garcon Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I never said that. I recognise I am in a significant minority of supporters who would not be against a move out of the borough. The small mindedness I was referring to was for the fans who will not accept anything other than a stand by stand redevelopment of BP, who think that just building a new broadway stand will do, who are moaning about the possibility of the club changing the badge (despite the fact its not the first time it has changed), whom always think the answer to problems is turning to the past (the 'bring' <insert popular ex player or manager> back' brigade). Those where the group of fans I was referring to. There's a collective noun for people like that. People who are psychologically allergic to change, who keep harping back to the past, who hate anything new and all outsiders. Oldhamers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_bro Posted April 23, 2011 Author Share Posted April 23, 2011 And it's the small mindedness of our fans who are happy to have a new four sided ground at our current site. But they dont realise that it will be worst to do that for the football club. It will just put us in more debt and would kill us off. Thats why we need to bring in revenue in on non match days keep us going but like you said L_C our small minded fans wouldnt accept that. I'm not small minded. OK a new stadium would be novel to start with, and would provide income all week, but so could BP. As I've said the size of stadium being looked at would keep us where we are. OK we may have t6he odd foray into the Championship, but would not be able to cash in properly. For me a 12000 seat stadium is not good enough for a future in the Championship and new owners have to be found before any new stadium is built so that we can compete at that level with a 20000 seat stadium. It's about planning for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I'm not small minded. OK a new stadium would be novel to start with, and would provide income all week, but so could BP. As I've said the size of stadium being looked at would keep us where we are. OK we may have t6he odd foray into the Championship, but would not be able to cash in properly. For me a 12000 seat stadium is not good enough for a future in the Championship and new owners have to be found before any new stadium is built so that we can compete at that level with a 20000 seat stadium. It's about planning for the future. But if you only have a stadium you only have match day revenue which is all what have now, and look how its helping us now. Getting revenue in during non match days can only do the club good. exactly planning for the future but the future is not at bp. dont get me wrong i love the place but it has to go for us to move forward as a club and dare i say move forward as a town. im interested al_bro how could bp bring in money on non match days ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_bro Posted April 23, 2011 Author Share Posted April 23, 2011 I never said that. I recognise I am in a significant minority of supporters who would not be against a move out of the borough. The small mindedness I was referring to was for the fans who will not accept anything other than a stand by stand redevelopment of BP, who think that just building a new broadway stand will do, who are moaning about the possibility of the club changing the badge (despite the fact its not the first time it has changed), whom always think the answer to problems is turning to the past (the 'bring' <insert popular ex player or manager> back' brigade). Those where the group of fans I was referring to. I would also accept a site in Thameside if it was big enough, but aren't there Football League rules which state that we have to play in the same town. I say redevelop BP because we have been told that there is no site in Oldham big enough. Whats wrong with building the cash generating stuff in Failsworth and redevloping BP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 True there would be some limitations due to being surrounded by residential property - especially with those to the west (behind the Chaddy) already started. But do you honestly believe we're going to see some magical plan for an all new stadium in an as yet undisclosed location that has income generating facilities far beyond the plans we had for Boundary Park pre-crash? Bear in mind the only things that ever seem to get built in Oldham are houses and retail outlets. (And maybe the odd, empty office). I don't think wanting to stay at the BP site is small minded. Not understanding the need for extra income is. Refusing to temporarily go to a ground share during redevelopment most certainly is. And turning down the real alternative of a better site with better facilities would be. But that option doesn't exist, yet. Think you hit the nail on the head with that sentence. If after examination of sites available, BP was the most viable for a stadium plus extra facilities, then I would be all for staying if it meant that we bite the bullet, groundshare for a few seasons, and build a new stadium on the site rather than doing it stand by stand, which would take the best part of 5-8 years. Given the state BP is currently in, I think we have next season and if we are lucky, the season after, at Boundary Park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Think you hit the nail on the head with that sentence. If after examination of sites available, BP was the most viable for a stadium plus extra facilities, then I would be all for staying if it meant that we bite the bullet, groundshare for a few seasons, and build a new stadium on the site rather than doing it stand by stand, which would take the best part of 5-8 years. Given the state BP is currently in, I think we have next season and if we are lucky, the season after, at Boundary Park. Can i just ask where will these extra facilities go ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_bro Posted April 23, 2011 Author Share Posted April 23, 2011 But if you only have a stadium you only have match day revenue which is all what have now, and look how its helping us now. Getting revenue in during non match days can only do the club good. exactly planning for the future but the future is not at bp. dont get me wrong i love the place but it has to go for us to move forward as a club and dare i say move forward as a town. im interested al_bro how could bp bring in money on non match days ? In the new Broadway Stand with banqueting / Restraunt facilities, offices and gym. Other cash generating facilities like a cinema, hotel and restraunts could be built elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 In the new Broadway Stand with banqueting / Restraunt facilities, offices and gym. Other cash generating facilities like a cinema, hotel and restraunts could be built elsewhere. Yeah but where do the other's go ? because i doubt they will bring in enough money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I would also accept a site in Thameside if it was big enough, but aren't there Football League rules which state that we have to play in the same town. I say redevelop BP because we have been told that there is no site in Oldham big enough. Whats wrong with building the cash generating stuff in Failsworth and redevloping BP. Awareness of the club would drastically increase if the facilities were on the same site. E.g. Bolton and Middlebrook Retail Park. Hundreds of thousands of people a year visit that retail park, many not even football fans let alone Bolton fans. Yet whenever they do, they will pass a nice shiny modern stadium with a massive big Bolton Wanderers logo. And if asked where Middlebrook Retail Park is, most people would answer 'Near Bolton's Ground'. Its a great way to increase the profile of the club and pick up a few floating fans. If we build a stadium at Boundary Park and the facilities at Failsworth, people would not make the same connection between the facilities and the club. And again you would have a situation where people would only go to this stadium once a fortnight to see the football. As I said in another post, a 'redevelopment' of Boundary Park simply isnt an option, and if done stand by stand could take upwards of 8 years. We can't afford to wait that long. And we would be allowed to move to Tameside. The FL rules state we cant move to an area which already has a league club, which would rule out somewhere like Kingsway Business Park, but not Tameside as the highest ranked clubs in Tameside are in Conference North, and are not likely to become league clubs anytime soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie_J Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I really don't care any more, however... If a site could be found that was central, better serviced by main routes, big enough and cheap enough, I'd back a properly funded move. Until then, I would rather see redevelopment of Boundary Park as and when that becomes financially viable. There is absolutely no reason (a couple of outline plans for residential development aside) why all the additional facilities that would be built at a new site cannot be incorporated into a redeveloped Boundary Park. And I have STILL never seen a convincing financial argument to prove that since the property crash redeveloping Boundary Park is not viable, and yet selling it, buying an other patch of land and building a brand new facility from scratch somehow is. Edit: Oh, and in answer to the windfall question, settle with Blitz and put what's left into a Broadway Stand fund. Couldn't agree more. Maybe you should sit on one of Corney's shoulders and you can try and drown out Ian Hill, sat on the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimeblue Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 I'm not saying you are wrong, because I have heard this too from another source, but I think it would be so unreasonable of Blitz to do it. I don't mind the loan being there, so if we somehow find a billionaire who feels like buying a dying club, Blitz can get his money back. But to take money from the club that is desperatly needed would be a pretty low act. I would like to think that Blitz still has enough feeling for the club to allow the club to keep any windfall they get from sell on clauses. I hope anyway. To be honest I think Blitz's 'love affair' with the club went when their big plans got quashed, I hope it's asked back for fairly and not a 'need it regardless' scenario but I think if we were to be 5 million richer he'd recall immediately. The fact that is was a loan in the first place speaks volumes, I still can't really get my head round it. I always thought the owner of a football club invested in it and took a risk (which I know they've done), it may be my lack of business knowledge but I just don't really get it. If were to get a decent amount I'd just want it spent on players and wages, genuinely had enough of this divsion. Short sighted answer I know but I'd just love us to have a crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Can i just ask where will these extra facilities go ? The only place you would probably fit extra facilities in a BP redevelopment is if they were built into the stands/stadium, which limits you straight away to maybe a restaurant, conferencing/banqueting facilities, a gym and maybe a hotel and some offices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 A hotel is pushing it. Demand for a decent hotel in Oldham? I don't see it and the failure of the Avant backs it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 A hotel is pushing it. Demand for a decent hotel in Oldham? I don't see it and the failure of the Avant backs it up. Visiting teams can use it? What about the space behind rre? Could a few pitches be built there for public use? Instead of a hotel how about a cinema? Kids use it through the holidays and Oldham dosnt have one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 A hotel is pushing it. Demand for a decent hotel in Oldham? I don't see it and the failure of the Avant backs it up. Yup couldnt agree more, hence why I said 'maybe' in the sense that it would be possible to have a hotel there. This is where the Failsworth site would have been ideal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I don't remember any of these doubts about a hotel being aired when the grand plans incorporated one into the new Chaddy End. (Although if I'm honest, the way Oldham's going there'd be more income from renting the space to gyppos than building a four star hotel...) Nor do I remember anyone saying that the nature of the BP redevelopment "limits you straight away to maybe a restaurant, conferencing/banqueting facilities, a gym and maybe a hotel and some offices." What were we going to have at Failsworth? A few rentable football pitches? Do they really make all the difference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I don't remember any of these doubts about a hotel being aired when the grand plans incorporated one into the new Chaddy End. (Although if I'm honest, the way Oldham's going there'd be more income from renting the space to gyppos than building a four star hotel...) Nor do I remember anyone saying that the nature of the BP redevelopment "limits you straight away to maybe a restaurant, conferencing/banqueting facilities, a gym and maybe a hotel and some offices." What were we going to have at Failsworth? A few rentable football pitches? Do they really make all the difference? Yes they do. Pitches to rent for 1 hour your looking £25 - £50. So having a few of them being used is a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I don't remember any of these doubts about a hotel being aired when the grand plans incorporated one into the new Chaddy End. (Although if I'm honest, the way Oldham's going there'd be more income from renting the space to gyppos than building a four star hotel...) Nor do I remember anyone saying that the nature of the BP redevelopment "limits you straight away to maybe a restaurant, conferencing/banqueting facilities, a gym and maybe a hotel and some offices." What were we going to have at Failsworth? A few rentable football pitches? Do they really make all the difference? Failsworth was going to have 3g footy pitches, cinema, gym, food court, and a travelodge style hotel. As people correctly pointed out on here, although technically in Oldham, Failsworth was closer to Manc City Centre than Oldham Town Centre, and it was just off a main road that goes straight into manchester. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Yes they do. Pitches to rent for 1 hour your looking £25 - £50. So having a few of them being used is a lot of money. And its something that we wouldnt be able to do at Boundary Park too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 (edited) And its something that we wouldnt be able to do at Boundary Park too I know but garcon was asking do they make a difference, which they do. Edited April 24, 2011 by LaticsLee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I know but garcon was asking do they make a difference, which they do. Those who were watching Latics in the 80's feel free to correct me, but when we had the plastic pitch I believe we used to rent that out, and brought in a considerable amount of money doing so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yard Dog Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 A hotel is pushing it. Demand for a decent hotel in Oldham? I don't see it and the failure of the Avant backs it up. Not necessarily. Maybe the failure of the Avant was down to their business strategy. There are lots of hotels in the borough these days, including a travelodge at the Avant, but, Saddleworth aside, there are only a couple offering above-average facilities, conferencancing/function rooms, etc. It's a competitive market but currently many local people, groups and businesses go to Norton Grange, COMS, Old Trafford, city centre etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 And its something that we wouldnt be able to do at Boundary Park too Where would these pitches go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lookers_Carl Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Where would these pitches go? Nowhere, hence why i said wouldnt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsLee Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 Nowhere, hence why i said wouldnt Oh my mistake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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