HarryBosch Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 saw Pawel Abbott coming out of the gym today - not due back for a few weeks are they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 saw Pawel Abbott coming out of the gym today - not due back for a few weeks are they? that mean hes already put more effort in than last season??? i get the impression abbott wont get on very well with dickov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yard Dog Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 that mean hes already put more effort in than last season??? i get the impression abbott wont get on very well with dickov You know them both well, then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 (edited) You know them both well, then ? not personnally but i havnt stated or suggested i do so pretty daft question realy Edited June 15, 2010 by davebuckley06 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 not personnally but i havnt stated or suggested i do so pretty daft question realy What makes you feel they will not get on, then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 What makes you feel they will not get on, then? the fact that dickov favours work rate and wants us to defend from the front and the fact abbott doesnt like running when we have the ball let alone when we dont Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie For England Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 the fact that dickov favours work rate and wants us to defend from the front and the fact abbott doesnt like running when we have the ball let alone when we dont What he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 Opinions and all that, but I think Abbott, along with Gregan, is the only reason we're not playing League Two football this season. He's not the sort of player to go chasing dead ends I accept, but he certainly put the effort in and before his injury (which had complications most are still unaware of) was a class apart in this team. Hopefully a full preseason (and the extra effort he's clearly putting in) will see him back to 100% fitness and ready to go for the new season ahead. I loved the effort Paul Warne put in - but I'd rather have two 'lazy' Abbott's scoring 15 goals each than two 'work horse' Warne's getting a dozen between them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yard Dog Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 (edited) the fact that dickov favours work rate and wants us to defend from the front and the fact abbott doesnt like running when we have the ball let alone when we dont Fair enough. I don't agree that Abbott doesn't like running, though. And he's always seemed to work hard to me...just clearly struggled with his fitness at times, due to the injury and operation no doubt. Edited June 15, 2010 by Yard Dog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveoafc Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 A certain young mr. smalley could be in for a shock then if he continues putting in girlie performances! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nez Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 I think it's a bit harsh to say Abbott's lazy. As others have said he's certainly not as much of a work horse as Warne was but he's hardly as lazy as some make him out to be. Also I think it's not possible for a club like us to be able to find a striker who's gonna hit 20 a season and work his nads off each game, as most forwards at this level are either a work horse, or a goal scorer. If we did somehow manage to get hold of one, a bigger club would snap him up in no time. Also, prior to his injury and the games where he was clearly unfit, I do recall him chasing the ball when opposition defenders had it. I'm not saying he'd chase the ball from one flank to the other, but he did close defenders down to some degree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boundaryblue80 Posted June 15, 2010 Share Posted June 15, 2010 (edited) Opinions and all that, but I think Abbott, along with Gregan, is the only reason we're not playing League Two football this season. He's not the sort of player to go chasing dead ends I accept, but he certainly put the effort in and before his injury (which had complications most are still unaware of) was a class apart in this team. Hopefully a full preseason (and the extra effort he's clearly putting in) will see him back to 100% fitness and ready to go for the new season ahead. I loved the effort Paul Warne put in - but I'd rather have two 'lazy' Abbott's scoring 15 goals each than two 'work horse' Warne's getting a dozen between them! Spot on...I'd rather see Abbott in the right place at the right time...than chasing the ball about to appease a section of our lot. That's his partners job to do (something Guy did well at when he came in and Parker sadly failed miserably at.) As said above, had Abbott done as "some" would like we would most definitely be in League Two now...reason being, he wouldn't have been in the right place at the right time to bag the crucial goals he did. I know what I'd rather...I know what Dickov would rather too (someone who knows where the back of the net is)...infact, Dickov would be decent folly for Abbott (even though I'd rather see Dickov manage, over playing.) Edited June 15, 2010 by boundaryblue80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Becketts Anchor Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 the fact that dickov favours work rate and wants us to defend from the front and the fact abbott doesnt like running when we have the ball let alone when we dont I think that's harsh. Abbott spent most of his games last season getting the ball hoofed to him at the edge of the penalty area, then having to make something of it himself whilst overcoming the three defenders that had surrounded him by this point. Wonder why we didn't score many goals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 Opinions and all that, but I think Abbott, along with Gregan, is the only reason we're not playing League Two football this season. He's not the sort of player to go chasing dead ends I accept, but he certainly put the effort in and before his injury (which had complications most are still unaware of) was a class apart in this team. Hopefully a full preseason (and the extra effort he's clearly putting in) will see him back to 100% fitness and ready to go for the new season ahead. I loved the effort Paul Warne put in - but I'd rather have two 'lazy' Abbott's scoring 15 goals each than two 'work horse' Warne's getting a dozen between them! i no no one has said otherwise but just to put my cards on the table i do rate abbott im not one of these who slag him off and call him crap constantly like some do. however if he was as good as some people on here make out he would have scored at least double what he did this season and that just with the chances he had and missed if he was a better player than he is he would have created more chances of his own. and i will admit he was better and less lazy (but still lazy) before his injury. may be wrong but he was injured around november ish??? out for six weeks that gave him half a season to get himself fit even if thrown back in too oon still enough time to catch up and do the extra work himself to get back to fitness. parker did more running than abbott did yet he got called lazy (probably because his running was usless and ineffective) im not saying i would want him to run like warne did coz as you point out it would take away from his game. but its not to much to ask to close down the centre half or full back when they have the ball. working in tandem with the other forward would mean he didnt have to run like warne. but even going forward when we have the ball he often seems to be unwilling to make a run away from the two centre halfs yet when he does it ends up in a chance so why not do it more often?? A certain young mr. smalley could be in for a shock then if he continues putting in girlie performances! i agree. not just abbott who has been lazy and lackluster this season a few people will be gettin a boot up the arse i should imagine. it seems abbott is a love or hate him type of player. but for me our team isnt good enough to be carrying anybody. when we dont have the ball we need to be defending as a team, that didnt happen last season and look were we ended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch_KTF Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 For me Abbott is a quality, fair-weather player. Not great when your home patch is BP! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 i no no one has said otherwise but just to put my cards on the table i do rate abbott im not one of these who slag him off and call him crap constantly like some do. however if he was as good as some people on here make out he would have scored at least double what he did this season and that just with the chances he had and missed if he was a better player than he is he would have created more chances of his own. and i will admit he was better and less lazy (but still lazy) before his injury. may be wrong but he was injured around november ish??? out for six weeks that gave him half a season to get himself fit even if thrown back in too oon still enough time to catch up and do the extra work himself to get back to fitness. parker did more running than abbott did yet he got called lazy (probably because his running was usless and ineffective) im not saying i would want him to run like warne did coz as you point out it would take away from his game. but its not to much to ask to close down the centre half or full back when they have the ball. working in tandem with the other forward would mean he didnt have to run like warne. but even going forward when we have the ball he often seems to be unwilling to make a run away from the two centre halfs yet when he does it ends up in a chance so why not do it more often?? i agree. not just abbott who has been lazy and lackluster this season a few people will be gettin a boot up the arse i should imagine. it seems abbott is a love or hate him type of player. but for me our team isnt good enough to be carrying anybody. when we dont have the ball we need to be defending as a team, that didnt happen last season and look were we ended bit of a contradiction your post...first you say you dont constantly slag him off then the bottom bit suggests you do... the fact is pure and simple,since his injury and his obvious rushed back too soon situation due to our dire attacking abilities and the then managers inability to understand we needed someone there and then...he wasnt 100% fit,he was carrying a niggly injury around and no matter what he did,he couldnt get himself fit enough,hence why he looked knackered most of the time b4 halftime... if he hadnt of scored the goals he did we would be in league 2 today end of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) bit of a contradiction your post...first you say you dont constantly slag him off then the bottom bit suggests you do... the fact is pure and simple,since his injury and his obvious rushed back too soon situation due to our dire attacking abilities and the then managers inability to understand we needed someone there and then...he wasnt 100% fit,he was carrying a niggly injury around and no matter what he did,he couldnt get himself fit enough,hence why he looked knackered most of the time b4 halftime... if he hadnt of scored the goals he did we would be in league 2 today end of. how? Edited June 16, 2010 by davebuckley06 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) how? he wasnt fit...and because he was rushed back he wasnt allowed time to get fit,because penney knew he was our only chance of scoring,which was pretty much proved by the others. if he was allowed to recouperate properly and get 4 or 5 games run out in the ressies he would have been much fitter,but we couldnt afford to do that because we was fighting relegation. oh now you unhighlight the " knackered bit" because the start of your post your saying your not one of those who constantly have a go call him lazy etc etc...then bottom of your post you do...hence contradiction. Edited June 16, 2010 by edhunteruk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 bit of a contradiction your post...first you say you dont constantly slag him off then the bottom bit suggests you do... the fact is pure and simple,since his injury and his obvious rushed back too soon situation due to our dire attacking abilities and the then managers inability to understand we needed someone there and then...he wasnt 100% fit,he was carrying a niggly injury around and no matter what he did,he couldnt get himself fit enough,hence why he looked knackered most of the time b4 halftime... if he hadnt of scored the goals he did we would be in league 2 today end of. Agree totally. Abbott spent most of last season, from November on, both mentally and physically short of fitness and yet still did enough to keep us up. As for Dave's comments that we lacked defensively last season that's a bit daft really isn't it - seeing as we were a bottom six side with a top six defensive record. The main reason for our struggles last season was a lack of goals and seeing as Abbott scored almost all of the ones we did get (13 league goals, next on the list is Guy with 3 (THREE!!)) I think it's astonishing that people slate him. A fully fit Abbott was on for a upper teens or potentially a 20 goal season last year in a team which was the second lowest in goals scored (we scored 39 league goals - that means Abbott scored a THIRD of them and I'd say it's a fair bet he set up a few too!) As always, football's about opinions. But to question Abbott or Gregan last year is to basically misunderstand why we're not playing League Two football! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Heck C-Beck Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 Agree totally. Abbott spent most of last season, from November on, both mentally and physically short of fitness and yet still did enough to keep us up. As for Dave's comments that we lacked defensively last season that's a bit daft really isn't it - seeing as we were a bottom six side with a top six defensive record. The main reason for our struggles last season was a lack of goals and seeing as Abbott scored almost all of the ones we did get (13 league goals, next on the list is Guy with 3 (THREE!!)) I think it's astonishing that people slate him. A fully fit Abbott was on for a lower teens or potentially a 20 goal season last year in a team which was the second lowest in goals scored (we scored 39 league goals - that means Abbott scored a THIRD of them and I'd say it's a fair bet he set up a few too!) As always, football's about opinions. But to question Abbott or Gregan last year is to basically misunderstand why we're not playing League Two football! I'd go one further and say to question Abbott or Gregan last year shows a blatant lack of knowledge about the game of football. I hate that the word lazy gets thrown around just because a player doesn't constantly chase lost causes. I feel we are lucky to have someone like Abbott, who is a goal scoring target man and outlet. I believe he would score and set up a lot more when fully fit with the right partner to play off him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 he wasnt fit...and because he was rushed back he wasnt allowed time to get fit,because penney knew he was our only chance of scoring,which was pretty much proved by the others. if he was allowed to recouperate properly and get 4 or 5 games run out in the ressies he would have been much fitter,but we couldnt afford to do that because we was fighting relegation. oh now you unhighlight the " knackered bit" because the start of your post your saying your not one of those who constantly have a go call him lazy etc etc...then bottom of your post you do...hence contradiction. un highlighted that bit coz i realised i hadnt responded to it. the how bit was to how it was a contradiction. i said im not one who slags him off and call him crap constantly at no stage did i say i did slag him off. i do however think he is lazy as i said in the post but just because i think he is lazy doesnt mean i sit at every game letting him no every two minutes and it doesnt mean i come on here after everygame and say he's :censored:. hes not as good as some people make him out to be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 Agree totally. Abbott spent most of last season, from November on, both mentally and physically short of fitness and yet still did enough to keep us up. As for Dave's comments that we lacked defensively last season that's a bit daft really isn't it - seeing as we were a bottom six side with a top six defensive record. The main reason for our struggles last season was a lack of goals and seeing as Abbott scored almost all of the ones we did get (13 league goals, next on the list is Guy with 3 (THREE!!)) I think it's astonishing that people slate him. A fully fit Abbott was on for a upper teens or potentially a 20 goal season last year in a team which was the second lowest in goals scored (we scored 39 league goals - that means Abbott scored a THIRD of them and I'd say it's a fair bet he set up a few too!) As always, football's about opinions. But to question Abbott or Gregan last year is to basically misunderstand why we're not playing League Two football! your right we did have a good defence but it doesnt change the fact we didnt defend from the front. would we or would we not have a better chance of scoring if we won the ball back 30 yards from there goal with one player between the goal and our player than if we win it back in our own box with there whole team behind the ball? thats a very simplistic view i admit but defending from the front could have givin us a top 4 defence could it not? like you say its all about opinions my opinion is without gregan we would be playing league 2 football with out abbott ye your probably right we would be in league 2 aswel but if he had scored the easy chances he missed he would have got another 10 and we would be in a lot better position than we finished add to that a bit of work rate and chasing down and he could have hit even more goals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebuckley06 Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 I'd go one further and say to question Abbott or Gregan last year shows a blatant lack of knowledge about the game of football. I hate that the word lazy gets thrown around just because a player doesn't constantly chase lost causes. I feel we are lucky to have someone like Abbott, who is a goal scoring target man and outlet. I believe he would score and set up a lot more when fully fit with the right partner to play off him. i think that comment shows a lack of knowledge about the game of football. its actually quite a ridiculous comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slystallone Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) I'd go one further and say to question Abbott or Gregan last year shows a blatant lack of knowledge about the game of football. I hate that the word lazy gets thrown around just because a player doesn't constantly chase lost causes. I feel we are lucky to have someone like Abbott, who is a goal scoring target man and outlet. I believe he would score and set up a lot more when fully fit with the right partner to play off him. Some excellent & eloquent posts on this thread have restored some of my faith that decent football debate can still be found on this site from time to time – get in!! ‘Lazy’ is a term that gets banded about by some towards players; simply for the fact that said players don’t run around like blue arsed flies all game. It also doesn’t help when a lack of player knowledge comes to the fore either; Abbott in his career to-date has never been the type to chase around and pressurise defenders all game; it’s never been in his game. He’s played against us on lots of previous occasions and he never did it during those games; so why all of sudden is he expected to now? His game is all about linking the attacking play – I’d actually say that calling him a target man is doing him a disservice and underplaying some of his skills – for me he is a genuine link striker; around whom all of our attacking threat is centred. Deane Smalley’s goal at BP last season showed what Abbott is all about; the return ball he put into Deano’s path was exquisite and a pass no other player in our side could make. When fit (and fitness was a massive issue for PA last season leading upto & after his operation) we simply don’t have a better attacking player in our side. End of. Just because he doesn’t run himself into the ground and waste an inordinate amount of energy chasing lost causes (the Warne example is perfect one) does not mean he is lazy. I personally am looking forward to see what sort of an effect PD can have on our attacking players; because if he can coach some of his movements etc into the likes of Taylor, Smalley et all, then Abbott will go from strength to strength IMO as he will finally have some players actually looking to get onto some of his flicks, links & knock-downs. But as this thread shows; we don’t all have the same opinions on players. For me; Abbott over any Warne-type any day but that's just my opinion.. Edited June 16, 2010 by slystallone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beag_teeets Posted June 16, 2010 Share Posted June 16, 2010 Going to get shot down in flames as we all have a hole in our arse but next season I want to see Pav paired up with Alessandra up top. Lewis showed that he can bring the best out of strikers with his early season games with Hughes, he isn't the finished article by a long shot but with Dickov coaching him he may be able to kick on and fulfil some of his promise. He still has a long way to go but he is cheap and if he is a success it means we don't have to splash out on a player for that position and spend the wages elsewhere. He has shown he can link the play between the forwards and midfield and on his day he can bag. He might not run through brick walls or be able to chop down a 7 foot centre back but does he really need to as long as he is providing the bullets for Pav? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.