nzlatic

If that's right and those games were publicised before the season started would anyone have complained? Some on here would have taken more of a gamble and not moved for some games, but the club were more cautious. Fair enough. I'd rather that approach than using hindsight to predict away attendances.

I disagree with some of the comments on this thread so I'm going to smash my iphone to pieces with a hammer. I'm sick of the internet treating me like this.

If the fans thought it was equally as good in either experiment, what did the players think? Is that not the main point as said above? If one is better than the other and the players are encouraged by a louder support then that's a plus isn't it? So worth pursuing.

Done. Small cost really considering the amount of time I spend on here!

Exactly! It's not like we would have turned down higher bids for him, and if him and/or his agent was pushing for a move and massive salary increase then we had to take what we could get. What would be the point in forcing him to stay when he doesn't want to and potentially disrupt the dressing room? Players and agents hold all the cards these days.

I'm not saying he's not worth a go, just playing devils advocate,but there are other clubs that do have £100k and yet he's still at Halifax. He's been on the radar for a while now and still no takers.

I know 2 FCUM fans and they seem to support both teams just as passionately. It's this I don't get. Maybe some Oldham fans do this too with other teams but it's not promoted and glorified. I just can't see how you can truly support and have that personal connection with more than 1 team. What FCUM have done is commendable, it's a good model. But they're Man United fans at heart - this is an extension of their supporters club basically. And if they're so anti-Glazer and all that the money-oriented aspect of modern football at the top level brings, then they should have focused their efforts on to organising and leading a revolution to move to the sort of set up they have in Germany for example where football is fan-focused. Get their club back for want of a better phrase. If you "HG" then why continue to be follow/support/be a part of the sky funded billions that attract the likes of the Glazers to the game in the first place? Bit off topic this anyway!

My gripe with them is that the fans still continue to support Man United and enjoy (maybe not so much this season) league, cup and european wins. It's as if they want the buzz of a community club, standing and away days at small grounds with small crowds away from the megastore bag holding 1 game per season "fans". But at the same time they want to take part in and enjoy the glory of being one of the most successful clubs in the world paying players 8 figure salaries. If FC was born out of protest against what the Glazers have done at MUFC, why continue to support MUFC? Smacks of having their cake and eating it.

If this had been the first statement would there have been many complaints? ie we want as many people in the chaddy end as possible and have sorted a temp booze licence for the trial, but we've left rre open for those who really don't want to move. Is the final outcome too far wide of the mark?

I kind of agree with you about sticking to decisions but can't help think it's all a bit... club doesn't listen to fans, "club should listen to fans", club listens to fans, "club shouldn't listen to fans".

Ha, my dad knew him. At least I presume it was him, he often talked about someone he knew who played for Charlton in that cup final. I think they knew each other pre-war. I didn't realise he went on to manage Latics though.

Played against Wes Wilkinson a few times in 5aside. He loved to take the piss. Also, I went to school with Thomas Evans who used to play in goal for Sheff Utd, Palace and Scunthorpe. Had a blinder in a Wembley play off final once I believe. He never used to like going in goals at lunch time and as it was my ball I got given the duty once of telling him to play in nets or :censored: off. I like to take a bit of credit for that Wembley performance.

Doncaster Rovers were in a shocking state, relegated from the league in a dilapidated ground with crowds of a few hundred. They sorted themselves out and were getting crowds of several thousand when getting promoted again. They've done alright since. BUT there are probably plenty of other examples of teams going down and staying down. People were probably having this discussion when we last got relegated. Here we are 17 years later. We need to stay up, desperately.

I've been having a think about this issue over the last couple of days and the problem I have with the trust at the moment is that I have no idea what it's there for anymore. Playershare is doing well, especially more so recently because of 2 things. Direction and promotion. There's a clear message about what it is there to achieve - if you contribute that will have a direct influence on the playing staff. And the more contributions the better calibre of player we can get in. Simple to grasp and easy to donate thanks to the efforts of the people involved in promoting and running it and also the ideas of others to help promote it. Johnson admits he made a mistake with it this season but imagine what an advert for playershare it would be if we could grow the fund to pay for Harkins next season. Congratulations to the trust for setting it up in the first place but I can't help but wonder if it would be doing as well if it had stayed within the trust. This is by no means a personal attack on anyone involved in the trust. I joined it years ago when the message was clear - we need a fans representative on the board to prevent anything like the he who must not be named situation happening again. There was promotion, drives to raise funds and ultimately the goal was achieved. But what now? I'm not sure what the aim is. Or what it does for that matter. What I'd expect is fans getting a say in the running of the club. Not day to day, not even a deciding vote, but to have their opinions canvassed and concerns raised at trust meetings and have those opinions fed back to the club. I wouldn't expect minutes from club board meetings, or player salary details, but to use one example of late... why is the manager taking to twitter to ask the fans what they think about moving the home end? Not knocking Johnson, credit to him for asking, but surely this is something that the trust should be taking the lead in? Also, what about the new stand - when this was being designed and planned for this was another opportunity for the fans to be engaged through the trust to canvas opinion on size, style, what should go in it. Again, I'm not saying that fans should have the deciding say but at least let them be heard - let the club present their vision and let the fans debate it with them in a proper meeting. And for those who can't attend meetings, there are plenty of other ways for the trust to connect with fans. New shirt design, discussing what offers or non-offers may have come in for the club, there are a lot of things that could be discussed but as far as I'm aware, aren't. All these sort of things would give the fans a feeling of being connected and part of the club. It all feels very "us and them" at the moment. As this playershare drive has shown, fans are more than willing to help and contribute, they just need to know what's being asked of them.

I agree with what you're saying. I guess the point I was making was that I don't believe changing the team has been a big reason for poor form, more a result of it. The reason for poor form is covered a lot by the other questions you asked which the manager has to take a large responsibility for rather than this "tinkerman" tag he's got.

How many times this season on the "team for next week" threads that come up after every game have the majority of replies been that there should be no changes? We keep losing and/or playing :censored:. So I'm not surprised there have been regular changes. Teams at the top make less changes than teams at the bottom mainly because they don't need to - players are on form and merit keeping their places.

It's hard to compare, but the losing finalists had Dean Brill in net. And they're 5th in the Premier league.

I'll donate £20 too when we stay up.

Me too, for pretty much the same reason! Plus all the promotion work done on here. Well done to everyone involved.

I don't have the quote either but I think he said that it helped them as it energised Baxter or "puffed his chest out" as I think the quote was. Which was probably true. And at the time I was thinking the same and questioning why we did it. But he didn't say we lost because of it, that's different entirely. Just like "we lost because of the ball boys" isn't what he said, nor was "we lost because of the fans". Also, did he say "my tactics were working great until then" or something along the lines of us playing well? He's been critical of a few things and that's up for debate if you want but he hasn't said the things you're slagging him off for.

If you show me a quote from him saying that then I'll agree with you.

I was going to respond to that part of the post until I saw this. Couldn't sum it up any better really!

The phrase "on the cheap" keeps cropping up. Is there money available to the club that isn't spent on either the day to day running or the playing staff? Where is this money supposedly coming from and where is it going to? What is the black hole? Or who's pockets are being lined? Doesn't the club have to show all this in published accounts? It's so easy to trot these same old accusations out but I don't see any evidence being put forward. Happy to say I'm wrong if someone can prove otherwise?

True if there were no clauses in the contract based on poor performance. If there are no clauses then it's a stupid contract. If there are clauses that say prevent us losing him for nothing if he comes good and prevent him costing us a fortune if he has to go - then it's a pretty astute bit of business.

I'm sure they do. But watching Preston on Saturday, they may get promoted but would come straight back down in my opinion without a major overhaul of the team. There's too much quality in the Championship and they would get found out quite easily. Even we weren't all that far off getting something out of that game.