StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 My comment was based on Joe saying when he was appointed that he had a lot to learn about League One and he had only seen Latics twice this season. I expressed doubt about Joe's willingness and energy at his age to take on what is a massive task for someone who has been used to working with better players. Joe Royle is a legend in my eyes and, like Derek, I would hate to see him become the victim of abuse by many. If he was able to get Latics promoted again, I would consider him a miracle worker, but I think that is a bridge too far and one with very weak foundations. Yes he ""had"" a lot to learn, don't you think people like Joe would pick up info quickly with and undoubted network of contacts within the game (big name comedy chums like "Big Ron" aside) ? Which is why I said what would that knowledge be like by August? The way you expressed your "doubt" I read differently, and still do, you can't, none of us can know what his willingness and energy levels for the challenge are? Maybe he's more enthusiastic about this challenge than anything he's done before, I dunno. You and DW are assuming that JR will be a failure, that he won't achieve anything and if he doesn't he'll get abuse. How very disconcertingly negative of you, perhaps we should just wrap Joe in cotton wool, or maybe not. I'm sure Joe is a big boy now and would be prepared for the pitfalls of taking this job on, his shoulders are broad enough to take it without the simpering hand wringing of those amongst of wishing to preserve the memory of his past achievements. Actually I'm beginning to get the impression is it your own memories you want to preserve in aspic, its you guys who want the mist eyed version of Joe to remain forever constant. If Joe takes it on and it fails, it is what it is, life moves on and if that spoils the memories of a few rheumy eyed old gits so be it. Lifes about taking a chance, not saying I'm not doing that because it might not work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 I'd love to Bang A Gong it Joe proved to be the Main Man, The Motivator and The Wizard, but Life Is Strange and if it went wrong, I would hate Joe to get the Iscariot treatment and be the victim of many an Explosive Mouth from Broken-hearted Blues, such as ‘Mad Donna’ who sits behind me. Perhaps Joe could Telegram Sam at Bastard Rovers to ask if he has a spare Precious Star. Ride a white swan DS, its easier than a high horse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Yes he ""had"" a lot to learn, don't you think people like Joe would pick up info quickly with and undoubted network of contacts within the game (big name comedy chums like "Big Ron" aside) ? Which is why I said what would that knowledge be like by August? The way you expressed your "doubt" I read differently, and still do, you can't, none of us can know what his willingness and energy levels for the challenge are? Maybe he's more enthusiastic about this challenge than anything he's done before, I dunno. You and DW are assuming that JR will be a failure, that he won't achieve anything and if he doesn't he'll get abuse. How very disconcertingly negative of you, perhaps we should just wrap Joe in cotton wool, or maybe not. I'm sure Joe is a big boy now and would be prepared for the pitfalls of taking this job on, his shoulders are broad enough to take it without the simpering hand wringing of those amongst of wishing to preserve the memory of his past achievements. Actually I'm beginning to get the impression is it your own memories you want to preserve in aspic, its you guys who want the mist eyed version of Joe to remain forever constant. If Joe takes it on and it fails, it is what it is, life moves on and if that spoils the memories of a few rheumy eyed old gits so be it. Lifes about taking a chance, not saying I'm not doing that because it might not work out. Far from being misty-eyed about Joe's past (although I shed a tear when he returned) I remember very well that when Joe left Latics the concensus was that he had stayed too long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Far from being misty-eyed about Joe's past (although I shed a tear when he returned) I remember very well that when Joe left Latics the concensus was that he had stayed too long. yes he did stay too long,but was that his fault or the fact that the board of the day were too busy raping the club of money and assets,without giving him a decent budget to bring in players capable of sustaining a challenge to stay where we was.credit to joe for sticking with it in the vain hope he could turn it around,but alas he couldnt. but the fact remains he still went forward with new clubs and achieved levels of success to varying degrees. i was there before the glory years,and after them,and that will be with me forever and a day. this is now a totally different scenario,and if you can show me a manager out there with the same credentials,ill happily back him to do the job. the argument he is used to better quality players doesnt stack either,this group of players we have wont be here,he already knows there not good enough,with one or two exceptions,thats why the clear out has already begun,money is already being saved in readiness for next season,yes he probably will have a reduced budget,but with his contacts within the game,im sure we will see many new faces,some may be proven others not,but they will be his players who play the way he likes the game to be played. like i have said elswhere,if he gets the same backing as shez has had,im more than confident he can do it,and if he doesnt,the club will have better foundations to build from than it has had for a long long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritchie82 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Fool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wozz_oafc Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 I can see your point, but if given the job, if he gets us up next year every fan on here would be saying 'yep, always knew joe would do it, well done on giving him the job tta'. i myself am too young to remember first hand the glory years, but ive seen the vids and still know joe to be a legend for doing what he did even if i didnt see it personally. Id love him to get the job, take us up and stabalise us for a year or 2 in the championship, what a great swansong, But if he had the job and didnt take us up so what? Thats football, it worked great first time but not so good 2nd time. He'd always be known as a legend regardless. Its a mark of the man that he would want to give it a go again in the first place. Its Joe's choice, if he wants the job great - he'd take it knowing full well all the 'this' and 'thats'. Shez was a great player for us - in looking at his time at boss, ill remember the time he took us to the playoffs in his 1st year, the everton game and in the playoff year i remember the home game v bradford and sitting there thinking ive genuinely not seen a better game of football/team performance as i was witnessing in that game. Yes the ending wasnt great, but the bigger picture tells you how it was and in reality shez did a pretty decent job. KTF BACK JOE! I agree with all you have put there. Its the last line that worries me. Shez did do a good job but not many recognise this at all. My stance isnt that I dont rate Joe or think he will be a good manager. Its more that I have lost faith in many of our fans, who have shown they crave instant success. We do not have the most patient of followers, that must be clear to see for all. I also think despite what many or saying now, if Joe was to mess up, our fans would turn the knives on Joe, hence tarnishing his reputation like I have said. He has got my backing now, and will do next season, I like to give most managers a chance. I just have a horrible feeling it may all go wrong and not neccessarily because of Joe. People equate him with success, some people on here are already saying he is the man to get us up etc. What happens if TTA slash the budget and we dont field the best of sides. He might be doing well, keeping us in the division, but i have a feeling people will still be expecting promotion and the manager merry go round will probably start again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Happy 60th birthday Joe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc_ok Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Happy 60th birthday Joe! At least if Joe doesn't stay on for next season he'll be entitled to an OAP ticket when he does visit BP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 At least if Joe doesn't stay on for next season he'll be entitled to an OAP ticket when he does visit BP. Wink or no wink, it's wrong to mislead readers - Joe has to wait another five years for an OAP ticket for BP, unless he persuades the Board to change its policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Far from being misty-eyed about Joe's past (although I shed a tear when he returned) I remember very well that when Joe left Latics the concensus was that he had stayed too long. But you are being misty eyed, and you don't want that misty eyed vision ruined for yourself by Joe taking the job just in case it goes tits up. Not mind because it will go tits up, just in case it does. I suggest DS that you stop crossing the road, just in case a car hits you like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 But you are being misty eyed, and you don't want that misty eyed vision ruined for yourself by Joe taking the job just in case it goes tits up. Not mind because it will go tits up, just in case it does. I suggest DS that you stop crossing the road, just in case a car hits you like. Blimey Johnny Mathis will be coming on next or the Green Cross Code man! As I posted several pages back, I think the job is made for a younger manager out to prove himself on his way to the top, not one who has already done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 As I posted several pages back, I think the job is made for a younger manager out to prove himself on his way to the top, not one who has already done that. Well why not just stick to that then, instead of bumbling on about it not working out for Joe resulting in nasty people shouting nasty things at a legend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Well why not just stick to that then, instead of bumbling on about it not working out for Joe resulting in nasty people shouting nasty things at a legend. Because its a very likely outcome... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Blimey Johnny Mathis will be coming on next or the Green Cross Code man! As I posted several pages back, I think the job is made for a younger manager out to prove himself on his way to the top, not one who has already done that. isnt that why we appointed an up and coming manager in shez,very good coach and no doubt going places,sadly lacking though... i feel its time for a calming steadying influence,someone to come in and steady the ship,start again and put back in place a well oiled disciplined regime ready to go for the next step wether that be joe or gannon or hill or cotterhill or knill or holloway or anybody else mentioned for that matter. we have to get back to basics and start playing as a team and working for each other,once this happens and fans actually see an improvement they will be more inclined to back it and jump on board,until that happens we will always have the hardcore 3-4k supporters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 I agree with all you have put there. Its the last line that worries me. Shez did do a good job but not many recognise this at all. My stance isnt that I dont rate Joe or think he will be a good manager. Its more that I have lost faith in many of our fans, who have shown they crave instant success. We do not have the most patient of followers, that must be clear to see for all. I also think despite what many or saying now, if Joe was to mess up, our fans would turn the knives on Joe, hence tarnishing his reputation like I have said. He has got my backing now, and will do next season, I like to give most managers a chance. I just have a horrible feeling it may all go wrong and not neccessarily because of Joe. People equate him with success, some people on here are already saying he is the man to get us up etc. What happens if TTA slash the budget and we dont field the best of sides. He might be doing well, keeping us in the division, but i have a feeling people will still be expecting promotion and the manager merry go round will probably start again. In time shez will be remembered fondly lets the last few months weren't great but in time people will forgive him for that and remmember a player that kept us out of the basment division came out of retirement to play in our hour of need and some good results as a manager including a famous win at Everton. Take Andy Ritchie as an example here alot of people at the time he departed wanted him gone and as a manager yet now his name is sung regularly at games by the fans many of whom might not have been old enough to have seen in play at the peak of his powers. One thing many of us are forgetting aswell when we talk about next seasons budget being a real hinderance is where Royle himself built his reputation? Answer by taking cast offs from top clubs such as Dennis Irwin, Earl Barrett, and Paul Warhurst and turning them into special players, on the first article in the OP it says he is already asking Taggert about players who maybe released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Well why not just stick to that then, instead of bumbling on about it not working out for Joe resulting in nasty people shouting nasty things at a legend. You're the one who chose to ignore my conclusion and disect my reasoning instead. I can guarantee I will not do that, nor will I join the many on here who will be calling for Joe's head in that scenario next season. I'm just trying to be realistic, and questioning whether Joe is the man for the job if he can't get us to win a game this season. His knowledge of this Division is very limited and I doubt whether he will have the willingness and energy at his age to try to convert ordinary players into promotion contenders on a slim budget. I think the job is made for a younger manager out to prove himself on his way to the top, not one who has already done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 You're the one who chose to ignore my conclusion and disect my reasoning instead. Oh I see we can only pass comment on conclusions now, not the reasoning behind the conclusion. Isn't it all one and the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Oh I see we can only pass comment on conclusions now, not the reasoning behind the conclusion. Isn't it all one and the same? Of course you can... but it makes for a :censored: discussion that looks more like an attempt to point scoring and nit pick than trying to discuss the main issues... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Because its a very likely outcome... Ohhhh is it? No its no more an outcome than him making a success of his return, if he indeed chose to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Ohhhh is it? No its no more an outcome than him making a success of his return, if he indeed chose to. Low budget ... small squad lacking quality... more players likely to go (aka Taylor)... Its people like you that put your fingers in the ears and slag off people like me and Deigo today... Then its people like you that start complaining and calling for the managers head tomoz.... You need a massive blast of reality.. I doubt their will be much money going on us to do anything next term outside of the fan base put it that way.... Be realistic and moderate your expectations... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Oh I see we can only pass comment on conclusions now, not the reasoning behind the conclusion. Isn't it all one and the same? This is becoming ridiculous - you told me to stick to the conclusion and not state (or bumble on, as you put it) my reasoning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 (edited) . Edited April 8, 2009 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StipeTripe Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 This is becoming ridiculous - you told me to stick to the conclusion and not state (or bumble on, as you put it) my reasoning. I only just said stick to the conclusion, after pages of bumbling. You say potato I'll say patato. Especially as the ubiquitous and utterly otiose 000 has suddenly decided to enter the fray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 This is becoming ridiculous - you told me to stick to the conclusion and not state (or bumble on, as you put it) my reasoning. joe royle is big enough old enough and ugly enough to make his own mind up about wether he should or shouldnt take charge next season. i doubt for one moment he will worry about the fans,it will all depend on if he thinks he can make a difference,bring in better players,bring in his own team and do things his way. if he decides he can,then good luck to him,if he decides he cant,thanks and goodbye im sure one way or another next seasons team will benefit from joe sorting out the discipline and getting rid of the billy big balls and has beens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 I think neither a younger manager or an old head is the answer to our leadership. I think it's time for... Roboman [ager]. "Dead or alive you're playing for me" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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