yarddogs Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 was it right to get rid of shez,cause lets be honest the results under joe since he came back well speak for themselves,bet shez is having a little chuckle to himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 was it right to get rid of shez Yes. It is over 2 years since this side won 3 on the trot. Shez was not going to reverse the decline. cause lets be honest the results under joe since he came back well speak for themselves Very disappointing. I think that shows how deep the problems at the club had become. Players unable to lift themselves for a new manager. But I think there are many aspects on and off the pitch that show new promise. I'd have preferred the Wembley trip next month though, not next year. bet shez is having a little chuckle to himself. Maybe. I hope he finds a decent job in football soon and learns from his mistakes. He could yet manage at a higher level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty doesn't know Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 was it right to get rid of shez,cause lets be honest the results under joe since he came back well speak for themselves,bet shez is having a little chuckle to himself. i dont think we should say that joe royle is not as good a manager as john sheridan cause i think he is better but i agree that it was a bad choice to sack john sheridan and i think it was a panic action from latics. this idea is further emphasised in that joe royle is only our manager to the end of this season and if latics really wanted change they would have appointed a manager in the longer term. when we played tranmere rovers i was convinced that if john sheridan was our manager for that match, we would have played better at least. also i think if he was our manager still, we would be at least nearer to the play offs. i dont think joe royle can be expected to adapt so quickly to latics and i am not going to make many judgements about him from this season cause of this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellys_discopants Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Yes. It is over 2 years since this side won 3 on the trot. Erm, Apart from the first 3 games that we won this season (4 if you include a penalty shoot-out), we also won 3 league games on the trot mid november Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 (edited) was it right to get rid of shez The idea was to "save" the season.... Only an idiot would say it was right...specially with hindsight (although not all of us needed hindsight) The plan wasnt to clear the decks...to plan for next term... The plan was to "save" the season... So NO Edited April 10, 2009 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nava Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 definitly the right decision. i doubt the results would of been any better, he wouldn't of been the manager next season anyway so no point in keeping him. if joe is the manager next year im expecting a lot of changes in players, team selection and formations. i dont see a quick fix to our situation but i hope with the changes that are going to be made in the summer are the right ones for the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Yes. It is over 2 years since this side won 3 on the trot. How is this point supposed to work? Is it about current achievements? - We haven't won 1 on the trot since shez went. Or is it about shez's record? - Play offs / 8th / 8th (when sacked) - arguably better than anyone since JR left Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellys_discopants Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 How is this point supposed to work? It dosen`t work seen as though the point is incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsslatic Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Got nothing to do with hindsight. Was saying at the time it was a bad decision, was livid after MK but still wasn't time to sack the manager. I was happy when Joe came in and in the euphoria felt maybe the right decision had been taken, but it wasn't. Shez should have been given the chance to finish his job and decide his own future. I'm sure he's not smiling, as he wants the club to succeed. I'm sure there's a sense of 'I told you so' in his mind though. People claim this team was a good side and poorly managed...that he picked the same old players and with different tactics and personnel from his good squad we would've gone up. Well Joe's got even less out of them than Shez did. The club have made two poor decisions in the last few weeks that have cost us a shot at the playoffs. Both were seemingly wrong to me even before hindsight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 I'm sure it'll be no news to 0000's that he can count me as an idiot. Yes it was the right decision. I really, really wanted him to be the long term manager we need, but in the end it wasn't to be. The attempt to save the season has - obviously - failed, but that has no bearing on whether the decision was right; saving the season was a long shot whatever happened, the real work Joe is doing is all about next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Sacking Sheridan probably wasn't the right decision but his contract was up at the end of the season and he hadn't done well enough for me this year to merit a new one. IMHO he needed to make the play-offs minimum (as we didn't have a cup run) so he deserved to go. So it wasn't the right decision because it came 2 months too early (as he's entitiled to compensation I believe) but getting JR in (and the subsequent increased gate) has probably paid that back. I think a new manager would have had to have been very lucky to get us to the play-offs with the squad Shez left but this is why I think in part the club sacked him as players like Davies and Hughes were not positive influences in the squad (although good players) and any new manager needs to clear some of the dead wood out which although maybe performing on the pitch is negatively affecting other players performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 (edited) It dosen`t work seen as though the point is incorrect. Erm, Apart from the first 3 games that we won this season (4 if you include a penalty shoot-out), we also won 3 league games on the trot mid november Any bookie will tell you that drawing 0-0 at Rochdale is a draw. We got through on penalties against a lower league side. If our own web site calls Morecambe in the JPT a draw (lost on pens), then Rochdale was a draw too. Took 2 hours to not get the ball in the net. A win? Nah. The three league wins had a shocking FA Cup defeat in the middle. So weren't consecutive wins. We haven't won 3 on the trot this season. We failed to win 3 on the trot last season. When we did it the season before it was followed up with a superb run of 4 straight defeats. The inaccuracy in the point is that we won the last 2 games of last season and the first one of this season - so across seasons we did win 3 on the trot. Not exactly hurtling momentum. The point is that since Feb 2007 Shez never managed to get the momentum going. He wouldn't have achieved that now either. Right to get rid. Shame Joe couldn't perform the miracle, but the club is better off with him at the helm. Edited April 10, 2009 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oafc88 Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 (edited) Imo i wanted shez to stay till the end of the season, let him leave of his own accord once his contract was up rather than fire him (due to his standing at the club). However i also understand the decision by the owners to try and boost the team and hope to gain promotion, as the possibilty of a boost from a new manager lifting the team and win most the games we had left appeared more likely to occur, than was at the time the bad form of the team to lift and which seemed wasnt going to go away in a hurry, either by shez's doings or something else. As unlikely as it was, we still could have made the playoffs (and was closer to doing so then, than now), and if we hadnt have had sacked shez, who knows we could be sat here in june contemplating an away trip to newcastle you never know in football, the unlikely does happen, who'd have thought we wouldnt have won at least once under Royle snce his return. Cant wait to get this season over and done with now, look forward to the summer, id like Royle to still be in charge imo and see who we sign and look to the forward to the season again with renewed optimism (only to be crushed by mid febuary again ) Edited April 11, 2009 by Oafc88 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelylaticsfaninaus Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 I'm sure it'll be no news to 0000's that he can count me as an idiot. Yes it was the right decision. I really, really wanted him to be the long term manager we need, but in the end it wasn't to be. The attempt to save the season has - obviously - failed, but that has no bearing on whether the decision was right; saving the season was a long shot whatever happened, the real work Joe is doing is all about next season. I agree 100% I enjoy listening to Joe on Latics World because he has a much more positive attitude than Shez ever had. I often felt listening to Shez that he didn't have a clue how to fix the problems and I don't think publicly bollocking players is ever going to get the best from them, something he did on a regular basis. Joe is positive and constructive. You can see already that this attitude is motivating the players better. OK, he hasn't got that first win yet, but he makes me feel more confident for the future. Get behind him and let's hope he stays. I have a feeling he will because I think he is enjoying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeylandLatic Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 The idea was to "save" the season.... Only an idiot would say it was right...specially with hindsight (although not all of us needed hindsight) The plan wasnt to clear the decks...to plan for next term... The plan was to "save" the season... So NO Of course the idea was to save the season, but it didn't work out and there was no way Shez was going to turn it round, that had become plainly obvious to everyone. We took a risk and it didn't pay off as we would have liked, but in the long term we will benefit. If Shez was still here the same problems would as well. At least we've given our selves a better chance for next season instead of clinging onto non existent chances of promotion this time round. It may not have been the best outcome of this but at least it is something. Like I said earlier, things aren't black and white, stop trying to portray them this way for your alternative view point. If your going to name call, any idiot could see Shez wasn't going to get us anywhere. He got as much time as possible, but even the most ardent Shez fan had lost patience myself included. I backed him till the end, but by the final defeat of his tenure I just couldn't see a way we would make the play offs with him in charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 Imo i wanted shez to stay till the end of the season, let him leave of his own accord once his contract was up rather than fire him So you'd have kept Shez next season as well? "he has now signed up until June 2010." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 there was no way Shez was going to turn it round Crickey.... No way the current manager was going to turn around but we thought Joe could pull a rabbit out of the out.... I am wondering if its worth bothering going any more... I think were looking at another 10 years stuck in this league with the combination of poor appointments and over reacting fans... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 So you'd have kept Shez next season as well? "he has now signed up until June 2010." Just goes to show how "informed" the average user is on these boards... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 Crickey.... No way the current manager was going to turn around but we thought Joe could pull a rabbit out of the out.... I am wondering if its worth bothering going any more... I think were looking at another 10 years stuck in this league with the combination of poor appointments and over reacting fans... stop over reacting then... no body is forcing you to go,so if you dont go nobody will pat you on the back and say oh bravo for sticking with it.its a choice based on what your opinion of the club manager and the team are like. joe was asked to come in and pick up the reigns to see if it was possible to salvage the season,after his first game in charge he probably sat tta's down and said look,this aint gonna happen,the players are not good enough,the morale isnt good enough,the commitment desire and determination isnt good enough,this team probably playing in the way they are wont win again this season,what do you want me to do???? so now were preparing for next season,were getting rid of the wasters and bad influences,the has beens and those that cant be arsed,he is not using the kids and fringe players,as they should have been used all season. the point is,shez only has himself to blame,he changed a winning team after 7 games to bring other players in because more than likely there were whinging at him for not playing and scrapping the reserve team. so he gives in gives them a game,breaks a winning team up brings in players not used to playing the style we had and hey presto,it goes tits up,then he has spent the rest of the season trying to recapture the first 7 games form and couldnt do it,then rather than admit he has made a mistake he tries to cover his arse by bringing in talented but unfit has been players citing his own arent good enough. if the owners wanted to be bold they would of got rid in december,and given joe a lot more time being able to bring in 4 or 5 decent players. hindsight is indeed a wonderfull thing,but we dont play games with hindsight,we play them now in real time as they come,against teams who want to beat us and not just roll over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 stop over reacting then... no body is forcing you to go,so if you dont go nobody will pat you on the back and say oh bravo for sticking with it.its a choice based on what your opinion of the club manager and the team are like. joe was asked to come in and pick up the reigns to see if it was possible to salvage the season,after his first game in charge he probably sat tta's down and said look,this aint gonna happen,the players are not good enough,the morale isnt good enough,the commitment desire and determination isnt good enough,this team probably playing in the way they are wont win again this season,what do you want me to do???? so now were preparing for next season,were getting rid of the wasters and bad influences,the has beens and those that cant be arsed,he is not using the kids and fringe players,as they should have been used all season. the point is,shez only has himself to blame,he changed a winning team after 7 games to bring other players in because more than likely there were whinging at him for not playing and scrapping the reserve team. so he gives in gives them a game,breaks a winning team up brings in players not used to playing the style we had and hey presto,it goes tits up,then he has spent the rest of the season trying to recapture the first 7 games form and couldnt do it,then rather than admit he has made a mistake he tries to cover his arse by bringing in talented but unfit has been players citing his own arent good enough. if the owners wanted to be bold they would of got rid in december,and given joe a lot more time being able to bring in 4 or 5 decent players. hindsight is indeed a wonderfull thing,but we dont play games with hindsight,we play them now in real time as they come,against teams who want to beat us and not just roll over. During your little ramblings above you failed to answer the question which was asked... Everything Joe is doing now could of been done after the season had ended... I cant believe people cant be man enough to admit it was the wrong move... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 During your little ramblings above you failed to answer the question which was asked... Everything Joe is doing now could of been done after the season had ended... I cant believe people cant be man enough to admit it was the wrong move... why was it the wrong move???? dont just tant explain why it was the wrong move. everything he is doing now probably could have been done in the summer,however if hughes had scored 20 goals he would of been entitled to a massive bonus,which the club may or may not have been able to afford,or consider,because it was obvious he wouldnt be here next season,so why pay someone handsomely to not be here. contract negotiations maybe could have been done in the summer,but come on,joes been told what a likely budget there will be,so he is offloading early in order to have as much cash as possible to negotiate new players. the team under shez had started to go backwards,there was no evidence he could have turned it around,going off our form since october with a few good highlights,really wasnt good enough. they expected the euphoria surrounding joes return to not only have an effext on the fans,but the players alike,it worked on one and isnt working on the other.it was a gamble and it failed. in your eyes it was the wrong decision,in others eyes it was the wrong decision,in tta's it was obviously the right decision as they made it,they pay the wages they put the money in,they are entitled to do as they see fit. to just let shez see out the season as it was heading,they wouyld have been slaughtered for it come may for not being proactive enough. they made a choice,it hasnt worked and now there is more resent comming in there way,who would want to run a football club eh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senor_Coconut Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 why was it the wrong move???? dont just tant explain why it was the wrong move. everything he is doing now probably could have been done in the summer,however if hughes had scored 20 goals he would of been entitled to a massive bonus,which the club may or may not have been able to afford,or consider,because it was obvious he wouldnt be here next season,so why pay someone handsomely to not be here. contract negotiations maybe could have been done in the summer,but come on,joes been told what a likely budget there will be,so he is offloading early in order to have as much cash as possible to negotiate new players. the team under shez had started to go backwards,there was no evidence he could have turned it around,going off our form since october with a few good highlights,really wasnt good enough. they expected the euphoria surrounding joes return to not only have an effext on the fans,but the players alike,it worked on one and isnt working on the other.it was a gamble and it failed. in your eyes it was the wrong decision,in others eyes it was the wrong decision,in tta's it was obviously the right decision as they made it,they pay the wages they put the money in,they are entitled to do as they see fit. to just let shez see out the season as it was heading,they wouyld have been slaughtered for it come may for not being proactive enough. they made a choice,it hasnt worked and now there is more resent comming in there way,who would want to run a football club eh. Is that a fact or is it a case something that gets mentioned enough times becomes fact? Only takes one shot to cannon of someone's arse to turn around around bad form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 Is that a fact or is it a case something that gets mentioned enough times becomes fact? Only takes one shot to cannon of someone's arse to turn around around bad form. as far as i am aware yes its fact,it was in his contract as many other clauses were. you shouldnt have to rely on a shot going in off someones arse to turn your fortunes around should you. the team should be capable of putting in a full shift each and every game and playing to there full potential,sadly they havent for one reason or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oafc88 Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 (edited) So you'd have kept Shez next season as well? "he has now signed up until June 2010." If we went up yes im rather red faced now Edited April 11, 2009 by Oafc88 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeylandLatic Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 Crickey.... No way the current manager was going to turn around but we thought Joe could pull a rabbit out of the out.... I am wondering if its worth bothering going any more... I think were looking at another 10 years stuck in this league with the combination of poor appointments and over reacting fans... That's right, our 'current manager' shez was not going to turn things around, a new manager may have given us that lift to spark the team into action again. It's common for teams to perform better for at least a few weeks when a new man arrives but unfortunately it hasn't happened. What is so difficult tio understand? At least this way gave us an outside chance to make the play offs, under Shez it just wasn't going to happen. If you think he was going to turn it around you're mental, what signs were there of an upturn in form? It's not like we were creating chances and missing them, we were being out played and whilst the league position fell the form was plummiting. So you're thinking of not bothering going anymore because we sacked a manager 10 games earlier than he would have been anyway? That makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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