outoftheblue Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 The Glazers took a real kicking from the Panorama team last night. Their £1.1Billion debt has been discussed quite a lot recently, but Panorama did a great job of explaining the true state of their finances. These b*st*rds have helped push the game into the state it's in by borrowing money and inflating players values and wages by throwing that cash around, thus the knock-on effect is felt more by the penniless clubs in the lower leagues who are having to spend money they haven't got just to compete in the game. The programme gave a great insight into how people like the Glazers can take out mortgages to build shopping malls etc, then borrow money against the malls, by claiming them as assets. Of the £800m they paid for United, £500m was borrowed from various sources, and the rest came from their 'own money' which just happened to be borrowed against their already mortgaged businesses. Their business plan is to recoup the costs by fleecing the fans, but they're nowhere near covering their interest payments, so Christ knows who is going to pay for the shortfall, but you can guarantee the football fan will end up shelling out more. The United fans have every reason to despise the Glazers - and so have we. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danoafc Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 The Glazers took a real kicking from the Panorama team last night. Their £1.1Billion debt has been discussed quite a lot recently, but Panorama did a great job of explaining the true state of their finances. These b*st*rds have helped push the game into the state it's in by borrowing money and inflating players values and wages by throwing that cash around, thus the knock-on effect is felt more by the penniless clubs in the lower leagues who are having to spend money they haven't got just to compete in the game. The programme gave a great insight into how people like the Glazers can take out mortgages to build shopping malls etc, then borrow money against the malls, by claiming them as assets. Of the £800m they paid for United, £500m was borrowed from various sources, and the rest came from their 'own money' which just happened to be borrowed against their already mortgaged businesses. Their business plan is to recoup the costs by fleecing the fans, but they're nowhere near covering their interest payments, so Christ knows who is going to pay for the shortfall, but you can guarantee the football fan will end up shelling out more. The United fans have every reason to despise the Glazers - and so have we. Would have been more impressed if the programme had gone on to explain how all of this effects clubs and more importantly the fans further down the pyramid. As is was it looked like it had been written and financed by the 'Red Knights' as a sob story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 Would have been more impressed if the programme had gone on to explain how all of this effects clubs and more importantly the fans further down the pyramid. As is was it looked like it had been written and financed by the 'Red Knights' as a sob story. I think we should put club loyalties to one side and organise a bucket collection for our impoverished neighbours at the first home game next season, and show that football fans of whatever club are one family - brothers, in fact. However much we might detest and despise Manure, we should pull together. I feel sure that fans of Liverpool, Leeds and every other club in the country will be doing likewise. It's such a shame... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 I watched it but couldn't help feeling disappointed. There is so much substance to that story that wasn't even touched on. More detail on how that £1.1Bn debt is made up, and just some detail of what comprises their supposed $2.4Bn assets. (Note the difference between pounds and dollars there). Even with complete stonewalling by the club and the FA (inevitable) I feel sure they could have dug further and given us more of the facts. As it is, the selection of facts given juts allows you to interpret one conclusion while the club can argue another. I guess that's just part of the dumming down of the BBC - Panorama is nothing like the heavyweight investigative show it used to be a decade or so ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorrro Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 dumming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 Bugger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 I'm not sure too much of what the Glazers are doing has filtered down to our level. The wages at ManUre haven't gone up by that much (if at all) in the time since the Glazers arrived, unlike say Chelsea, Citeh, Real Madrid, Pompey etc. What the Glazers seem to be doing is ripping of the fans in every way possible- by putting season ticket prices up, making compulsory purchase of cup games, making them sell any unwanted tickets back to the club at a loss. In that time our ticket prices have remained constant, our season ticket prices have gone down in a few cases and we haven't introduced the compulsory buying of cup games. However, where I would be worried if I was an Oldham fan is about where our owners have their money. As by the sound of it some of our owners money is tied up in property (mainly commercial) in the States. That property has decreased in value significantly- as demonstrated by the fact the Glazers have to sell some of their malls (or are in serious negative equity with some of them). ManUre are making a mockery of their fans- so what. In some ways that is good for us as every year x number of fans stop going as they can no longer afford it. A % of those fans might turn up to the odd game for us (I know a couple that have already done so). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outoftheblue Posted June 9, 2010 Author Share Posted June 9, 2010 Bugger. No. That's bumming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outoftheblue Posted June 9, 2010 Author Share Posted June 9, 2010 I'm not sure too much of what the Glazers are doing has filtered down to our level. The wages at ManUre haven't gone up by that much (if at all) in the time since the Glazers arrived, unlike say Chelsea, Citeh, Real Madrid, Pompey etc. What the Glazers seem to be doing is ripping of the fans in every way possible- by putting season ticket prices up, making compulsory purchase of cup games, making them sell any unwanted tickets back to the club at a loss. In that time our ticket prices have remained constant, our season ticket prices have gone down in a few cases and we haven't introduced the compulsory buying of cup games. However, where I would be worried if I was an Oldham fan is about where our owners have their money. As by the sound of it some of our owners money is tied up in property (mainly commercial) in the States. That property has decreased in value significantly- as demonstrated by the fact the Glazers have to sell some of their malls (or are in serious negative equity with some of them). ManUre are making a mockery of their fans- so what. In some ways that is good for us as every year x number of fans stop going as they can no longer afford it. A % of those fans might turn up to the odd game for us (I know a couple that have already done so). Quite agree - I have no sympathy whatsoever for Utd supporters. It is the fact that it is such an easy thing to do for a business group, and there has to be some impact on the leagues below, even if it is only bigger teams being able to snap up all the youth team players whilst we now have to be ultra cautious in our selection. Having the extra cash is always going to have its advantages. I'd like to think City's youth squad becomes that large that they can loan us a few of the better ones that are in need of experience, but I fear that they'll concentrate more on buying the best European players at the expense of their youth, while Utd take their pick of the young 'uns. Doesn't help us much, that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latic12345 Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 I thought it was a really poor documentary. It was hugely over simplified for the bitesize generation. My favourite line was "if it wasn't for the fans, the Glazer's wouldn't have been able to buy Manchester United". These was implying it is the fans paying the debt of Glazer's. I think you'll find, if it wasn't for the fans, "Manchester United wouldn't exist in the first place! It's a total shocker though. Who would have thought an LBO company using income to pay debts and structuring themselves tax efficiently. Has no-one informed the taxman?!?! (Note this is another reason to hate United - they get away with avoiding £80m of tax per year). Anyway, now I'm off rant, I just can't wait for Scummers to play Norwich in the FA Cup with Glazer's still in charge. No-one will know which way to look.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 Anyway, now I'm off rant, I just can't wait for Scummers to play Norwich in the FA Cup with Glazer's still in charge. No-one will know which way to look.... There'll only be one way to tell them apart ... the Norwich fans only have one surname. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddy the owl Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 I flicked over and caught some of it. I was more impressed that my old school mate was on it. The was the guy from the independent supporters called David Boyle, done pretty well for himself considering he originally wanted to become a politician. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 I thought it was a really poor documentary. It was hugely over simplified for the bitesize generation. My favourite line was "if it wasn't for the fans, the Glazer's wouldn't have been able to buy Manchester United". These was implying it is the fans paying the debt of Glazer's. I think you'll find, if it wasn't for the fans, "Manchester United wouldn't exist in the first place! It's a total shocker though. Who would have thought an LBO company using income to pay debts and structuring themselves tax efficiently. Has no-one informed the taxman?!?! (Note this is another reason to hate United - they get away with avoiding £80m of tax per year). Anyway, now I'm off rant, I just can't wait for Scummers to play Norwich in the FA Cup with Glazer's still in charge. No-one will know which way to look.... What's Norwich got to do with anything? Just asking like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razza699 Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 Couldnt happen to a nicer team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 What's Norwich got to do with anything? Just asking like. The yeller and the green. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 The yeller and the green. Ah. I see. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stebuzz Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 (edited) No. That's bumming. just watched it on bbc i player. thought it was good and they went to america to find they own 64 shopping malls, most of which arent doing well and 63 of them are on mortgage. also the football club over there stopped receiving the money they used to get once united had been bought by the glazers. the worrying thing was that no-one from the glazers , the premier league or the government was willing to talk about it. but in the end it left you with a nice warm feeling that man united might just go tits up at their expense. Edited June 9, 2010 by stebuzz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 9, 2010 Share Posted June 9, 2010 The yeller and the green. I passed a bloke covered in that :censored: just before I left London. Naturally I gave him my most concentrated evils for the 50 yards I had. Felt a bit rotten when I realised he was a Norwich fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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