HarryBosch Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 In light of yesterdays comments from Simon Corney:- how do we join the Trust? how much does it cost? what level of influence, if any, would membership give us, i.e. what would we be able or unable to vote on etc...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yarddog73 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 think Simons word were he would hand over the reigns to the fans didnt hear the trust mentioned, think if it did come to that a new body should be set up independant to barrys old boys club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) I think the Trust need to prove it is still relevant and has the fans backing before anything is handed over to it. Edited March 20, 2014 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 20, 2014 Author Share Posted March 20, 2014 think Simons word were he would hand over the reigns to the fans didnt hear the trust mentioned, think if it did come to that a new body should be set up independant to barrys old boys club. Barry's old boys club own a 3% stake though so it would be them the club would be handed to surely? Love him or loathe him, Barry has gained a certain level of experience over the years and would be vitally important to the running of the club if this scenario were to happen. (I can't believe I've just typed that ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laticsmarra Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 think Simons word were he would hand over the reigns to the fans didnt hear the trust mentioned, think if it did come to that a new body should be set up independant to barrys old boys club. I've never had any dealings with the Trust, not sure whether it does a good job or not, from what I know if I want to take an active part in it I would be welcome to do so. I think it is unfair to call it Barry's old boys club. Any other so called independent body would no doubt be tarred with the same brush by a proportion of us circling on the outside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I've never had any dealings with the Trust, not sure whether it does a good job or not, from what I know if I want to take an active part in it I would be welcome to do so. I think it is unfair to call it Barry's old boys club. Any other so called independent body would no doubt be tarred with the same brush by a proportion of us circling on the outside. Maybe they would, maybe they wouldn't but the potential would be a lot lower if the new organisation was more democratic in its election process, something that is not exactly hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma06 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Is the trust perfect? No, far from it, but I think it gets far more stick than it deserves. As far as I am aware all the trust directors were voted on by members and then Barry was elected by the trust directors to take the seat on the board? I would have thought this takes up a large amount of Barry's time, and like him or loathe him I'm sure he has the clubs best interests at heart. I'm pretty sure all the trust directors give up a lot of their time as well and put a lot of effort into trying to ensure the Trust can be success. The only way the trust will be improved is by more people joining and getting involved. The trust does need to improve its communication with fans, it may be poor at the moment due to a lack of man power - i'm not sure how many people are involved at the moment - and I would be more than welcome to help in any way I can as i'm sure many other people would be. Perhaps a meeting between the trust and fans wanting to get involved or find out more about what the trust do would be a good idea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I agree the trust gets more stick than it deserves. Part of the problem is communication, which people are demonstrably trying to address, but they've all got day jobs or otherwise lives to lead and it isn't easy. Nevertheless, as the only fans body with club recognition (apart from OASIS, who are all hopeless drunks) it's probably time for everyone to jump on board, given Corney's latest murmurings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 In light of yesterdays comments from Simon Corney:- how do we join the Trust? how much does it cost? what level of influence, if any, would membership give us, i.e. what would we be able or unable to vote on etc...? In light of yesterdays comments from Simon Corney:- how do we join the Trust? how much does it cost? what level of influence, if any, would membership give us, i.e. what would we be able or unable to vote on etc...? Exactly the question I've been asking the trust for about 6 weeks now, but you are wasting your time - they do not reply to questions on here, they do not use twitter, they do not guarantee to respond to anyhting in fact apart from face to face meetings which are by invitation only. I started with what I thought was a reasonable approach, asking valid questions about factual information, but I've ended up so frustrated that I think I now consider them a complete waste of time. They are only interested in hearing from people who will never criticise them, and if you do not commit a certain number of hours to the trust you are less than worthy of their time/consideration. But, barry has spent many hours/weeks/years building his reputation at the club so that he can be an effective director. A|t the same time, he has (in my opinion) comepletely neglected the role in which he was elected. But as I say, they don't like this so they will ignore it, as per their management manual written in 1952. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I agree the trust gets more stick than it deserves. Part of the problem is communication, which people are demonstrably trying to address, but they've all got day jobs or otherwise lives to lead and it isn't easy. Nevertheless, as the only fans body with club recognition (apart from OASIS, who are all hopeless drunks) it's probably time for everyone to jump on board, given Corney's latest murmurings. Can you give me an example of where they have improved communications over the past 2 months? Only yesterday I was told that the only way I can ask questions is face to face. A while back I sent questions to barry via this site and via the trust site - the trust site was hibernated, but there was nothing there to say so. It was only when I raised the non-reply on here that anything was actually done to let people know there is a new site, and that didn't have any communication channels. They posted some news after the court case to say they would act to re-build trust, but they did nothing. In the past few days barry has yet again responded to some and ignored others. They repeatedly claim to have been threatended, had phone calls in the small hours and have had their cars damaged by fans. i seriously question whether they have any evidence of this - one of them is ex-plod FGS, so if they have evidence, do something about the abusers rather than pull up the drawbridge and ignore every fan who cares about oldham. They need to understand that to represent ALL fans, they need to listen to ALL fans, not adopt a siege mentality. They might have good intentions, but what are they achieving? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma06 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Can you give me an example of where they have improved communications over the past 2 months? There were 3 updates on their Facebook page yesterday, whilst hardly ground breaking it is a start. Hopefully they have realised it is an area they need to improve on and are now trying to do so. It's a small step but they have to start somewhere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Incidentally Wardle said on 20/02/14 that there would be a trust AGM within the next month or so. That month has now expired. There has been no AGM, nor has there been any announcement of when it might be (I'd expect a reasonable notice period of 14 days). Just seen the announcement on facebook - thanks for that Gemma. I'm not a member though, so I can't attend. When I go to Tesco, they don't ask me to hand over some cash before I know what I'm getting. I've asked many questions (OWTB posts, PM to Barry, message to Richard via facebook), but the questions have been ignored, so not only do I not know what I'll be getting, I have learned that they have a partial attitude to fans. Richard told me Barry doesn't use PMs on here, but it's clear that he does when it suits him. He also asked why I "won't meet a trust board member face to face" - firstly I've never been granted this right, secondly, is this the way to engage with 3-4000 people who are fans of OAFC and are therefore potential trust members? Almost every trust reply is tinged with accusation, resentment and defensiveness, with an added air of dismissiveness towards other supporters - "not every joe blogss can become a director" - erm, wow, you are a superior being are you barry? I'm clearly not worthy. They keep asking people to join and to help out, but other than barry suggesting we might be able to take the minutes of a meeting and post them on the web, there's been nothing. The rest of the ignorance, condescension and arrogance makes me think it's not for me. How do the trust intend to recruit new members? It's not really the best way to encourage people to join. Edited March 20, 2014 by real Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma06 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Incidentally Wardle said on 20/02/14 that there would be a trust AGM within the next month or so. That month has now expired. There has been no AGM, nor has there been any announcement of when it might be (I'd expect a reasonable notice period of 14 days). It's 14th April at 7:30pm http://www.trustoldham.co.uk/2014/03/next-trust-oldham-agm/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) "not every joe blogss can become a director" - erm, wow, you are a superior being are you barry? I'm clearly not worthy. This really pissed me off over the years. It was the whole tone given when challenging why the role on board has stuck with the same guy for so long. Its almost to suggest that the average Oldham fan just wouldn't have enough about them to do the role. Is if we are all simple minded yonners or something. Ignoring that amongst the supporter based there are clearly some very talented and successful businessmen etc. And then it was all neatly tied up against anyone challenging it by making it a trust director appointed role etc rather than a trust member appointed role. The main job should be nominated by the membership. Its the main reason why I have had zero involvement with the trust. Being a member is almost pointless. Also the claim that only a retired man with nothing else to do can do the role. The original role was to attend board meetings, keep an eye on the club and hold them to account. Not this full blown day to day company director role it has seemingly become. And finally the suggestion that Corney wouldn't trust someone new. Which is of course the most damning of them all. It was never about who THEY trusted. It was always meant to be about US building TRUST in them! Edited March 20, 2014 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Can you give me an example of where they have improved communications over the past 2 months? Only yesterday I was told that the only way I can ask questions is face to face. A while back I sent questions to barry via this site and via the trust site - the trust site was hibernated, but there was nothing there to say so. It was only when I raised the non-reply on here that anything was actually done to let people know there is a new site, and that didn't have any communication channels. They posted some news after the court case to say they would act to re-build trust, but they did nothing. In the past few days barry has yet again responded to some and ignored others. They repeatedly claim to have been threatended, had phone calls in the small hours and have had their cars damaged by fans. i seriously question whether they have any evidence of this - one of them is ex-plod FGS, so if they have evidence, do something about the abusers rather than pull up the drawbridge and ignore every fan who cares about oldham. They need to understand that to represent ALL fans, they need to listen to ALL fans, not adopt a siege mentality. They might have good intentions, but what are they achieving? Incidentally Wardle said on 20/02/14 that there would be a trust AGM within the next month or so. That month has now expired. There has been no AGM, nor has there been any announcement of when it might be (I'd expect a reasonable notice period of 14 days). Just seen the announcement on facebook - thanks for that Gemma. I'm not a member though, so I can't attend. When I go to Tesco, they don't ask me to hand over some cash before I know what I'm getting. I've asked many questions (OWTB posts, PM to Barry, message to Richard via facebook), but the questions have been ignored, so not only do I not know what I'll be getting, I have learned that they have a partial attitude to fans. Richard told me Barry doesn't use PMs on here, but it's clear that he does when it suits him. He also asked why I "won't meet a trust board member face to face" - firstly I've never been granted this right, secondly, is this the way to engage with 3-4000 people who are fans of OAFC and are therefore potential trust members? Almost every trust reply is tinged with accusation, resentment and defensiveness, with an added air of dismissiveness towards other supporters - "not every joe blogss can become a director" - erm, wow, you are a superior being are you barry? I'm clearly not worthy. They keep asking people to join and to help out, but other than barry suggesting we might be able to take the minutes of a meeting and post them on the web, there's been nothing. The rest of the ignorance, condescension and arrogance makes me think it's not for me. How do the trust intend to recruit new members? It's not really the best way to encourage people to join. The charge has always been that very few Latics fans use OWTB and to engage on here would be at the determent of dealing face to face with the main body of fans. Its a view point that has more in common with the 1990s than it does with 2010s... Facebook, Twitter, fans website forums like OWTB is the best way to reach the most fans... The main thrust of communication with the fans should be via these platforms. I would suggest a full blown Ebbsfleet United style interaction platform is required to canvass the opinions of fans and take those views to the board meetings. But I don't think Barry takes the fans views to the boardroom. I think he takes his own. Edited March 20, 2014 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 20, 2014 Author Share Posted March 20, 2014 None of the three questions was posed as a trick question. I even went to great lengths to not word any of them in a way that might result in me getting my head bitten off. Tick, tick.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I'm sure I recall disagreeing with you OAFC0000 over the trust when you criticised it in the past and I defended it. More recently I had a similar discussion with prozac. Maybe I was wrong, maybe the trust has degenerated into a worse state, but I want to care about the trust, I want to join the trust, but I won't do so unconditionally without knowing that there are prospects for improvement of the trust. The Trust has to show faith in the fans if they expect the fans to respond to their call to arms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma06 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Just seen the announcement on facebook - thanks for that Gemma. I'm not a member though, so I can't attend. When I go to Tesco, they don't ask me to hand over some cash before I know what I'm getting. I've asked many questions (OWTB posts, PM to Barry, message to Richard via facebook), but the questions have been ignored, so not only do I not know what I'll be getting, I have learned that they have a partial attitude to fans. Richard told me Barry doesn't use PMs on here, but it's clear that he does when it suits him. He also asked why I "won't meet a trust board member face to face" - firstly I've never been granted this right, secondly, is this the way to engage with 3-4000 people who are fans of OAFC and are therefore potential trust members? Almost every trust reply is tinged with accusation, resentment and defensiveness, with an added air of dismissiveness towards other supporters - "not every joe blogss can become a director" - erm, wow, you are a superior being are you barry? I'm clearly not worthy. They keep asking people to join and to help out, but other than barry suggesting we might be able to take the minutes of a meeting and post them on the web, there's been nothing. The rest of the ignorance, condescension and arrogance makes me think it's not for me. How do the trust intend to recruit new members? It's not really the best way to encourage people to join. No problem. I do think they need to arrange something with fans who aren't currently members to explain what they are doing and how people interested in doing so can help. As you say people wont join unless they know what it is they are joining. Looking at their website there seems to be 5 directors including Barry, i'm not sure if there is anyone else involved who helps out but i think it needs more than 5 people especially as at least some of them will be in full time employment and have familys/other responsibilities that need taking care of. I think the trust could be an excellent thing for both the club and fans but there is a lot of animosity and that needs sorting before we can move forward. My dad was a trust director for a number of years and i know he put a lot of time and effort into it, as other members did too, it would be a shame for all that to go to waste when there is so much potential Edited March 20, 2014 by Gemma06 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Board policy; http://www.trustoldham.co.uk/about-us/board-membership-policy/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) I'm sure I recall disagreeing with you OAFC0000 over the trust when you criticised it in the past and I defended it. More recently I had a similar discussion with prozac. Maybe I was wrong, maybe the trust has degenerated into a worse state, but I want to care about the trust, I want to join the trust, but I won't do so unconditionally without knowing that there are prospects for improvement of the trust. The Trust has to show faith in the fans if they expect the fans to respond to their call to arms. Yeah we did fall out a bit Its fine mate We aren't all going to agree all the time Has there been a call to arms ? Barrys not been on since SC statement... Edited March 20, 2014 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeylandLatic Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Is violent coup d'etat a viable option for my Trust Presidency (soon to be renamed 'Trust King') candidate campaign? Would you recommend joining prior to initiating the coup to get my face known? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Is violent coup d'etat a viable option for my Trust Presidency (soon to be renamed 'Trust King') candidate campaign? Would you recommend joining prior to initiating the coup to get my face known? Thanks. Referendums seem the fad these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Referendums seem the fad these days. But only if they tell you what you want to hear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 From the Trust Site:- One half of the remaining elected directors who were elected when the company was a company limited by guarantee shall retire at the first AGM but be eligible for re-election for a further term of three years. The remaining elected directors from before the time of the conversion shall retire at the second AGM after the conversion and shall be eligible for re-election. Elected directors shall serve for a period of three years and shall then retire and shall be eligible for re-election, as laid down in the Rules. So if half the directors were elected at one AGM, for 3 years; and the other half were elected at the next AGM, for 3 years, the third AGM would not require any elections as no one would resign and there would be no opportunity for anyone not on the board to stand for election. Mind you, as we don't know who is on the board other than having 5 names, we don't know when the last AGM was or what happened, and we don't have any detail on any other democratic input that the trust allows members/supporters, how can anyone decide if it's worth bothering. And all this dialogue/dicsussion is pointless anyway as the Trust will not read it. Can you imagine any organisation in the world that had access to a source of information and opinions from its stakeholders, that would decide to just turn its back and ignore them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I have just been on the linked website for the trust, (thanks to Gemma). I have tried to insert my email address to receive the trust newsletters but the automated response says 'the feed does not have subscriptions by email enabled.' I intend to try to attend at BP the AGM on Monday 14th April on the basis that since I am not a member I will simply observe the meeting! If questioned I will deny even having heard of OWTB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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