Raging

[IceStationLatic]

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/sport/football/oldham_athletic/s/1588007_chesterfield-fc-2-oldham-athletic-1

 

Anyone at the game see this.....

 

-- Dickov, who had a 10-minute summit with chairman Simon Corney on the pitch after the final whistle, warned his men: “It’s going to be a long 11 days. If they think they are going to get some time off they have another thing coming.” --

[singe]

I think we all know the feeling of wanting to give them a kick up the backside.

But are we getting to stage where some of the players are fearful of making a mistake?

 

It's finely balanced, and summits ont he pitch are a worry, but at least they could speak their minds,

[slystallone]

So, from Corney; a venting rant in the local press and now a 10minute "summit meeting" on the pitch after a loss.

 

Writing looks to be on the wall doesn't it - as OPU said last night; dead man walking.

[Hands on]

Just more evidence that Dickov has lost the plot. The more you dwell on mistakes the more careful players become the more likely you are to make mistakes. It's the looking over the shoulder thing, figuratively speaking because those back passes, which stops us going forward when we are in front. Shouting at them and making them work harder is not the answer. I've now given up on Dickov and hope Corney has given him a final warning.

Edited September 5, 2012 by Hands on

[Twisbrogan]

Was the "summit meeting" before or after PD gave his "raging" quote to the press? Would there be a summit meeting on the pitch at all ? (Would have thought a roof would be a minimum requirement and a table/ chairs combo the professionally accepted norm...and coffee)

 

As Sly has said previously, I think the casual mention of a 10 game judgement period has established a target and focus where there didn't really need to be one. I think Corney will allow that (as possibly a little more) but now many will see that as when we need to assess and act.

[oafcprozac]

Anything less than 4 points from the two home games and the thinnest of thin ice, may well crack. Not only that we need goals and entertainment - we've had none of that since Christmas. Will a new manager change things? Well he can change tactics, and will need a couple of experienced additions. I think Corney is deliberately holding back some of the budget, given he has let Dickov bring in so many loanees (to little effect) in the past.

 

Who do we go for if PD is shown the door?

 

My number one choice would be Peter Reid…. if the club is soon to be moving forward off the field we need stability on it and that means at the very least staying in the league we're in. I want PD to succeed, but people have to realise although the bad run goes back to the New Year, we've won only 4 games at home all Calendar year and scored only 14 goals in those 15 home games. When we have a go we look a decent side, when we try and shut up shop we look dreadful and devoid of ideas. One thing dickov was well known during his career was having a go, so who is this reserved, negative tactical manager he has become?

Edited September 5, 2012 by oafcprozac

[Twisbrogan]

When we have a go we look a decent side, when we try and :censored: up shop we look dreadful and devoid of ideas. One thing dickov was well known during his career was having a go, so who is this reserved, negative tactical manager he has become?

 

After match quotes would suggest that PD would still like them to have a go - just that the players aren't executing his instructions and that's why he's been so upset after Walsall & last night. Clearly, getting players to carry out your instructions is part & parcel of management but I'm not sure if he actually wants them to shut up shop all the time.

[oafcprozac]

Simpson was clearly moved into a midfield 5 last night after HT which simply isolated Smith, with the midfielders rarely passing halfway until the late surge - resulting on a couple of potshots. If someone had gambled into the space between Smith and the midfield, we would have won the game. Time and again Smith knocked down only for no bugger to be there.

[Twisbrogan]

Simpson was clearly moved into a midfield 5 last night after HT which simply isolated Smith, with the midfielders rarely passing halfway until the late surge - resulting on a couple of potshots. If someone had gambled into the space between Smith and the midfield, we would have won the game. Time and again Smith knocked down only for no bugger to be there.

 

Fair enough, I wasn't there last night. Against Stevenage when we went to 5 in midfield, PD had said he expected his midfielders to offer more in terms of attacking support but they failed to do that. However, I'd agree that, if we were on top in the first half, then pulling someone back seems defensive. A simple call to focus on the opening minutes of the half (when you'd expect the opposition to try and get the goal back) may have done.

[HarryBosch]

Whatever he had them training to do pre-season it isn't working or they aren't doing it for some reason.

 

I'd go gung ho v Notts County & Scunthorpe if I were him.

Win one, lose one with a load of goals will give him much more chance of keeping his job than two dull draws.

 

If you take the mistakes out of the equation the defence do actually look quite well drilled, they'll be fine left exposed for a game or two

[HarryBosch]

Simpson was clearly moved into a midfield 5 last night after HT which simply isolated Smith, with the midfielders rarely passing halfway until the late surge - resulting on a couple of potshots. If someone had gambled into the space between Smith and the midfield, we would have won the game. Time and again Smith knocked down only for no bugger to be there.

 

What actually is Simpsons natural position?

 

Is this his problem & why he's never stayed anywhere long - that he doesn't have one?

[Twisbrogan]

Whatever he had them training to do pre-season it isn't working or they aren't doing it for some reason.

 

 

 

I don't know who I blame more, the coaching staff, Rui Miguel or Billy.

 

(I'm joking. It's Billy, obviously.)

[slystallone]

After match quotes would suggest that PD would still like them to have a go - just that the players aren't executing his instructions and that's why he's been so upset after Walsall & last night. Clearly, getting players to carry out your instructions is part & parcel of management but I'm not sure if he actually wants them to shut up shop all the time.

 

Now, being a pendant here, surely in any walk of life, and I'm not talking about just football here, if a manager cannot actually manage his/her team, getting them to execute their plans properly, and as a result performance is negatively affected, the responsibility for that rests with the manager?

 

I'll wager we've all examples of working under poor bosses, and the opposite, of working under great bosses. When a manager has not planned properly, has no discernible direction for the team to head in, cannot motivate or lead the team to achieve goals, resorts to public chastising of the team and ultimately oversees a drop in production and or performance - then that manager is usually taken out of the process, and one who can do all of the above is brought in to replace the previous one.

 

Exact same teams can achieve immense changes in productivity merely by bringing in another manager.

 

We've a few very good league one players in this team, we've got some decent lower league players as squad bulk and we have 1 or 2 very promising kids, who if developed and used properly, could turn out to be very; very good players indeed. But - it doesn't appear to be working. There's only so many times that you can blame the team; whilst the manager avoids criticism. Ultimately, its his decisions all along the road that lead to the overall output. We're in a very poor run, and I'm starting to question the ability of the manager of this group to get the best of said group.

 

 

By his own stupid admission, he's got 4 games to show he's got it in him to turn it around.

[IceStationLatic]

Was it really a stupid admission to say 'judge me after ten games'...? What's happened at Chesterfield and Coventry maybe shows it wasn't. And he's hardly going to get away with saying, judge me after 15/20... It was just a typical thing to say to try to counter a lot of negativity from the fans after only three league games. Yes it does set him up for a fall, but if we were doing really pants, and playing pants, after ten games then he'd be on thin nice in any case - whether he'd said it or not.

[PlayItLivo]

 

 

I'm not talking about just football here, if a manager cannot actually manage his/her team, getting them to execute their plans properly, and as a result performance is negatively affected, the responsibility for that rests with the manager?

 

I'll wager we've all examples of working under poor bosses, and the opposite, of working under great bosses. When a manager has not planned properly, has no discernible direction for the team to head in, cannot motivate or lead the team to achieve goals, resorts to public chastising of the team and ultimately oversees a drop in production and or performance - then that manager is usually taken out of the process, and one who can do all of the above is brought in to replace the previous one.

 

 

If only! In most work places :censored: just rolls downhill and the employees are the ones who get the cut.

[oafcprozac]

What actually is Simpsons natural position?

 

Is this his problem & why he's never stayed anywhere long - that he doesn't have one?

 

That's the problem for me, what indeed is his position? He doesn't like getting in the box likes to drop deep and is mostly marked out of the game. For me the attack has to be Smith and A N Other to capitalise on his many knock downs and lay offs. However, Dickov will panic and revert to Slew and Simpson once the former is fit - thus sealing his fate after another run of goalless and insipid performances.

 

He's tried the arm around the shoulder, it didn't work. He's tried kicking arse, it hasn't worked - probably because he's so damned scared of making changes. When he did bring the kids on last night we looked better.

 

As for Simpson, he'd be better used as an attacking midfielder, IF we can get him to make those late runs into the box we are devoid of, because he simply does not have that striker's instinct. Of his 9 goals last season only a couple were inside box.

Edited September 5, 2012 by oafcprozac

[bigfatjoe1]

surely the biggest problem remains the size of the squad. who is to blame? PD failed to sign 3-4 players? Corney not giving him the money? answer the question then point the finger.

[lancy lad]

surely the biggest problem remains the size of the squad. who is to blame? PD failed to sign 3-4 players? Corney not giving him the money? answer the question then point the finger.

I can't altogether go with that, we spent £50k on Montano and I bet Portugal wasn't cheap!

[singe]

Interestingly the Telegraph reported it as £60,000.

Given their investigative record with MP's I am inclined to go with that.

I bet there was a sell on for West ham though.

[slystallone]

If only! In most work places :censored: just rolls downhill and the employees are the ones who get the cut.

 

I realise that (at the bottom being " Mushrooms" and all that) but i've been at a company and part of team where an underperforming team stayed the same, but a change of manager brought about a massive up-turn in fortune for the dept. It was seen there was an issue, and rightly, it was seen that the issue was at the top & not within the team itself. 1 change later and it was fully turned around.

I'm sure others will have similar examples too....

[lancy lad]

Interestingly the Telegraph reported it as £60,000.

Given their investigative record with MP's I am inclined to go with that.

I bet there was a sell on for West ham though.

Fair play!

[oafcprozac]

But the budget was set, it wasn't increased just because PD wanted a Portuguese jolly up, the Pitch maintenance I believe came out of the playing budget too - add those up and you have another salary. Then Dickov decided he wanted to release a couple of Youth Teamers in favour of using their potential full-time salaries in favour of signing another kid, that is nowhere near ready for first-team football. The £50k for Montano came out of that same budget, no more has been put into it. The pot now is supposedly dry but I can't help but think when agreeing PD's budget, whether Corney withheld some…..just in case. If not whether PD is fired or not, we'll be in the same situation of a paper-thin squad with little room for the maneuverability we need.

 

I said before the window closed, we needed to cash in on one or two of the saleable assets, if we are to get the squad we need. I'd sacrifice some of the perceived 'flair' in the squad for hard work, leadership and goals. You don't need flair in this league, hard work and the ability to nick a goal is usually enough.

Edited September 5, 2012 by oafcprozac

[Monty Burns]

I realise that (at the bottom being " Mushrooms" and all that) but i've been at a company and part of team where an underperforming team stayed the same, but a change of manager brought about a massive up-turn in fortune for the dept. It was seen there was an issue, and rightly, it was seen that the issue was at the top & not within the team itself. 1 change later and it was fully turned around.

I'm sure others will have similar examples too....

 

Yeah I've got one. I support this Football Club called Oldham Athletic. Every few years the fans get restless and agitate the board to fire the manager. Usually within a few weeks they oblige, resulting in a massive staying the same of the clubs results. In fact they steadily get worse.

[slystallone]

Yeah I've got one. I support this Football Club called Oldham Athletic. Every few years the fans get restless and agitate the board to fire the manager. Usually within a few weeks they oblige, resulting in a massive staying the same of the clubs results. In fact they steadily get worse.

 

Nice!!

 

For the record, I'm not a Dickov outer - far from it fact. I just think he's really not helped his case with media quotes, and I'm just starting to wonder if it really is just a case of 'the players just aren't listening to me'.....

[UpTheLatics]

Anything less than 4 points from the two home games and the thinnest of thin ice, may well crack. Not only that we need goals and entertainment - we've had none of that since Christmas. Will a new manager change things? Well he can change tactics, and will need a couple of experienced additions. I think Corney is deliberately holding back some of the budget, given he has let Dickov bring in so many loanees (to little effect) in the past.

 

Who do we go for if PD is shown the door?

 

My number one choice would be Peter Reid…. if the club is soon to be moving forward off the field we need stability on it and that means at the very least staying in the league we're in. I want PD to succeed, but people have to realise although the bad run goes back to the New Year, we've won only 4 games at home all Calendar year and scored only 14 goals in those 15 home games. When we have a go we look a decent side, when we try and shut up shop we look dreadful and devoid of ideas. One thing dickov was well known during his career was having a go, so who is this reserved, negative tactical manager he has become?

 

I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying (I do in parts) but why Peter Reid?

 

A lot of Plymouth fans seem to view Reid as a lot of us view Dickov: lovely bloke, not a very good manager. Dickov is young, Reid is 56. Down there he was under tight restrictions. In fact his circumstances are what Dickov is working under now (obviously with serious issues off the field). He failed to inspire results.

 

I can't see how he would influence this club.