palmer1 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 fine means ok you are sat behind the goal and i didnt see it so fine i take your view on board - what does it mean to you? and i didnt say you blamed him for the first goal did? there are posts on here blaming him for the first though.....and im sorry you cant put the full blame at his door for the second, part yes...but they went the length of the pitch, someone should have covered him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammylatic Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Tarky, however much I like him is one of the weak links of the team at the mo which the oppo is exploiting. Whilst he has good feet with the ball and ok reading of game, he should be taken out of firing line for a bit. Certainly shouldn't be abused on Twitter, Just needs to rebuild confidence and be coached some more. Move Byrne in at CB & bring Brown in makes sense to me for now - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldhamandy1 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 One thing I don't understand is why are moaning about dropping a defender because he's not ready in favour of one coming who is even less ready? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) fine means ok you are sat behind the goal and i didnt see it so fine i take your view on board - what does it mean to you? and i didnt say you blamed him for the first goal did? there are posts on here blaming him for the first though.....and im sorry you cant put the full blame at his door for the second, part yes...but they went the length of the pitch, someone should have covered him! Palmer......you are still missing the point regarding Tarky and the second goal. He stood there arguing in open play.......irrespective whether the other 10 could have done better. His part in not being professional and getting back to do his job is the crux of this whole argument. If he had got back and was outplayed then I would not be here bemoaning him regarding this incident You simply cannot defend him and lay blame elsewhere.........Tarky was at fault...end of!!! Edited August 19, 2012 by mikejh45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palmer1 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) Palmer......you are still missing the point regarding Tarky and the second goal. He stood there arguing in open play.......irrespective whether the other 10 could have done better. His part in not being professional and getting back to do his job is the crux of this whole argument. If he had got back and was outplayed then I would not be here bemoaning him regarding this incident You simply cannot defend him and lay blame elsewhere.........Tarky was at fault...end of!!! im not missing anything at all! i said in my last post you cannot put "full blame" im not saying he is blamless for the second goal but if we cannot stop the ball from going to one end of the pitch to the other because one man is out of position we have bigger problems than Tarky playing centre half! you are ignoring all other factors just to blame one man out of eleven, yes he was at fault for the second but he was not the only one, just like Monday against Sheff Wednesday, there was more than 1 player at fault but Tarky was and is being singled out! Edited August 19, 2012 by palmer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepingthe Faith Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 im not missing anything at all! i said in my last post you cannot put "full blame" im not saying he is blamless for the second goal but if we cannot stop the ball from going to one end of the pitch to the other because one man is out of position we have bigger problems than Tarky playing centre half! you are ignoring all other factors just to blame one man out of eleven, yes he was at fault for the second but he was not the only one, just like Monday against Sheff Wednesday, there was more than 1 player at fault but Tarky was and is being singled out! Listen he said "end of!!!" everyone knows this is an argument winner and you are now casting your seed on fallow land! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Listen he said "end of!!!" everyone knows this is an argument winner and you are now casting your seed on fallow land! Thank you.......best post of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palmer1 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Listen he said "end of!!!" everyone knows this is an argument winner and you are now casting your seed on fallow land! you are right of course! you have shown me the error of my ways......FACT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 you are right of course! you have shown me the error of my ways......FACT! Also thank you.......second best post of the day!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) Well it's started already. Tarky is clearly going to be the new boo boy. I wondered just how long it would take before we found out who it was going to be. Tarky at fault for both goals! Don't make me laugh. Yes the lad makes mistakes, but show me a football game and I'll show you 22 players and a referee who make mistakes. Watch the highlights (lowlights) here on the BBC IPlayer http://www.bbc.co.uk...013_18_08_2012/ For the 1st goal Simpson clearly loses HIS man and has since held his hand up. But hey lets not that little fact stop the witchhunt. The second doesn't show the whole lead up. Changy floats a poor free kick into the box (after Croft was cynically taken out in the middle of the park) which was too easy for the keeper, who then sets a quick breakawy in motion. What is clear is that despite charging back JYM is a good 5-10 yards away from getting anywhere near making it back into position in the centre. Changy had dropped in to cover after taking the free kick and the lad has finished well. Now if JYM can't get back and cover, Tarky who is not as quick hasn't got a cat in hells chance. Despite that he must and i'm sure will learn that he can't be arguing and instead make the effort to get back in position quickly in case the covering players can stop the counter, which is what JYM did. That is being constructive. Not a lot of what I have read above, which just appears to be picking out this seasons new target. Oh and all the mongs on twitter giving him personal grief your just pathetic. Grow up Edited August 19, 2012 by Harry Dowds Green Shirt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Nothing would please me more than Tarky to be taken out of the limelight, hopefully learn his trade and come back into the team a better player than when he left......I don't do witch-hunts hence not apportioning blame over the first goal. I do see a boy not ready for the job and struggling with the weight of expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Nothing would please me more than Tarky to be taken out of the limelight, hopefully learn his trade and come back into the team a better player than when he left......I don't do witch-hunts hence not apportioning blame over the first goal. I do see a boy not ready for the job and struggling with the weight of expectations. Sorry can you just explain what exactly he did wrong yesterday that leads you to claim "I do see a boy not ready for the job" What mistakes did he make yesterday (that other more experienced players didn't). I'm not saying that he didn't make mistakes because as I've said elsewhere, show me a football pitch and I'll show you 23 people making mistakes. I didn't see anything yesterday to justify your claim. Against Sheff Wed on Monday you would have a point for O'grady's 1st goal but I saw nothing yesterday to back up your claim. Which headers did he miss, who did he not mark, where did his concentration slip. Don't claim the 2nd goal. We were attacking, He was pushed up for the set piece with JYM and Byrne. NEITHER got back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 I will say the 2nd goal again.....as a defender, once the attack has broken down, his job is to get back and defend and not pass the buck onto others. His distribution is poor as is his noticable lack of pace and before anyone comments on that....Dave Watson improved his speed by seeing a specialist sprinting coach. Also his poor positional sense as shown last season against Sheff. W. The real culprit in all this is not Tarky but that useless lump Taggart who offers nothing from the touchline. What are the chances of getting an experienced number 2 like the excellent John Gorman was for the Dons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Heck C-Beck Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 haha I am probably one of Tarkowski's biggest critics but from watching those 2 goals I cant see how you can blame him for either! Get angry at him for arguing off the ball maybe yes but to blame him for the 2nd goal? Those people need to get a grip of reality, there is plenty of other Oldham players getting back and not stopping the goal. The first goal he is clearly left with 2 men and you clearly see Simpsons reaction to indicate he knows it is his fault, again cant see why you would solely blame Tarkowski. Personally I would love to replace him with a more experienced CB but cant see why he is getting solely blamed for those 2 goals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 I will say the 2nd goal again.....as a defender, once the attack has broken down, his job is to get back and defend and not pass the buck onto others. His distribution is poor as is his noticable lack of pace and before anyone comments on that....Dave Watson improved his speed by seeing a specialist sprinting coach. Also his poor positional sense as shown last season against Sheff. W. The real culprit in all this is not Tarky but that useless lump Taggart who offers nothing from the touchline. What are the chances of getting an experienced number 2 like the excellent John Gorman was for the Dons. Ah right. I presume you are also blaming JYM and Bynre for the 2nd goal because they didn't get back either. Should they see a sprinting coach? Should they be left out of the side because of it? In any event the sprint issue falls under the remit of Paul Butler the head of sports science. Do you not think that they do any of that already? So now you want to shift the blame to the coach? Who do you suggest as a replacement? he would have to be acceptable to the manager of course and it would only happen if the manager would accept the coach being sacked. Back on point though you keep going back to the 2nd goal and we have a difference of opinion about that so can you point me to anything else yesterday to back your claim up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Ah right. I presume you are also blaming JYM and Bynre for the 2nd goal because they didn't get back either. Should they see a sprinting coach? Should they be left out of the side because of it? In any event the sprint issue falls under the remit of Paul Butler the head of sports science. Do you not think that they do any of that already? So now you want to shift the blame to the coach? Who do you suggest as a replacement? he would have to be acceptable to the manager of course and it would only happen if the manager would accept the coach being sacked. Back on point though you keep going back to the 2nd goal and we have a difference of opinion about that so can you point me to anything else yesterday to back your claim up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Ah right. I presume you are also blaming JYM and Bynre for the 2nd goal because they didn't get back either. Should they see a sprinting coach? Should they be left out of the side because of it? In any event the sprint issue falls under the remit of Paul Butler the head of sports science. Do you not think that they do any of that already? So now you want to shift the blame to the coach? Who do you suggest as a replacement? he would have to be acceptable to the manager of course and it would only happen if the manager would accept the coach being sacked. Back on point though you keep going back to the 2nd goal and we have a difference of opinion about that so can you point me to anything else yesterday to back your claim up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 As I've said before, Tarky did not do his job and try to get back but Mvoto and Byrne did and there is the difference and the crux of th matter. it may have transpired that the Dons would still have scored, we will never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 As I've said before, Tarky did not do his job and try to get back but Mvoto and Byrne did and there is the difference and the crux of th matter. it may have transpired that the Dons would still have scored, we will never know. Yeah you've already said that and I do agree he should be aiming to get back. Hopefully he will learn from that, but that did not cost us the goal. That was the result of a poor free kick from Changy, a quick breakway and an excellent finish Anyway are you going to answer the question? What did you see yesterday to back up your claim that he is a little boy lost. I would genuinely like to know or are you saying that it is only the issue on the 2nd goal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 I do agree he should be aiming to get back. Hopefully he will learn from that, but that did not cost us the goal. Finally, you agree on this point. I've not seen anything so far to say he has learnt from his mistakes. Yesterday, his distribution was very poor with too many hoofballs: his tackling is bordering on reckless and not just this match and his positional sense needs to be addressed. You can agree or disagree and that is your prerogative but at the end of the day, we both call the performances as we see it and neither of us have a claim to be right on this and other issues. It is all about opinions. We have got a young player that burst onto the scene and has not moved up a level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikejh45 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Taggart has to shoulder some of the tactical issues as its been going on for to long. Five six and even seven players out of position implies someone needs a kick up arse. IF the players then consistently fail to follow instructions get rid. However its far to early with new players to expect miracles like a win at MK. I agree regarding Taggart. But should we expect eradication of stupidity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Finally, you agree on this point. I've not seen anything so far to say he has learnt from his mistakes. Yesterday, his distribution was very poor with too many hoofballs: his tackling is bordering on reckless and not just this match and his positional sense needs to be addressed. You can agree or disagree and that is your prerogative but at the end of the day, we both call the performances as we see it and neither of us have a claim to be right on this and other issues. It is all about opinions. We have got a young player that burst onto the scene and has not moved up a level. Now your answering the question at last but your still wrong on the 2nd goal nothing Tarky did cost us the goal. I think he is learning from his mistakes. As an example I thought he got very tight with Lowe to put him off when he had a good chance, somnething he didn't do well enough on Monday for O'Grady's 1st. As for his positional sense, I don't get what you want from him. He has looked far more solid than the end of last season where too many times he was rooted to the spot. He holds the line well, he wins plenty of headers. His long balls forward I would agree with to an extent and would rather see the ball played forward into midfield more often as a 1st option. I don't get the issue of reckless tackling that you raise. Reckless in what way? He hasn't been booked yet, had a stern word from the ref and I'm not convinced he has missed too many tackles Your right it is all about opinions and mine is that Tarky is unjustly being targeted. Very little of it has been constructive. It's took me several attempts to get you to actually come up with anything constructive which I can accept but your original posts contain the following "stupid, dumbass, dickhead, stupidity." that to me is slagging off a player and is personal irrespective of if he is "1 of our own" or bought in. Your posts also clearly blame Tarky for the 2nd goal you state "Tarky was at fault...end of!!!" Whilst be both agree that he should not be arguing with the MK player, please show me how this cost us the goal. I do not believe that you can and therefore it is personal with Tarky. If that is not the case, then you should withdraw the comment. I would have no problem with that and maintaining the point that he shouldn't have been arguing. Just my opinion like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Does anybody remember Tarky's clearance at 0-0? Powerful cross in to the six yard box. Many players would have turned it into their own net. Tarky did brilliantly to get it away for a corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palmer1 Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) as I said if we have 1 player out of position and the other 10 players cant cover for him and stop a break from one end of the pitch to the other, we have bigger problems than an inexperienced centre half. its the course of things on this board though, once people have an opinion on someone they very very rarely change it and then pick out the slightest issues with the players game and highlight it constantly, believing that player is always the one at fault - pathetic! Edited August 19, 2012 by palmer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Dowds Green Shirt Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 Taggart has to shoulder some of the tactical issues as its been going on for to long. Five six and even seven players out of position implies someone needs a kick up arse. IF the players then consistently fail to follow instructions get rid. However its far to early with new players to expect miracles like a win at MK. Winning at MK does not take a miracle. Despite the D&G we often hear about having no chance of beating this team or that. I believe that we always have a chance of taking points in any game. If you don't believe that then there is no point in the game. This league is closer than many believe and it really is all about fine margins and some consistency. Yesterday was interesting in the 1st half especially the tactical game between the 2 managers (and enjoyable from that point of view) and until they scored when Simpson lost his man there was little or nothing between the teams. A quick throw out from the keeper and a breakaway for the 2nd goal. Simpson shooting wide when well placed to score, Tarky being elbowed in the box near the end. Whilst they have also had a couple of chances, the fact remains that there isn't too much between most teams and as we saw with winning at Sheffield Utd last season from 2-0 down away from home, it's not miracles. I would never accept that we can't win. You might not expect to win but you always can win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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