BeckfordsRightFoot Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 (edited) 1. A cruise liner 2. A dwarf 3. One of those moving rocks in Death Valley 4. The Nazi invasion of Russia I choose option 4. Edited August 21, 2009 by BeckfordsRightFoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 I choose option 4 That makes a whole load of sense... Edit: Prior to his edit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeckfordsRightFoot Posted August 21, 2009 Author Share Posted August 21, 2009 That makes a whole load of sense... You dont study history presumably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 You dont study history presumably. I dont edit my posts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritchie82 Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 I dont edit my posts... What a lad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 I think you'll find the Nazi invasion of Russia was pretty quick actually. It depends on what you define as quick but reaching the boundary of Moscow by the winter of 1941, considering they had only set foot in the Soviet Union in the previous July. That's pretty good going considering they had to march 1000's of troops nearly 600 miles in 5 months while fighting. Granted, the soviet offensive threw them right back, with the soviets being more acclimatised to the harsh winter that eventually froze the germans out but as an invading force, they moved the length on Britain in five months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razza699 Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 I think you'll find the Nazi invasion of Russia was pretty quick actually. It depends on what you define as quick but reaching the boundary of Moscow by the winter of 1941, considering they had only set foot in the Soviet Union in the previous July. That's pretty good going considering they had to march 1000's of troops nearly 600 miles in 5 months while fighting. Granted, the soviet offensive threw them right back, with the soviets being more acclimatised to the harsh winter that eventually froze the germans out but as an invading force, they moved the length on Britain in five months. Yehh history top trumps ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeckfordsRightFoot Posted August 21, 2009 Author Share Posted August 21, 2009 Hmmm. It is widely considered as a major factor in the Nazi's downfall. It wasn't very fast. In the South Pole, until his death, Captain Scott walked over 1000 miles in 90 days pulling 280lbs behind him in -40 degrees as a comparison. Coincidentally, Hitlers quote about the Russian campaign "We shall kick in the door and the whole rotting structure will collapse" is a good metaphor for Latics upcoming season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OminousPoultry Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 1. A cruise liner 2. A dwarf 3. One of those moving rocks in Death Valley 4. The Nazi invasion of Russia I choose option 4. where's option 5 - as ruthless as Simon Cowell and as tight as his trousers? not that I'm expecting any votes but we must be seen to be fair. TCF I believe it's called. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 I think you'll find the Nazi invasion of Russia was pretty quick actually. It depends on what you define as quick but reaching the boundary of Moscow by the winter of 1941, considering they had only set foot in the Soviet Union in the previous July. That's pretty good going considering they had to march 1000's of troops nearly 600 miles in 5 months while fighting. Granted, the soviet offensive threw them right back, with the soviets being more acclimatised to the harsh winter that eventually froze the germans out but as an invading force, they moved the length on Britain in five months. June 1941 actually! Part of the reason but also a popular myth that is overplayed, the further the Russians retreated the more Stalin ordered the sabotage of Russia's infrastructure thus the Germans being denied vital supplies through an ever-widening supply line to the front and the fact there was little they could use internally. The weather did catch them out but that was only part of the reason - another large factor was the sheer logistics of trying to invade a coutry as vast as Russia using continuing 'bltzkrieg' tactics. Another reason was the fact the Nazis solit their forces in order to tray and control the vital Ukrainian oilfields. AND just as things began to go awry in the East, the Japanese attack Pearl Harbour, Hitler declares war on the US giving Roosevelt the excuse he needed to declare war 'officially'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 June 1941 actually! Part of the reason but also a popular myth that is overplayed, the further the Russians retreated the more Stalin ordered the sabotage of Russia's infrastructure thus the Germans being denied vital supplies through an ever-widening supply line to the front and the fact there was little they could use internally. The weather did catch them out but that was only part of the reason - another large factor was the sheer logistics of trying to invade a coutry as vast as Russia using continuing 'bltzkrieg' tactics. Another reason was the fact the Nazis solit their forces in order to tray and control the vital Ukrainian oilfields. AND just as things began to go awry in the East, the Japanese attack Pearl Harbour, Hitler declares war on the US giving Roosevelt the excuse he needed to declare war 'officially'. Wasn't far off. I find it interesting, the full chain of events that occurred and if, Japan for example, were not such a large force the war may have been confined to Europe and North Africa meaning the US wouldn't have got involved (at least not until later). Hitler burnt his big bridges with China when he declared a pact with Japan, if he'd have kept the Chinese on board Russia would have been squeezed from both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 June 1941 actually! Part of the reason but also a popular myth that is overplayed, the further the Russians retreated the more Stalin ordered the sabotage of Russia's infrastructure thus the Germans being denied vital supplies through an ever-widening supply line to the front and the fact there was little they could use internally. The weather did catch them out but that was only part of the reason - another large factor was the sheer logistics of trying to invade a coutry as vast as Russia using continuing 'bltzkrieg' tactics. Another reason was the fact the Nazis solit their forces in order to tray and control the vital Ukrainian oilfields. AND just as things began to go awry in the East, the Japanese attack Pearl Harbour, Hitler declares war on the US giving Roosevelt the excuse he needed to declare war 'officially'. Favourite quote was a German commander who sent a message to Berlin asking when he might expect winter clothing and supplies to arrive on the Russian front. He was told not to make such unecessary requests again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Hmmm. It is widely considered as a major factor in the Nazi's downfall. It wasn't very fast. In the South Pole, until his death, Captain Scott walked over 1000 miles in 90 days pulling 280lbs behind him in -40 degrees as a comparison. Coincidentally, Hitlers quote about the Russian campaign "We shall kick in the door and the whole rotting structure will collapse" is a good metaphor for Latics upcoming season. You're right, it is a major factor, but if the Nazi's had managed to take Moscow, they were so close, things could have been different. Captain Scott wasnt fighting as he was going, nor was he trying to contain civilians and nor was he trying to keep a constant supply chain going considering what Prozac said above about destroying infrastructure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 June 1941 actually! Part of the reason but also a popular myth that is overplayed, the further the Russians retreated the more Stalin ordered the sabotage of Russia's infrastructure thus the Germans being denied vital supplies through an ever-widening supply line to the front and the fact there was little they could use internally. The weather did catch them out but that was only part of the reason - another large factor was the sheer logistics of trying to invade a coutry as vast as Russia using continuing 'bltzkrieg' tactics. Another reason was the fact the Nazis solit their forces in order to tray and control the vital Ukrainian oilfields. Ahh, those crucial "scorched earth" tactics. It always made me wonder why the Nazis didn't really take us out of the war. I think this is more significent than failing in Russia. The worst mistake I think that Hitler made in the entire war was to let us escape at Dunkirk. We'd have been no match for a sea assult in the way that we carried out D-Day. We had little to no defence of the coast and would have submitted as soon as they marched into London. The US would never have entered the European War having had no base here. If that would have happened, the failing on the Eastern Front wouldn't have had the disasterous impact that it did, and it's likely the Berlin Wall would have been more like the Warsaw Wall and that a further world war could have broken out but with a much stronger German led force attacking Russia. The Battle Of Britain was key, but still I really think an amphibious invasion by Germany a few weeks after Dunkirk would have nailed us. Strewth! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sheridans_world Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Ahh, those crucial "scorched earth" tactics. It always made me wonder why the Nazis didn't really take us out of the war. I think this is more significent than failing in Russia. The worst mistake I think that Hitler made in the entire war was to let us escape at Dunkirk. We'd have been no match for a sea assult in the way that we carried out D-Day. We had little to no defence of the coast and would have submitted as soon as they marched into London. The US would never have entered the European War having had no base here. If that would have happened, the failing on the Eastern Front wouldn't have had the disasterous impact that it did, and it's likely the Berlin Wall would have been more like the Warsaw Wall and that a further world war could have broken out but with a much stronger German led force attacking Russia. The Battle Of Britain was key, but still I really think an amphibious invasion by Germany a few weeks after Dunkirk would have nailed us. Strewth! It's well documented that Hitler wanted the English as allies from early in his chancellorship, he was contantly trying to agree pacts with England and keep them sweet. It was only in 1938 (I think) when Germany annexed Austria and Sudetenland that England refused to sanction Germany and the invasion of Poland on 1 September 1939 was the icing on the cake for Anglo-German relations. "You started it" "No you started it" "NO YOU started it by invading Poland!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosa Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 i'm confused. are you calling Gregan a Nazi? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 (edited) It's well documented that Hitler wanted the English as allies from early in his chancellorship, he was contantly trying to agree pacts with England and keep them sweet. It was only in 1938 (I think) when Germany annexed Austria and Sudetenland that England refused to sanction Germany and the invasion of Poland on 1 September 1939 was the icing on the cake for Anglo-German relations. "You started it" "No you started it" "NO YOU started it by invading Poland!" Yeah, I know that. Hitler admired us, and how we built an empire is similar to his vision of it. Except he took to murdering half the countries he took over. It was the decision to worry us by launching an air assult rather than just hitting us on the coast like we did on D-Day (with paratroop support, natch) that he probably regrets the most. I still think Angela Lansbury and her ghost army of empty suits of armour proved too much of a risk for them. Edited August 21, 2009 by Frankly Mr Shankly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 The Battle Of Britain was key, but still I really think an amphibious invasion by Germany a few weeks after Dunkirk would have nailed us. Strewth! Nah, them big metal things that float on water would have slaughtered them. The Germans had next to no planes suitable for attacking naval forces and no chance of getting their own navy out for a rumble. It would have been no fun being towed across the Channel in a river-barge full of horses and artillery pieces while dozens of destroyers were sailing back and forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 (edited) Nah, them big metal things that float on water would have slaughtered them. The Germans had next to no planes suitable for attacking naval forces and no chance of getting their own navy out for a rumble. It would have been no fun being towed across the Channel in a river-barge full of horses and artillery pieces while dozens of destroyers were sailing back and forward. What? So for all the Hugo Boss-designed uniforms, and equipment that was years ahead of anyone else's, they didn't have a few boats that were better than ours? I thought our navy were :censored: scared of theirs, what with the U-Boats and all that lot. Nah, they missed a trick not taking Dover post haste. We were gubbed at Dunkirk and he opted for an air assult ahead of an amphibious invasion to follow it up. FAIL. Edited August 21, 2009 by Frankly Mr Shankly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Nah, them big metal things that float on water would have slaughtered them. The Germans had next to no planes suitable for attacking naval forces and no chance of getting their own navy out for a rumble. It would have been no fun being towed across the Channel in a river-barge full of horses and artillery pieces while dozens of destroyers were sailing back and forward. The fact Operation Sealion was a non-starter and Hitler knew this, he had a small window of opportunity in late Summer 1940 when they had control of the skies over the South-East, they changed tactic by attacking our cities. If he'd wanted to, that was the time to launch a full-scale invasion. But Adolf knew that his 3 pedaloes, six canoes and a gondola would be destroyed by the fleet patrolling the North Sea and the channel. Hitler admired the Royal Navy and wasn't stupid enough to launch a full scale assault in home waters - and as you say despite having some control of the skies they hadn't enough air-support or landing craft to carry out any invasion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 What? So for all the Hugo Boss-designed uniforms, and equipment that was years ahead of anyone else's, they didn't have a few boats that were better than ours? I thought our navy were :censored: scared of theirs, what with the U-Boats and all that lot. Nah, they missed a trick not taking Dover post haste. We were gubbed at Dunkirk and he opted for an air assult ahead of an amphibious invasion to follow it up. FAIL. The Nazis should have slaughtered us at Dunkirk, they didn't. Hitler didn't want to fight us, in his words it was fighting the 'Wrong War'. He thought us shot anyway after Dunkirk, so he turned his attentions to the airfields in the South East to try and completely knock us out of the war. Despite our defeat we were still launching long range bombing missions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 (edited) What? So for all the Hugo Boss-designed uniforms, and equipment that was years ahead of anyone else's, they didn't have a few boats that were better than ours? I thought our navy were :censored: scared of theirs, what with the U-Boats and all that lot. Nah, they missed a trick not taking Dover post haste. We were gubbed at Dunkirk and he opted for an air assult ahead of an amphibious invasion to follow it up. FAIL. I think one of their main chaps Admiral Rader? had been promised a vast Navy in the 30s, they came up well short. The U-boats enjoyed a free hand for a while, but once we developed new technologies the Wolf-packs although inflicting losses throughout the war became less effective as the war wore on. Particularly with the development of long range air support which slowly closed the mid-Atlantic air-gap. Edited August 21, 2009 by oafcprozac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 What? So for all the Hugo Boss-designed uniforms, and equipment that was years ahead of anyone else's, they didn't have a few boats that were better than ours? I thought our navy were :censored: scared of theirs, what with the U-Boats and all that lot. Nah, they missed a trick not taking Dover post haste. We were gubbed at Dunkirk and he opted for an air assult ahead of an amphibious invasion to follow it up. FAIL. They had some very good ships, obviously the Bismarck* and Tirpitz were much more than a match for any battleship that could meet them one on one but as a whole they were nowhere near our league. U-boats don’t even come into it, it’s one thing picking convoys off in the middle of the Atlantic but quite another hanging around with literally hundreds of warships floating over you. They’d all have died very quickly. In any case, what makes you think they could have just hopped on a ferry and landed an army a couple of weeks after fighting across France? D-day took years of planning, logistical build-up, intelligence gathering and so on. Even when they did put a plan together it really was based on towing barges across the Channel and horse drawn field pieces. *Incidentally I recently read Ludovic Kennedy’s account of the Bismarck’s brief career, well worth a read, will lend it you if you fancy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footy68 Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 So, does this prove the initial poster wrong? Love all the history by the way, being an ex war type person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Ritchie Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Blitzkrieg = lightning war Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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