Midsblue Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I never thought for a second that I would convince some of you because I have to admit that I would have loved Neil to stay with us, help us get promotion and forge a successful career with Oldham. That's the Oldham fan in me. However, I don't begrudge the lad maximising his income in the short career that footballers have. The same goes for me in my career and probably everyone else out there. If you could earn 3 or 4 times what you were offered at your current employer for the same job then would you take the money and run? Of course you would and if you reckon you wouldn't then you're lying. Most of you are bitter because he turned us down. He wasn't employed by us like a certain Mr Porter who shafted us big style and DID owe us after we funded his lifestule whilst he was injured. Kilkenny was a "temp" and served a purpose whilst he was here. Neil owed us nothing as it was a short-term deal that we could have been terminated by us at any time. He was a free agent and not committed to us. We'll find new players to carry on our plight for promotion. That's brings me back to my reference to Leeds. I'm not saying that Leeds are better than us but they can offer more money NOW to players due to their crowds. Their attendances can help fund more signings, which provides a greater opportunity to succeed than us at the moment. In respect of Oldham, hopefully the off-field activties will allow greater opportunities for us but at the moment we have to wheel, deal and maximise our scouting to bring in players cheaply with the hope of succeeding for us. Out team ethic can out perform Leeds and other teams in this league without the need for big name players. Good luck to Neil; I'm an Oldham fan first and foremost so it's a shame that he won't be here when we succeed but I have a feeling that we will succeed anyway and we'll soon forget about Neil and be talking about the next new face that comes in and succeeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Apparently he wanted to come to us over championship clubs and surely it has been beneficial for us to have him here. If not, why are people so bitter at him leaving. If he has played well and got a deal with a better club because of it, then surely we must have benefited. Exactly. People are banging on about him showing more commitment but a lot of judgement is being passed without people knowing the figures. How much was he offered? How much did Leeds offer? Was it a longer deal than we could have offered? Was he really on the phone every single day to Alan Hardy pleading like a 5 year old to come 'home'? (Somehow I doubt that last one). I think Neil feels he's repayed us in ensuring we're not stuck in a relegation quagmire at Christmas, because without him we would be. We've won the last 7 away games and in most of them Neil Kilkenny has been crucial in that. He loves the club but a footballer loving a club and a fan loving a club are two different things entirely and this is what people are muddling up. Football is a short career so footballers, especially from the Championship down have to get out of it what they can. Had Kilkenny gone to Doncaster or someone of the same ilk then I'd be unhappy, because that isn't showing much ambition. With respect, their natural level is probably where they are whereas Leeds (as much as it pains me to say this) should be at the very least in the top 6 of the Championship, if not higher. If you can't see this then you're mad as a box of frogs. It's not the be all and end all. Shez knows what he needs now and the money is there to bring someone in. Let's get behind him and whoever the new arrival will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorvik_latic Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Was he really on the phone every single day to Alan Hardy pleading like a 5 year old to come 'home'? (Somehow I doubt that last one). Tis true. Hardy said so in front of Neil to us at the Q and A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Tis true. Hardy said so in front of Neil to us at the Q and A. He probably has cold sweats about spending half a year in either Cardiff or Blackpool then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoytonBlueLad Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Was he really on the phone every single day to Alan Hardy pleading like a 5 year old to come 'home'? (Somehow I doubt that last one). As has been said that is true and the minute Hardy had finished speaking to Kilkenny he then had his father on the phone as well pleading for Hardy to sort something as well. As I've said before I don't mind, he's gone now, cheers and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky_Latic Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 As for Kilkenny not saying about his love for Oldham in his Leeds interviews. Again, firstly why should he and put it with the boot on the other foot and whomever Latics sign in the next few weeks. He in his very first couple of interviews speaks of his love of his former club. Your answer will be - Change the record. I couldnt give a tosh. You're an Oldham player now so stop bleating on about your love for *insert club here*. At least this interview shows he's not done a Wellens and has shown a bit of class. I find it strange the vast majority of times we more often than not fail to part with a player amicably as a majority. Why is that?? Are we so bitter and blue tinted that we cant bare to see any half decent player leave us, even if it is a blatant step up for him. As for the question posed by Nik about the choice, Leeds or Oldham. He asked for you to take the blue tinted glasses off and you still replied Oldham. Ask any Non Latics or Leeds fan who is the bigger club. I'd be suprised if you get ANY serious replies suggesting Latics. Damned if he does and damned if he doesnt with some people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AMO Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Apparently he wanted to come to us over championship clubs and surely it has been beneficial for us to have him here. If not, why are people so bitter at him leaving. If he has played well and got a deal with a better club because of it, then surely we must have benefited. So i will ask again What Commitment did he actually show us. We showed him our commitment and got it thrown back in our faces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 So i will ask again What Commitment did he actually show us. We showed him our commitment and got it thrown back in our faces. Well a cluster of star performances towards the end of his time here even though he didn't have to, given he'd be leaving in January anyway is enough for me. But obviously it's far from enough to the blue-tinted brigade who wish every good player we give a 'chance' ought to turn down chances to play at higher levels and lots more cash to play for the mighty Latics. And lets be really honest now. Both times we've given Kilkenny his 'chance' and got him out of his Brum stiffs 'hell' we've been pretty desperate for him, haven't we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daznathe Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 you cant make the comparison with moving for 3-4 times the money unless you first begged for the job and continually said you love it there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 So i will ask again What Commitment did he actually show us. We showed him our commitment and got it thrown back in our faces. No, we made him an offer. The only commitment he had that I'm aware of was to Birmingham City, and they were happy to release him from that. It's a real glass half full/half empty thing. He came to us for half a season, if he'd not done that then we really couldn't have complained, but having done what he said he would, he has now seemingly incurred some extra obligations about what he should do in the future. I'm reminded in a way of the Luke Beckett situation. The man had played at about 4 clubs on loan and was contracted to Shef Utd, but still people thought he owed loyalty to us. Makes no sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boundaryblue80 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Well a cluster of star performances towards the end of his time here even though he didn't have to, given he'd be leaving in January anyway is enough for me. Or he was putting himself in the shop window Nah, I'm only teasing with that one coz I don't believe that. I do think that KK was unfit when he first came here, he does give his best most times but has the tendancy to pull out of a tackle. Which grated. But yeah, he is a class player on his day and maybe his consistency issues, which I felt held him back (and others ignored and overrated him), were purely down to fitness. We'll never know now. I don't think he was worth what we threw at him, so agree with D_S very much that although it would've been nice to keep him, I'm glad that we haven't at that cost. Don't blame him for going to Leeds though. So basically....I'm quite indifferent on the lad.....for many reasons. But as it's Leeds, I can't wish him well I'm afraid. Wouldn't boo him on return. But then I wouldn't boo most ex-players on return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Or he was putting himself in the shop window Nah, I'm only teasing with that one coz I don't believe that. I do think that KK was unfit when he first came here, he does give his best most times but has the tendancy to pull out of a tackle. Which grated. But yeah, he is a class player on his day and maybe his consistency issues, which I felt held him back (and others ignored and overrated him), were purely down to fitness. We'll never know now. I don't think he was worth what we threw at him, so agree with D_S very much that although it would've been nice to keep him, I'm glad that we haven't at that cost. Don't blame him for going to Leeds though. So basically....I'm quite indifferent on the lad.....for many reasons. But as it's Leeds, I can't wish him well I'm afraid. Wouldn't boo him on return. But then I wouldn't boo most ex-players on return. That's a fair reply mate. I agree with a lot of that and it has left many unanswered questions. So roll on his replacement, may it be a good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AMO Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 (edited) Well a cluster of star performances towards the end of his time here even though he didn't have to, given he'd be leaving in January anyway is enough for me. But obviously it's far from enough to the blue-tinted brigade who wish every good player we give a 'chance' ought to turn down chances to play at higher levels and lots more cash to play for the mighty Latics. And lets be really honest now. Both times we've given Kilkenny his 'chance' and got him out of his Brum stiffs 'hell' we've been pretty desperate for him, haven't we? Just for the record I am not part of the "Blue-Tinted" brigade and never will be. I just think he has the same attitude as Billy Big Balls Wellens and has gone for the money. If he had stayed he would have been a Big Fish in a Small Pond but at Leeds he is going to be Small Fry. Like I have said many times on here he is far to inconsistant for the Championship and will only ever be a mid-table player at best. Im not sorry to see him go TBH. He was paid very well to be here and do what a footballer is supposed to do. He never showed one ounce of commitment to Oldham Athletic as far as i am concerned. OAFC's commitment to Neil Killkenny:- we were the one's who pulled him out of Brums stiffs twice, we were the one's who gave him regular first team football, we were the one's who welcomed him with open arms, we were the one's who were willing to take a big financial risk on him. Neil Killkenny's commitment to OAFC Did what he was being paid for and the chased the money... Just my opinion. Edited January 9, 2008 by AMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 we were the one's who pulled him out of Brums stiffs twice, First time he came to us to get first team experience. Brumm thought he was one for the future. Only second time did we pull him out of it...as such...which isnt true because he had several offers.... we were the one's who were willing to take a big financial risk on him. Did we pay all his wages ? I would think not! Maybe a 50% contribution at most i would of thought.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AMO Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Did we pay all his wages ? I would think not! Maybe a 50% contribution at most i would of thought.... Paying his wages wasn't the financal risk i was talking about, we were going break the bank for the lad and make him our highest earner. No if that isn't show commitment then I don't know what is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sydneyblue Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I really can't see the problem with NK. He made it obvious from day 1 that he was ambitious and wanted to play at a higher level. He hasn't strung us along, doesn't owe us anything and all this ollocks about repaying the 'debt' - we wouldn't have brought him in if he couldn't do the job. Do we have to go through this every time someone leaves? Despising Porter I understand because he shafted the club financially but Kilkenny?? Played well, told the truth and left as expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 In the light and wake of Harry Redknapp coming on camera to explain his reasons for staying put at Portsmouth and rejecting Newcastle I thought it very apt to raise this thread to the top of the board once more. Those that don't agree with me on this topic, and there are a few, need to digest, absorb and take in Harry's and my beliefs. Sure footballers need to take account of a short career and earnings potential when making decisions, no one denies that, however in this case with Kilkenny like Harry sometimes you need to take stock of other key factors. Harry clearly stated Newcastle was a massive club and no doubt was offered mega money, far more than Pompey could offer and it wasn't a problem for himself and Sandra (his wife) to move. But he felt a loyalty to Pompey, for the great support of the fans, the club and it's owners. They'd been good to him and he'd been good to them. So taking in those factors he was staying put....for NOW!!!. For now being the optimum word. That's why I believe Kilkenny should have stayed, at least till the end of ther season. I'd have loved Kilkenny to stay, I believe at this level he's a fantastic footballer, I loved him for the performances he put in once we paid him to get over his injuries! and he loved us for pulling out the stops to end his Brum stiffs nightmare. Yes like Harry his loyalty should have lied with Latics at least till the end of the season. I didn't feel any ill will to Kilkenny when he first time around headed back off to Brum to try fulfil his drean in the prem, he deserved to give himself that chance. This time around is totally different, he pleaded with Latics to give him the chance of spotlight first team football, we did it. Then proceeded to big up his status by our offer and hero symbol support. Good to see Harry prove all you doubters wrong. Cheers Harry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laticsmad Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Or he was putting himself in the shop window Nah, I'm only teasing with that one coz I don't believe that. I do think that KK was unfit when he first came here, he does give his best most times but has the tendancy to pull out of a tackle. Which grated. But yeah, he is a class player on his day and maybe his consistency issues, which I felt held him back (and others ignored and overrated him), were purely down to fitness. We'll never know now. I don't think he was worth what we threw at him, so agree with D_S very much that although it would've been nice to keep him, I'm glad that we haven't at that cost. Don't blame him for going to Leeds though. So basically....I'm quite indifferent on the lad.....for many reasons. But as it's Leeds, I can't wish him well I'm afraid. Wouldn't boo him on return. But then I wouldn't boo most ex-players on return. I think we will miss him big time as yesterday performance so eloquently highlighted--without him, or witout a player of his qualitites, I fear this season will be a washout. Yes we have the january transfer window but to find a player of his qualitites is going to be nigh on impossible. Hope I am wrong!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midsblue Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 (edited) This time around is totally different, he pleaded with Latics to give him the chance of spotlight first team football, we did it. Then proceeded to big up his status by our offer and hero symbol support. Good to see Harry prove all you doubters wrong. Cheers Harry. A few facts: NK did have a choice of a number of clubs last summer but wanted to come to Oldham because of his love for the club. At the time Brum hadn't indicated that they were releasing him but simply that he was available for loan. From NK's point of view, a loan was a loan but Oldham headed the queue from other clubs (even Championship ones) because it was Oldham. Therefore, there was no pleading but it was a mutual interest between our club and the player. Prior to January, circumstances changed at Brum and NK was told that he could leave. As a result, a number of club took interest and a small number came forward with a formal offer. He was allowed to choose between them. He went for two reasons; money and potential. I can't blame him on either because it's a job at the end of the day and if I was in his position then I'd put money first because careers are short and can end tomorrow (I've witnessed this first hand and I can't underline this enough). He's not a mercenary and whoever slates him are doing so without the full facts and with complete ignorance. He never used us a stepping stone but purely to help us out under the current circumstances i.e. Brum were loaning him out. Edited January 13, 2008 by Midsblue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Midsblue, with due regard please tell me what facts you've outlined above to which I haven't addressed? I believe Redknapp as shown the loyalty to which I referred I believe Kilkenny should have had towards Latics, if only to the end of the season. Nothing will change my mind what so ever on this. The club did everything to bring Kilkenny here and keep him here. Latics have been absolutely superb to Kilkenny. If I start to believe he owed us no loyalty and to face facts that players of a certain quality are to good for this club, is the day I stop goin to BP cos we've never no chance of doin anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigfinLatic Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Midsblue, with due regard please tell me what facts you've outlined above to which I haven't addressed? I believe Redknapp as shown the loyalty to which I referred I believe Kilkenny should have had towards Latics, if only to the end of the season. Nothing will change my mind what so ever on this. The club did everything to bring Kilkenny here and keep him here. Latics have been absolutely superb to Kilkenny. If I start to believe he owed us no loyalty and to face facts that players of a certain quality are to good for this club, is the day I stop goin to BP cos we've never no chance of doin anything. The only massive difference with your redknapp analogy is that 'arry is already a multi-multi millionaire, with a house in Sandbanks (The richest area of the country) and has absolutely no need to further his career, or move somewhere that offers more money.... not to mention disrupt his entire family, whom all live within 5 mile sof each other, he was not just moving accross the pennines, but about as far away in the UK you can get... KK on the opposite is at the start of his career, no family and kids, and looking to build a future for himself - a better offer came along and he took it as he thought it is the best way for him to secure his future career and financial success - which is probably true... Its easy to claim loyalty when you have all the money in the world and are a local legend - for me, the two examples are worlds (or an entire career) apart.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 OK I'll wait for someone else to do a comparison with if you want to pick holes into someone showing loyalty, which was the point. Anyway one things for sure Kilkenny won't be back this way again and I am bloody glad about it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertie_Dugger Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Don't think it's fair to compare the thought processes with regard to loyalty of Rednapp and Kilkenny. The former is a well established Premiership Manager with a good playing career behind him with a settled life and family. The latter is a young man still learning his trade who allegedly likes a good night out probably feels insecure. Different as chalk and cheese. Yes I thought Kilkenny would sign for us after the Leeds game but it wasn't to be. Different age groups with different mentalities. Probably why you'll never see an old moaner carrying a drum into the "Lookers Upper." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 (edited) I sit in the lookers upper, so whats your point? Loyalty is loyalty in my book. Edited January 13, 2008 by Lags Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertie_Dugger Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 So do I and I'm getting a little peed off with the reasons being given by some on here that all our problems at home are being caused by people like you and me. I don't sing very often a football matches bit I never moan at the players. It's a young team with little experience and they are going to be inconsistent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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