Macca Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 its quite simple really...but people dont understand the why's n wherefores because they still look through blue tinted glasses.....like the chaddy versus the rre.... nostalgia is all well and good providing you have a very secure future...unfortunately we dont....selling the land enables us to build a new ground elswhere to provide modern facilities and a year round income.....all for 20 million or there abouts... redeveloping bp would mean spending 80 million to achive this.....dependant on the houses and flats being sold....no guarentee... i know we have to move away....but i dont want us to leave the borough......i think the club needs to work harder on finding a suitable site....and to use more innitiative.... we own the lancaster club....so if we build elsewhere why not turn lancaster club into a sports park with the footy and the 3g pitches to generate income...then its not just a dump of land doing nothing and not earning its keep... the club just needs to look harder and be more practical...a site can and should be found... Sounds like a great idea to me in theory. Use the Lancaster club for what it was intended for in the plans and find another site for the stadium in Oldham? Is that not possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 5 miles may as well be a million miles. It might be stupid to you but the clubs identity is important to me. But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. The. Club. Has. Changed. Your identity now isn't what it was ten years ago. When you were a teenager you did X, Y, Z. Now you're an adult you do 1, 2, 3. You've changed. I've changed. Everything changes. You can not live in a bubble. You can not sit and say "this is how it's always been" because it's not always been that way. The badge has changed. :censored: changes. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Sounds like a great idea to me in theory. Use the Lancaster club for what it was intended for in the plans and find another site for the stadium in Oldham? Is that not possible? Ive wondered this myself we could theoretically sell BP for housing and find 2 sites one to build a stadium and one to develop to bring in added revenue It must surely be a discusion worth having at the moment certainly if their is no 30 acre site available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 we own the lancaster club....so if we build elsewhere why not turn lancaster club into a sports park with the footy and the 3g pitches to generate income...then its not just a dump of land doing nothing and not earning its keep... We don't... Blitz other company does, dosent it ? I imagine any other development funded by the BP money has to contain enough things to make money for Blitz se he gets a return. So a stadium and 3g pitches isnt enough. Still no idea how we end up owning a new stadium when its money another company has ? Its all very confusing.... but I think thats why they keep saying the need a site of x size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. The. Club. Has. Changed. Your identity now isn't what it was ten years ago. When you were a teenager you did X, Y, Z. Now you're an adult you do 1, 2, 3. You've changed. I've changed. Everything changes. You can not live in a bubble. You can not sit and say "this is how it's always been" because it's not always been that way. The badge has changed. :censored: changes. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. The most sensible post since this whole debacle started Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Once you move out of Oldham then you are doing what MK Dons did... The scale obviously depends on how far you go with it but its basically the same. So I totally appreciate and respect anyone who has a stand point like yours... That said... I put the ultimate survival and prosperity of the club over a localised identity that seemed to have died in Football many moons ago. You only have to look at the number of people getting off trains and planes to watch United to see that. the trouble is united utilised its name and surroundings.....and did the right thing marketing wise... we had a chance of doing something on a far smaller scale,when we got into the premier league....we had a chance to make the club a bigger club than it was,is..we had a chance to cash in...but we didnt..we had a board who were more interested in pillaging the club..and no investing in quality players,to keep us in that league and make the most of the cash available....we contributed to our own demise...and these owners rightly or wrongly are taking the brunt of the flak for our failings because of it.... it doesnt matter to me where you play your home games....its just a ground.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macca Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Ive wondered this myself we could theoretically sell BP for housing and find 2 sites one to build a stadium and one to develop to bring in added revenue It must surely be a discusion worth having at the moment certainly if their is no 30 acre site available. A site the council own and with all the pressure on them at the moment with possible legal action, it might be more suitable for a site to be found in Oldham that the club could use to build the stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macca Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. The. Club. Has. Changed. Your identity now isn't what it was ten years ago. When you were a teenager you did X, Y, Z. Now you're an adult you do 1, 2, 3. You've changed. I've changed. Everything changes. You can not live in a bubble. You can not sit and say "this is how it's always been" because it's not always been that way. The badge has changed. :censored: changes. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. It's Ashton, it's Tameside. It's not Oldham. I support the town. As soon as it moves out of the town permanently it no longer is Oldham. Things do change and OAFC can move and change also but if it does I cannot follow. That's the way it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 It's Ashton, it's Tameside. It's not Oldham. I support the town. As soon as it moves out of the town permanently it no longer is Oldham. Things do change and OAFC can move and change also but if it does I cannot follow. That's the way it is. That's fair enough mate. You're entitled to do what you want. Small World takes on a new meaning in Oldham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 (edited) But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. The. Club. Has. Changed. Your identity now isn't what it was ten years ago. When you were a teenager you did X, Y, Z. Now you're an adult you do 1, 2, 3. You've changed. I've changed. Everything changes. You can not live in a bubble. You can not sit and say "this is how it's always been" because it's not always been that way. The badge has changed. :censored: changes. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. I understand this but their are certain things you shouldn't necesarily change Changing the complete location of the club would be like changing its birth certificate. As far as I am concerned their are only 2 things we shouldn't change 1 Being called Oldham Athletic 2 Playing in the boundaries of the borough of Oldham. Everythingelse we should look to evolve and change for the better. Edited February 7, 2011 by GlossopLatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edhunteruk Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 A site the council own and with all the pressure on them at the moment with possible legal action, it might be more suitable for a site to be found in Oldham that the club could use to build the stadium. japinda products is being demolished on burnley lane....then you have the waste land next to it which runs down to behind the rifle range....more than adequate for a stadium and a few extras... convert lancaster club into sports park and theres ya income..... pressue on the council is what everybody should be doing by complaing about this decision...there incompetance etc etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 It's Ashton, it's Tameside. It's not Oldham. I support the town. As soon as it moves out of the town permanently it no longer is Oldham. Things do change and OAFC can move and change also but if it does I cannot follow. That's the way it is. I have noticed a difference of opinion emerge on the site... With many who still live in the town agreeing with you and many who have left the town going the other way.... If you still live in Oldham I can see it having a big impact on the way you feel. Supporting "Oldham" is less relevant to my life now. Specially given its hard to have pride in a town with the image Oldham has had pushed in the national press. That said, I still feel like a tic... and its still my club... The club isn't the town in my eyes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShakerT Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. SNIFF! beautiful, SNIFF! Ive gone all misty eyed, can we have that bit of text on a plaque at the new ground.................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossrocks Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 But identity isn't a dichotomy. It isn't locked to either "identifiable" or "not identifiable". The club has changed location before. The club has changed name before. The club has changed 'colours' before. The club has changed owners. The club has changed players. The club has changed fans. The. Club. Has. Changed. Your identity now isn't what it was ten years ago. When you were a teenager you did X, Y, Z. Now you're an adult you do 1, 2, 3. You've changed. I've changed. Everything changes. You can not live in a bubble. You can not sit and say "this is how it's always been" because it's not always been that way. The badge has changed. :censored: changes. Contextualise what you're saying. Think of the world as a massive place with a million billion things happening every second. Think how insignificant you and I are in that world and then realise that a 5 mile move that allows you to keep watching a sport you love, with people you like and the team you've always watched really isn't that big of a change. Damn right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_R Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 That's fair enough mate. You're entitled to do what you want. Small World takes on a new meaning in Oldham. I think you'd find that if you tried to take practically every other club out of the town of it's name and plonk it somewhere else, their fans would be up in arms. For a hell of a lot of football fans supporting your team is all about local identity. I support Latics because I'm from Oldham, it's my local club. Move it somewhere else and it wont be. Why do people get annoyed at ManU fans from Oldham if it doesn't matter where you come from or where your team plays? If that means I have a small world mentality then so be it. But anyone who thinks that moving us out of Oldham will have the fans flocking is seriously deluded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 (edited) I think you'd find that if you tried to take practically every other club out of the town of it's name and plonk it somewhere else, their fans would be up in arms. For a hell of a lot of football fans supporting your team is all about local identity. I support Latics because I'm from Oldham, it's my local club. Move it somewhere else and it wont be. Why do people get annoyed at ManU fans from Oldham if it doesn't matter where you come from or where your team plays? If that means I have a small world mentality then so be it. But anyone who thinks that moving us out of Oldham will have the fans flocking is seriously deluded. It isn't a "simple" answer to the problem... De-localising the club, maybe call it Pine Villa, and all of a sudden you have a club which could be followed by anyone from Oldham, Rochdale, Tameside, Manchester, local students from other towns... While retaining the history... While its not an idea which is sure to work, to me its worth exploring considering the current approach clearly isn't working. Edited February 7, 2011 by oafc0000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackey Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 I was born in the MRI and the closest to Oldham I've ever lived is Failsworth. I guess that's why I don't have the 'local club' issue. That said how many Latics fans will live closer to Chaddy Town, Oldham Town or a host of other clubs grounds than they do to Boundary Park? It's a bit selective isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc0000 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 I was born in the MRI and the closest to Oldham I've ever lived is Failsworth. I guess that's why I don't have the 'local club' issue. That said how many Latics fans will live closer to Chaddy Town, Oldham Town or a host of other clubs grounds than they do to Boundary Park? It's a bit selective isn't it? Good points... I grew up closer to Oldham Town... Only been once... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfatjoe1 Posted February 7, 2011 Author Share Posted February 7, 2011 Even more delusional is the belief that simply staying in Oldham will somehow save the club. The point is that the small town mentaility can be applied across the board - Oldham Town for Oldhamers, Chadderton Town, Failsworth Dynamos, etc, etc. The other point is that boundaries are largely artifical and porous. If you think that there is something fixed about 'Oldham' and Lancashire then you are very delusional. Moving to Ashton and including Tameside should not have a single negative impact - just on the simple minds of the self deluded. That's what will hold us back and lead to the death of the club. Broaden your horizons all the way to Ashton - it won't kill you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Driving home on my regular 239 mile round trip to see Oldham, I got to thinking about keeping the club pure from dilution, from tainting it in any compromising way. I wonder how others feel about: 1. keeping the club/ground inside the pre 1974 local government re-organstion boundaries. That way we won't have to sufferr the very idea of going to somewhere like Failsworth (or Saddleworth - still in Yorkshire). 2. campaigning to make the Main Stand and Chaddy end grade one listed buildings. They are, after all, fine examples of early football architecture. This would also make any move impossible. 3. perhaps restricting admission to anyone who wasn't born or, let's be generous, doesn't at least live inside the old pre 1974 Oldham boundaries. This would maintain the clubs purity. It would also give greater meaning to the name 'Boundary Park' - keeping up the boundary between past and present.4. ban anyone who mentions Greater Manchester. It's only been 36 years and must be forever resisted. 5. change the motto to 'Oldham Athletic - forever in the 1950s'. 6. have a new motto for a section of the fans who agree with all of the above - 'Litlle Oldhamers - K(UI)TF (Keep us in the Fifties'. Or, 'Little Oldhamers, always part of the problem, never part of the solution.' No never no more will we think beyond the boundary no never no more What do you think? You've just wiped out a good portion of the current gate!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 The MK Dons/Wimbledon analogy has got some relevance but there are big differences as well. Wimbledon had moved out of their home borough more than a decade before the franchise move came around and they never had a clear plan of how to move back in again. I’m willing to believe that they would have gone to the wall sooner rather than later had they not moved and I’m more bothered about what happened to the small existing clubs in and around MK than what happened to the old Wimbledon which had long since ceased to have any claim to moral superiority. It wasn’t wholly surprising that Merton council, unhelpful as they certainly were, couldn’t find room for a Premiership stadium in an area which historically had contained a Southern league club. I’d be interested to know how AFCW fans feel about having moved to a different brother and effectively subsumed another club – Kingstonian – with a long and distinguished history. I’ve no idea whether Tameside is a goer but I still struggle to understand how in a town like Oldham with its industrial history there can’t be another brownfield site available somewhere which can’t accommodate the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 I love how people are going on about Wimbledon becoming the MK Dons, remind me in what part of Wimbledon, was Plough Lane? In fact what part of Wimbledon is Kingsmeadow, the home of AFC Wimbledon, in? How about Chelsea, where in Chelsea is their ground? The same applies to Manchester United? Where is/was the arsenal, after which Arsenal FC are named? Where is Blundell Park, the home of Grimsby? The world won't end if Oldham Athletic moves to the Metropolitan Boroughs of Rochdale or Bury or Tameside or even Manchester. I really can't be bothered trying to find out but quite a lot of people on here are unhappy that more residents of Oldham don't come to watch their town team, how many of them are now against a move outside the borough? How long will it take for the Council to notice that the amount of money being spent in Oldham is significantly less because 2,000 people are not coming into the borough to spend money on football and associated activities? If you want the club to stay in Oldham, then maybe instead of bleating about it on here you should actually do something about it. Bring along your mates, spend more money in the club shop, go out of town to buy stuff (the council will start taking notice if less money is spent in the town), write to your councillor, heck become a councillor, write to your MP, or even club together and stand in elections. Do something, aside from bleating about it on here and threatening to stop going, as what with the people who will keep going, (perhaps even going more often as the transport links are better), and those who will start going, for numerous reasons, I don't think the club are likely to take notice, and to be frank I don't blame them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 I’ve no idea whether Tameside is a goer but I still struggle to understand how in a town like Oldham with its industrial history there can’t be another brownfield site available somewhere which can’t accommodate the club. Every brownfield (i.e. mill) site I can think of in Oldham is/has been snapped up by residential and retail developers. There seems to be no town strategy and no appetite in the council to intervene and ensure leisure development keeps pace. That's why there's nowhere to go and nothing to do in the town - except the usual Friday night beer/kebab/fight routine on Yorkshire St. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 , remind me in what part of Wimbledon, was Plough Lane? Plough Lane was very much in Wimbledon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Whilst thinking up new plots and trips out the borough it's giving us plenty to talk about currently, isn't the promise of professional football being played for 10 years very nearly up?. Also whilst I think a period of quiet in which time to reflect and take stock is a good thing presently, when do you feel it will be time to hear the decisions? The last communication out of the club wasn't positive and potentially damaging to the already low belief in the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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