrown players have the ball skills that Fabregas had at that age. We need to retrain a lot of the coaches at boys clubs. My brother-out-law has just jacked in at a local junior club because he was fighting a tide of hoofball at 6 years upwards from the manager and nearly every opposition team they played. And was told by the manager he didn't want to see players short passing but get it down the front "route one" as per the Charles Hughes coaching manual. Is there an argument for removing coaching badges or retraining coaches?

[opinions4u]

I quite like Ashley Young, at his level, but if he's our England future then we're destined to be no better than top 16 in the world. If that.

That dive was a shocker.

 

If he'd carried on running they'd have brought him down anyway and we'd have won the game.

 

Plonker.