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Giddings or Bertrand?


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Who Should Play Left-Back?  

39 members have voted

  1. 1. Pick your Loanee Left Back

    • Stuart Giddings
      23
    • Ryan Bertrand
      16


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I'm sure Bertrand will develop into a quality player but IMO he looks lightweight at the moment. Giddens, on the other hand, looks stronger and has greater potential for improvement given he has been out of the game so long. Any views?

Edited by Inspiral_Carpet
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I'm sure Bertrand will develop into a quality player but IMO he looks lightweight at the moment. Giddens, on the other hand, looks stronger and has greater potential for improvement given he has been out of the game so long. Any views?

 

I think Bertrand was better going forward while Giddings was better defending, but i think we will see Bertrand get better as the games go on. I think he'd also do ok playing left wing

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100% Bertrand. Has real quality. He WAS at fault not getting tighter to Pipe in first half; which allowed the goal, however got better and better and looks for forwards along the ground. Looks to have pace and we need players that can find front two.

 

Very impressed with him.

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Guest M_OAFC

There has been a similar previous thread in which I said I'd like to see us try Gidings at left back and Bertrand on the wing. But if we're just talking about who's the best at full back then definitely Giddings for me, wasn't that impressed with Bertrand's defending.

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Yet again on saturday we saw latics concede a goal as a result of two things:

 

1. Terrible Positional play from our full backs

2. A back post header, where our full back is out numbered/ simply out-jumped by a bigger player....

 

I know this is a repeating topic of mine - but I can see this happening time and time again unless this is sorted out, and sorted out soon. Eardley is a good palyer, and had a good game on saturday, but having 2 small attacking full backs just leaves us sooooo exposed on crosses, especially when they are both young and inexperienced, and frequently out of position whilst they have just given the ball away bombing forward.... Bertrand looked ok, but especially in the second half gave the ball away so much, he did some good stuff... but still we conceeded an idetikit goal, purely down to bad full back play....

 

For me - Giddings looked an absolute class act. Solid, strong, always positionally correct, and did the simple things well - and if you have a winger like taylor in front of you, was everything you needed to let Taylor just go out and play. Giddings for me is streets ahead of betrand, eardley and Lomax, and makes us look a much more solid and tidy unit, and you know he will always be in position to make it hard for wingers to put crosses in, and be at the back post to stop free headers reigning in from the other flank....

 

If I was Shez, i would be doing everything I can to keep Giddings for longer.... betrand is a good option as a squad palyer, and to come on and chase a game... but if you are going to stick with Eardley (which I advocate as much as anyone!) you simply cannot cope with another small, tactically naive palyer ont he other flank....

 

Gidding or Bertrand?? For me, the only option is Giddings...

Edited by BigfinLatic
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I agree BFL, I would much prefer Giddings as I thought he looked like a more solid dependable option defensively than Bertrand (who looked better going forward). First and foremost we must defend properly both to stop the crosses coming in and then in the air when or if they do.

I thought Bristol Rovers found it to easy to get crosses in from the Bertrand flank on Saturday both for the goal and for the header that hit the post.

Two small full backs will always leave us vulnerable to far post crosses from either flank.

I would try Bertrand further up the field on the left as he obviously is a talented and pacey player who looked really useful going forward.

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Bertrand!! The lad's got quality running through him. His first touch for a young lad is immense! (had a comparison on saturday with Eardleys first touch), you can see Bertrand is in a different league. Will be a quality player in future i'm sure.

 

Just out of interest - do you sit in the Lookers???

 

This was an accurate assesment of the first half (but when they hit the bar and scored he was woefully caught out..) but in the second half, when he was in front of the main stand, his touch and passing was awful...

 

We just cant afford to carry another "quality player in the future" full back... Giddings is the finished article, and will stop us conceedeing 10-15 goals a season minimum, purely from idiotic/lightweight full back play... that for me far outweighs any attacking advantage...

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Just out of interest - do you sit in the Lookers???

 

This was an accurate assesment of the first half (but when they hit the bar and scored he was woefully caught out..) but in the second half, when he was in front of the main stand, his touch and passing was awful...

 

We just cant afford to carry another "quality player in the future" full back... Giddings is the finished article, and will stop us conceedeing 10-15 goals a season minimum, purely from idiotic/lightweight full back play... that for me far outweighs any attacking advantage...

 

Well assessed BF :applause1: Yes i do! I think we have to bear in mind that (if i'm right) Giddings goes back next week and Bertrand is here till Jan?! I think Bertrand has all the makings now and after watching Giddings also, i believe he will go back into Cov's first team set up v quickly. So we have to be prepared to seeing Bertrands forward thinking rather than a 'solid' full back!

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I didn't think i was?

 

No, I was! I am fully prepared to nail my opinions to the mast and say if we have Bertrand and Eardley at full backs teams will exploit it.... I would love to see this "you score 4 we score 5 attitude" ... but we need more fluency going forward before we can do this... and cant afford these liabilities at full back....

 

Fair enough, Giddings may go back to Cov and there is nothing we can do about it... however can already see the Northamptons, Millwalls and Tranmeres of this division absolutle licking thier lips at the prospect of playing us and using the long diagonal ball to tall man at back post approach....

 

Sorry Rick - I could see before a ball has been kicked that Bertrand is too lightweight! Our full back problems was the only reason we lost on saturday, that was the only way the very average Brizzle can get past us... it will happen time and time again... pull one of em out of position, then bomb a ball in to the far post - easy stuff...

Edited by BigfinLatic
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I can see your concern, but i don't think Bertrand, Eardley, giddings, Lomax or even Stam are equipped to deal with long diag balls over the top! For me only Thomson could cut out that. But i think apart from this weakness, Bertrand, Giddings and Eardley have on evidence done a reasonable job defensively this season and i'm sure Crossley would vouch for that, as he hasn't exactly been 'mowed out' over the last couple of games!

I think most teams will struggle with a 50 yard diag ball over the top, because if you are coping with that then imo, you are too deep anyway!! Especially at home!

Edited by futchers briefs
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I can see your concern, but i don't think Bertrand, Eardley, giddings, Lomax or even Stam are equipped to deal with long diag balls over the top! For me only Thomson could cut out that. But i think apart from this weakness, Bertrand, Giddings and Eardley have on evidence done a reasonable job defensively this season and i'm sure Crossley would vouch for that, as he hasn't exactly been 'mowed out' over the last couple of games!

I think most teams will struggle with a 50 yard diag ball over the top, because if you are coping with that then imo, you are too deep anyway!! Especially at home!

 

I see your point FB... but the fact is we have just lost our first game of the season due to bad full back play. I have no doubt that if Giddings was playing, he would not have been caught out as badly as Bertrand...

 

I think we can afford to have 1 full back "learning" so to speak... howver the other needs to be solid, and able to cover positionally and at the back post on crosses... Gidding is strong, and streets ahead positionally (as is Lomax over eardley...)

 

In 5 years time i'm sure Eardley and Bertrand will be plying thier trade in the Premiership, whilst Giddings and Lomax will prob be decent Champ players at best.... but for me they are both more tactically aware, solid players at the moment... and would give us a better base for our attacking players to take the game to our opponents...

Edited by BigfinLatic
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was 30 crosses and no shots on target not a major contributing factor to the loss rather than 1 mistake from a full back though?

Yes he probably will get caught out, but i guess

A; Giddings was injured

B; Shez possibly looking to the next 6 months as we won't have Giddings but will have Bertrand.

Either way BF, i feel if we don't start scoring soon(which i'm sure we will do!!), we'll be discussing bigger issues than the 'odd' defensive lapse!

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was 30 crosses and no shots on target not a major contributing factor to the loss rather than 1 mistake from a full back though?

Yes he probably will get caught out, but i guess

A; Giddings was injured

B; Shez possibly looking to the next 6 months as we won't have Giddings but will have Bertrand.

Either way BF, i feel if we don't start scoring soon(which i'm sure we will do!!), we'll be discussing bigger issues than the 'odd' defensive lapse!

 

I agree that the lack of penetration is more worrying than the full backs, however, you cant argue that if we were more solid in that position on saturday it would have been 0-0, so the definitive moment in the match was caused by Bertrand going to sleep... for me that was the major contibuting factor to the result...

 

I do agree with what you are saying though... sort out the scoring goals problem, and it makes the full back problem irrelevant... and to be fair, agaist a team as lightweight as Bristol Rovers, the fact we conceeded 1 should not matter, as we should be scoring 4 at the other end...

 

 

I'll get back into my "full back rant" box for now... until the next time....

 

The goal we conceded on Saturday was down more to people not marking rather than a cross coming in. They hit the post from a similar position.

!

 

No, there were 2 key points - Bertrand being totally caught out of position (as he had been in thier warning shot 10 mins earlier), and Eardley not dealing with a far post cross, the non-marking bit.... teams will continue to double up on the back post as they know eardley in particular cant deal with this...

Edited by BigfinLatic
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BF, we lost on Saturday because we didn't take our chances. Yes, the defending for their goal and when they hit the post needs to be improved, but remember that we are a third tier team and mistakes will happen. I would love to see us play Champions League quality football, but lets face facts - we are not at that level.

 

Bertrand and Eardley may not be the finnished articles yet, but if we are to progress we need young talented players coming through - preferably where we can get a fee when they move on to enable us to buy in the quality that you mention. But they will make mistakes.

 

All players at our level will make mistakes like Smalley missing the sitter on Saturday and Giddings firing out of the ground in stoppage time at Carlisle.

 

Bertrand has only played 90 minutes and I hope and believe that the positional organisation of the whole defence will improve as he plays. I don't think it is right to write him off as a "lightweight" before he has even kicked a ball.

 

I certainly hope (and presume that you do too) that he goes on to prove you wrong while playing for us.

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BF, we lost on Saturday because we didn't take our chances. Yes, the defending for their goal and when they hit the post needs to be improved, but remember that we are a third tier team and mistakes will happen. I would love to see us play Champions League quality football, but lets face facts - we are not at that level.

 

Woa there rick! I'm the last person who wants to see anyone getting above thier station on what football we should be expecting from our team... anyone who has heard me rant on about this in the past will know this is exactly why I want our defenders to be defenders first, and worry about going forward second... our players are not good enough to multitask like players do at a higher level... for me, Full backs should get thier positioning right and defend first... and give the ball simple, and this would stop the mistakes such as a young defender being caught terribly out of position after he gives the ball away on the half way line...

 

The fact I dont expect champions league football is exactly why i want to see another type of player than bertrand at full back... I dont expect miracles, just a solid lower division pro who does the simple things first - exactly why i like Lomax and Giddings...

 

I hope bertrand can be the answer as you say.... I really do, but Giddings already is that player...

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BF

 

Sorry, I don't want to take you the wrong way on this, but I think that mistakes

 

1, Will happen at this level

2, Are going to happen with young players and players new to the team

 

I don't agree with your opinion re: fullbacks. I like to see young, attacking and physically capable players in our back 4. I don't think that Charlton and Ajofree brought that much to our team. I am also not convinced with Giddings, but will agree that he was a reasonbably reliable defender.

 

 

 

 

...and Oi, FB....Bertrand and Eardley may not be the "finnished" articles yet,

 

was a typo -> Mr Perfect!!! ^_^

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BF

 

Sorry, I don't want to take you the wrong way on this,

 

:blink::shock: hopefully you wont be taking me any way at all my friend! :wink:

 

I don't agree with your opinion re: fullbacks. I like to see young, attacking and physically capable players in our back 4. I don't think that Charlton and Ajofree brought that much to our team. I am also not convinced with Giddings, but will agree that he was a reasonbably reliable defender.

 

Here is the point we are debating, not the mistakes rubbish... I know as well as you mistakes cant be avoided, I would have alijofree in out team anyday, purely as that is what I believe is needed at this level - Bertrand and Giddings are the classic contrast... and for me we need soliditity rather that attacking, but I uderstand people see it in a different light, my arguement is always that attacking full back are either up and coming, ior defensively inept at this level - and for me, you should be a defender first...

 

Trust me rick - I see what you are trying to say, its just a difference of opinion in playing style, not expectations of players ability - for me someone like bertrand will do more damage than good over the course of a season.... but there are plenty more who will argue against me (eh? Lees, S_W :wink: ) ... I would love to be proved wrong... I really would.... but we will see...

 

If we could get an attacking full back, who bombs forward, who can also get back and defend and can hold his own phsically - then i would bite your hand off for him.... but I seriously have not seen this at this level - they can either do one or the other... and we have wingers to attack... full backs should defend

Edited by BigfinLatic
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BF

 

...and Oi, FB....Bertrand and Eardley may not be the "finnished" articles yet,

 

was a typo -> Mr Perfect!!! ^_^

 

I was referring to the wording being similar to Big Fin (Finnish) Just found it amusing, bearing in mind your debate with the Finmister!!

Was not meant as a pedantic comment! -_-

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