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Chron re: McDonald and Donaldson


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if stephens goes to norwich on a free and mcdonald comes here as 2 'seperate' deals the bury get 20% of nothing.

 

Let's not be naive.

Bury would, correctly, lodge a complaint with the Football League on the basis that Oldham & Norwich conspired to cheat them out of 20% of the value of a player , Stephens, that a matter of weeks before Oldham had valued as worth a significant amount (see statements from the club).

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if stephens goes to norwich on a free and mcdonald comes here as 2 'seperate' deals the Bury get 20% of nothing.

 

We'd have to release him and they'd have to release Cody. It would take a great amount of trust in Norwich and the players involved, and their agents (yeah right). A free would just go to tribunal.

 

Plus, I wouldn't want a hearing at the FA for about ten years if we did that.

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I still don't understand we paid Bury money for Stephens and as part of the deal they would get 20% of the fee we get. If we don't get a fee then we can't give 20% of it. 20% of nothing is nothing.

 

exactly! im not saying i agree with the ethics of it but it is possible. if we paid 5ok to norwich as a 'nominal fee' for macdonald and sent stephens to norwich either on loan or on a free then we don't pay bury 100k and norwich get 50k. doesn't seem alot to a pl club but still not to be sniffed at!it's the equivalant of 1250 shirt sales.

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I still don't understand we paid Bury money for Stephens and as part of the deal they would get 20% of the fee we get. If we don't get a fee then we can't give 20% of it. 20% of nothing is nothing.

 

Let's say this slowly.

 

An exchange of players - if there is a sell on fee applying to one or both of them - is referred to a tribunal. This is so clubs get what is rightly theirs.

 

Not sure how much more clearly to explain it.

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I am genuinely puzzled how any club can demand a fee from a transfer when none has been obtained, my understanding of the rules is that a 20% clause would relate to any transfer money recieved for the player. In theory if a player were to leave for free then there would be no transfer hence no 20%. I am proberly wrong on this it just seems ilogical for it to work any other way as we have already paid a fee for Stephens that was decided by the tribunal in the first place.

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I am genuinely puzzled how any club can demand a fee from a transfer when none has been obtained, my understanding of the rules is that a 20% clause would relate to any transfer money recieved for the player. In theory if a player were to leave for free then there would be no transfer hence no 20%. I am proberly wrong on this it just seems ilogical for it to work any other way as we have already paid a fee for Stephens that was decided by the tribunal in the first place.

 

It's quite simple. To stop teams cheating the sell on clause, those with a sell on clause can take any transition of player to tribunal if they wish (and think they are sold short). Therefore if we swap a player worth £500k for one worth the same value (say McDonald), Bury would still receive £100k for their 20%. It stops us doing the ZeroK swaps you talk of.

 

It doesn't happen often as players are rarely sold below their value. Though I would have given it a go if I were Wrexham and the Eardley affair.

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Well easy away round it we let Stephens go for free and Norwich give us McDonald for a nominal fee or free.

You're suggesting then that we should give a player to a Premiership club in exchange for a player they deem not good enough for that level and we should pay them an additional top-up fee?

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll be thrilled if we sign McDonald (not that we will) but there's no way he's worth more than Stephens.

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You're suggesting then that we should give a player to a Premiership club in exchange for a player they deem not good enough for that level and we should pay them an additional top-up fee?

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll be thrilled if we sign McDonald (not that we will) but there's no way he's worth more than Stephens.

 

spot on.

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I am genuinely puzzled how any club can demand a fee from a transfer when none has been obtained, my understanding of the rules is that a 20% clause would relate to any transfer money recieved for the player. In theory if a player were to leave for free then there would be no transfer hence no 20%. I am proberly wrong on this it just seems ilogical for it to work any other way as we have already paid a fee for Stephens that was decided by the tribunal in the first place.

 

You are probably right, however in the real world, Oldham would never allow Stephens to go to a higher club for nothing, without recieving something in return. It is a very simple view to try and treat two seperate transactions involving two clubs as being truly seperate, especially when it results with a third party not recieving a fee it would have expected. Businesses try and do this with tax on a regular basis, and it is known in the non-criminal sense as being 'avoidance'. The tax man has 'anti-avoidance' measures in place to stop schemes which are just about avoiding tax. I would expect the FL to have similar measures in place to stop clubs avoiding paying sell on fees.

 

As for a swap deal, this would be seen in the eyes of the tax man as being a 'barter transaction' and would expect each party to issue an invoice for the monetary value even though no money changes hands.

Edited by jimsleftfoot
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Lets say Danny Philiskirk had a sell on clause from Chelsea the lad has been released what is his value to Sheff United as an example? Do we have a claim? or is that just for Bury?

 

Can someone answer the mutual loan arrangement. ? 20% of what?

 

I am pretty sure we did have a sell on clause for Danny but if he is released then we lose out. Like other poster's have pointed out 20% of nothing is nothing so we are losing out and it would be the same case as bury.

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Well easy away round it we let Stephens go for free and Norwich give us McDonald for a nominal fee or free.

I'm sure we'd be deligghted if City did a similar deal with Barcelona involving Micah Richards.

 

A tribunual would put a fee on both players. If not, the VAT man would certainly show an interest as such activity would be fraudulent.

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Norwich City tell Oldham to up thier bid for Cody Mc he will not leave for anything under £3.000.000

 

That looks more like £3million to me!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Due to the '.' that is actually £3. However we are only currently offering £1 and a mars bar.. However if we add a twix extra to the offer, we may be able to do a deal..

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Due to the '.' that is actually £3. However we are only currently offering £1 and a mars bar.. However if we add a twix extra to the offer, we may be able to do a deal..

 

 

Due to the '.' that is actually £3

 

Only if you knock off the last zero...£3.000.00

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