ghostofcecere Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Just for you NewBlue Dale show a real upward trend when they started doing well but then a huge drop in attendances when they got relegated againn and struggled in their first season down. It soon picked up again last season though when they were back at the top of League two. Using the same comparison I did in the blog using 1997 as a base, Dale have seen a 58% increase in crowds. Are the figures for Dale skewed by us filling their ground for them when they come up to L1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scapegoat Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 If you put together a squad of the last 5 years based on the best 24-25 players they would easily be able to sustain a top 6 challenge. However keeping the better ones on appears to be a real problem. Interesting statement - worthy of discussion. Who would be in this squad then? Struggling to think of too many players that have left us in the last 5 seasons and gone on to be a genuine success i.e. playing at a higher level or challenging for promotion from this division? As for relegation being a good thing, a chance to re-group, win some matches, get confidence and win promotion with boosted attendances. Remember saying the same thing 18 years ago, and about 3 years before that. It might work, but it also might be the beginning of the end. There are some 'established' league clubs in my mind, that are now struggling to stay in the league, or have already slipped away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue_Guru Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Unfortunately if you are a smaller club you generally need a chairman willing and able to afford to speculate to accumulate in this league...something which will be stamped out by FFP Investors will now need to build the infrastructure first to generate the money to invest on the pitch...something I imagine will detract a lot of investors looking for a quick buck or a toy... As much as Corney has steadied the ship at OAFC he will never be able to generate the infrastructure needed for that next level...even the new stand won't be enough for us to compete IMO...he is more like an administrator waiting for a buyer...gradually stripping assets to keep self funding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostofcecere Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Interesting statement - worthy of discussion. Who would be in this squad then? Struggling to think of too many players that have left us in the last 5 seasons and gone on to be a genuine success i.e. playing at a higher level or challenging for promotion from this division? As for relegation being a good thing, a chance to re-group, win some matches, get confidence and win promotion with boosted attendances. Remember saying the same thing 18 years ago, and about 3 years before that. It might work, but it also might be the beginning of the end. There are some 'established' league clubs in my mind, that are now struggling to stay in the league, or have already slipped away. Jon Grounds, Tarky, Korey Smith, Matt Smith, Jose Baxter....... we'd be a better team for those 5 in there for sure added to the better players we have now like Kelly, Jones and the reborn Winchester. I'd argue they could be top 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I often wonder what Maggie Thatcher would have made of FFP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue_Guru Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Jon Grounds, Tarky, Korey Smith, Matt Smith, Jose Baxter....... we'd be a better team for those 5 in there for sure added to the better players we have now like Kelly, Jones and the reborn Winchester. I'd argue they could be top 6 The reality is we can only afford 3/4 players at their wage demands at any one time though... Until we can afford 7/8 of our starting 11 we are destined to stay in this leage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stargazer Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 17 seasons is Division 2(the Championship today) was terrific . Frequently punching above our weight , with struggles in many seasons but always with a squad of solid journeyman , ageing former top flight players and some terrific purchases , I loved every minute of it. 18 seasons and counting of Division 1(Division 3 in my book ) of journeymen and loanees I have frequently never heard of , constant ridiculous turnover of players , with only 1 realistic attempt at promotion , which of course lead to the destruction of the club .......is tedious . Better than being out of the league like other similar clubs ,yes . I reckon you must be at least 25 to have any recollection of a relegation & over 30 to recall a promotion .......the younger generation of fans deserve a medal for sticking with the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peanuts Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 seen two promotions and two relegations a trip to wembley and three semi finals since my first game in 73 my kids have seen two play off semis and lots of ups and downs they live five minuets from old trafford and you know what they love this club and always will why i dont know but think that it gets into your blood either that or we are all just masochists Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Mck Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 17 seasons is Division 2(the Championship today) was terrific . Frequently punching above our weight , with struggles in many seasons but always with a squad of solid journeyman , ageing former top flight players and some terrific purchases , I loved every minute of it. 18 seasons and counting of Division 1(Division 3 in my book ) of journeymen and loanees I have frequently never heard of , constant ridiculous turnover of players , with only 1 realistic attempt at promotion , which of course lead to the destruction of the club .......is tedious . Better than being out of the league like other similar clubs ,yes . I reckon you must be at least 25 to have any recollection of a relegation & over 30 to recall a promotion .......the younger generation of fans deserve a medal for sticking with the club. 17 seasons in old school Div 2 really was terrific when you look back doesn't it? We were always happy! We rode out the threat of relegation several times, had a few comfy mid-tables and then had those 3 glorious cracks at it. Whatever the outcome, we were very happy where we were. if we won a few, we put a few on the gate, lost a few, lost a few on the gate - but it worked itself out. Then when we went ballistic, so too the fever and the crowds.... That's the difference. It was never mundane, and we all knew deep down that we were in the 2nd tier of English football. Today it ismundane, the quality is often poor and we are in the 3rd tier with only the 4th seeming a possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Mck Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 17 seasons is Division 2(the Championship today) was terrific . Frequently punching above our weight , with struggles in many seasons but always with a squad of solid journeyman , ageing former top flight players and some terrific purchases , I loved every minute of it. 18 seasons and counting of Division 1(Division 3 in my book ) of journeymen and loanees I have frequently never heard of , constant ridiculous turnover of players , with only 1 realistic attempt at promotion , which of course lead to the destruction of the club .......is tedious . Better than being out of the league like other similar clubs ,yes . I reckon you must be at least 25 to have any recollection of a relegation & over 30 to recall a promotion .......the younger generation of fans deserve a medal for sticking with the club. 17 seasons in old school Div 2 really was terrific when you look back doesn't it? We were always happy! We rode out the threat of relegation several times, had a few comfy mid-tables and then had those 3 glorious cracks at it. Whatever the outcome, we were very happy where we were. if we won a few, we put a few on the gate, lost a few, lost a few on the gate - but it worked itself out. Then when we went ballistic, so too the fever and the crowds.... That's the difference. It was never mundane, and we all knew deep down that we were in the 2nd tier of English football. Today it ismundane, the quality is often poor and we are in the 3rd tier with only the 4th seeming a possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Mck Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Apologies for cack handed posts Stargazer! You get my drift hopefully! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Unfortunately if you are a smaller club you generally need a chairman willing and able to afford to speculate to accumulate in this league...something which will be stamped out by FFP Wouldn't a wealthy owner simply be able to use one of his other companies to sponsor the club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I often wonder what Maggie Thatcher would have made of FFP. It's all bent as :censored: isn't it. Expenditure rules brought in to stop clubs, 99% of whom have never gone out of business, going out of business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 It's all bent as :censored: isn't it. Expenditure rules brought in to stop clubs, 99% of whom have never gone out of business, going out of business. It's the biggest crock of :censored: going. L1 and L2 operating to different rules to the Championship, who have to operate to different rules to the Premier League. As you say, bent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue_Guru Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Wouldn't a wealthy owner simply be able to use one of his other companies to sponsor the club? Alla City? I reckon they will clamp down on certain revenue streams pretty soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Alla City? I reckon they will clamp down on certain revenue streams pretty soon You know what, I think they will just do away with it in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 You know what, I think they will just do away with it in time. I imagine it wouldn't stand up in a court of law once it prohibits enough owners running their clubs in the way they'd like to..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Interesting statement - worthy of discussion. Who would be in this squad then? Struggling to think of too many players that have left us in the last 5 seasons and gone on to be a genuine success i.e. playing at a higher level or challenging for promotion from this division? Stephens Taylor Adeyemi, Tarkowski, Matt Smith all employed currently by Championship clubs most are getting game time too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Stephens Taylor Adeyemi, Tarkowski, Matt Smith all employed currently by Championship clubs most are getting game time too. Let's not forget that Championship coaching is of a higher standard though. Would they have done so well slumming it at Chapel Road taking instruction from Gerry Taggart between sips of his brew? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Let's not forget that Championship coaching is of a higher standard though. Would they have done so well slumming it at Chapel Road taking instruction from Gerry Taggart between sips of his brew? Well they all had to suffer at least 12 months of that and didn't do to badly out if it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Let's not forget that Championship coaching is of a higher standard though. Would they have done so well slumming it at Chapel Road taking instruction from Gerry Taggart between sips of his brew? Well they all had to suffer at least 12 months of that and didn't do to badly out if it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 (edited) I strongly believe our lack of an intense rivalry counts against us when it comes to crowds, maybe not a sole reason fans don't attend but it can really motivate a fan base to have more interest by giving the club a purpose and is one of many small reasons for apathy. Ironic and slightly disappointing considering the amount of teams in close proximity. Edited March 16, 2015 by NewBlue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 I often wonder what Maggie Thatcher would have made of FFP.As she was known not to be a huge football fan I doubt she'd have cared. The behaviour of the European Commission in doing a deal with the big clubs and leagues over transfer windows which is completely outside their own freedom of trade and employment law gives you a clue how it will pan out though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latics and England Posted March 17, 2015 Author Share Posted March 17, 2015 I strongly believe our lack of an intense rivalry counts against us when it comes to crowds, maybe not a sole reason fans don't attend but it can really motivate a fan base to have more interest by giving the club a purpose and is one of many small reasons for apathy. Ironic and slightly disappointing considering the amount of teams in close proximity. If they don't go up I've a feeling something of a rivalry with Barnsley might grow over our next few meetings. That said, I can't see it makes a major difference other than the two games a season the club's meet. There's probably not many stronger rivalries than Wrexham and Chester but it hasn't done either of them a great deal of good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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