TTA – Time To Abdicate?

[garcon]

To be slightly pedantic, I don't think it is necessarily (or entirely) negative views of TTA themselves, rather the situation we find ourselves in and the feeling that the latest scheme is not in the best interests of the club. I for one do not believe TTA are guilty of any wrong-doing whatsoever, just an unfortunately long series of well meaning mistakes.

 

Whatever happens, we should be grateful to TTA for coming in when they did. And others are right - there really is no point trying to push them out when there are no suitors on the horizon.

 

If a coherent voice raised the concerns many have about the Failsworth plan loudly enough before it's too late, TTA may yet take notice.

[Corporal_Jones]

Not wishing to make it personal, but there are some that would suggest that you are a sanctimonious old git.

 

I, of course, whould never suggest such a thing. I don't know your age.

 

Sometimes the prophets of doom have a point, although a tendancy to overstate it doesn't always help.

 

I fear little. I would like TTA to sell up and move on - but only to an owner that has the means and staying power to improve the current situation. Until such an owner is found I really don't think a "get the owners out" campaign (organised, or otherwise) helps the football club or the fans.

 

Given that a football club owner can always call in the debt the club has to them and effectively cause the business to enter administration or worse.

 

Then again, last week of the season, 13 points and a superior goal difference from the drop zone, no chance of the play-offs and new owners on the horizon .... a great time to enter administration!

 

 

 

There is no campaign to get the owners out.

[oafc0000]

To be slightly pedantic, I don't think it is necessarily (or entirely) negative views of TTA themselves, rather the situation we find ourselves in and the feeling that the latest scheme is not in the best interests of the club. I for one do not believe TTA are guilty of any wrong-doing whatsoever, just an unfortunately long series of well meaning mistakes.

 

Whatever happens, we should be grateful to TTA for coming in when they did. And others are right - there really is no point trying to push them out when there are no suitors on the horizon.

 

If a coherent voice raised the concerns many have about the Failsworth plan loudly enough before it's too late, TTA may yet take notice.

 

+1

 

That is pretty much spot on... I do have some criticism of TTA aka sacking Shez etc but my only real concern is the Failsworth plan... I was right behind Oldham Arena but this is harder to get behind...

[Corporal_Jones]

it will benefit them too of course but so what? are we so selfish that we want these people who saved our club, stuck with us through hard times and continued to pay off debts to go home empty handed after making us a profit? thats what people seem to be worried about TTA getting money, as long as the club are getting money there should be no quarrels with them pocketing something for themselves

 

 

 

As people seem to have to repeatedly say, hardly anybody is bothered that TTA make money out of the club as long as the club thrives. Thriving is the exact opposite of what it's doing at the moment, and a little ground as good as in Manchester carries no guarantees that this will change. It could make the situation worse.

[oafc0000]

As people seem to have to repeatedly say, hardly anybody is bothered that TTA make money out of the club as long as the club thrives.

 

 

What he said...

[Corporal_Jones]

come take over our club with no money, poor attendences, nothing to generate income and fans who no matter what you do to save their club, will turn on you the moment you make yourself a bit of money

 

TTA arent doing this to piss everyone off im sure of it or they wouldnt have bothered in the first place, they are looking to make the club self sufficient, theres no sense in them leaving after doing that for us, they will stand every chance of attracting investment when the club has something to attract them with, at the moment while we have nothing were going to get laughed away!

 

the question is, if you were in charge what would you do with your money? how would youmake the club self sufficient? remember that there are laws and people opposing your plans and doing everything in their power to stop it

 

 

If you're going to talk about attendances, why not talk about the fact that we were averaging well over 6000 at BP when TTA arrived. What are we averaging now? Let's talk about the way long-term hardcore fans are giving up.

 

The club may stand a chance of attracting some investment if the new gound ever gets built, but when it's a ground with such a small capacity that it indicates ambitions only to survive in the lower divisions, why would anybody with bigger ambitions bother? There are, after all, plenty of clubs with more ambition and bigger and better stadiums crying out for investment. When it comes to investment, we're much more likely to merely swap like for like.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Corporal_Jones

[Stitch_KTF]

Nothing to do with being happy and clapping, although a bit of clapping and singing wouldn't go amiss when the team is playing, but even going to watch the team and getting behind it is now scoffed at.

 

 

Having been 'driven away' by the football this season, I for one have decided to pick my bottom lip up and get back down to BP regularly.

 

I will however be taking a book with me.

[Corporal_Jones]

Quite right. The debacle at Notts County is the flip side of it, and I'm glad we're not going through that. No sign of investment there and they'll be down the pan quicker than you can say "lack of ambition".

 

 

Yes, it's quite obviously a choice between stagnation at this level until professional football disappears from the town, or a Notts County type fiasco.

 

On the other hand, we could seek to emulate those clubs in towns not unlike Oldham who have managed to advance and thrive without imploding.

 

Just a thought.

 

[Senor_Coconut]

If you're going to talk about attendances, why not talk about the fact that we were averaging well over 6000 at BP when TTA arrived. What are we averaging now? Let's talk about the way long-term hardcore fans are giving up.

 

The club may stand a chance of attracting some investment if the new gound ever gets built, but when it's a ground with such a small capacity that it indicates ambitions only to survive in the lower divisions, why would anybody with bigger ambitions bother? There are, after all, plenty of clubs with more ambition and bigger and better stadiums crying out for investment. When it comes to investment, we're much more likely to merely swap like or like.

 

 

 

You keep saying that without adding that the vast majority of those 6000 were people who were duped into buying season tickets early by Chris Moore with the promise Championship football or a real title challenge the following season if we didn't go up.

[leeslover]

If you're going to talk about attendances, why not talk about the fact that we were averaging well over 6000 at BP when TTA arrived. What are we averaging now? Let's talk about the way long-term hardcore fans are giving up.

 

The club may stand a chance of attracting some investment if the new gound ever gets built, but when it's a ground with such a small capacity that it indicates ambitions only to survive in the lower divisions, why would anybody with bigger ambitions bother? There are, after all, plenty of clubs with more ambition and bigger and better stadiums crying out for investment. When it comes to investment, we're much more likely to merely swap like or like.

Just a thought Corp, but would it be a binding clause of the sale agreement that any new owners had to have the same level of ambition as indicated by the stadium size apparently favoured by the current ones?

[oafc0000]

What are we averaging now?

 

 

http://www.owtb.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...st&p=346911

 

Average attendance is around 5346

Edited January 15, 2010 by oafc0000

[Corporal_Jones]

It could have something to do with their memories looming large with the stark reality of the club being only 24 hours away from liquidation, when it looked like Latics would go out of business and have to resurface as a non-league Club. It's so easy now to say they were worrying unnecessarily, because it would never have happened. It's also easy to say that, in spite of TTA coming to the rescue, that's how the Club will end up anyway due to their lack of resources/ambition and eagerness to walk away with money in their pockets.

 

Where there's life there's hope, even if the hope proves to be forlorn. Better to be frightened of shadows and living in hope than to conclude that doom is the only future. Nothing to do with being happy and clapping, although a bit of clapping and singing wouldn't go amiss when the team is playing, but even going to watch the team and getting behind it is now scoffed at.

 

Those who still support the team can empathise with TTA when SC said "We know it’s an emotional thing for many people. We’ve fallen for the place. It’s where we started."

 

It appears to have become fashionable to deride everything to do with the Club, and undermine it to the extent of willing it to fail. Only time will tell whether TTA have been true to their word. In the absence of anyone prepared to buy them out, their statements of intent are all we have until we see how the plans materialise.

 

 

 

If memories of near-liquidation still loom so large for some people that they will swallow a plan for downscaling the club and call it ambition, then there really is no hope.

 

You're right, though: it is easy to say that lack of ambition will kill the club. That doesn't make it untrue. The club is not in the state it's in because people say negative things on here.

[Diego_Sideburns]

If a coherent voice raised the concerns many have about the Failsworth plan loudly enough before it's too late, TTA may yet take notice.

 

+1

 

That is pretty much spot on... I do have some criticism of TTA aka sacking Shez etc but my only real concern is the Failsworth plan... I was right behind Oldham Arena but this is harder to get behind...

 

I'm sure there are enough coherent voices on here to raise those concerns formally with TTA.

[BP1960]

The Corp has a point about ambition, who would have thought we would see the day Rochdale were signing players for around £100,000 while Latics were settling for monthly loanees.

[Corporal_Jones]

Superb post! Pretty much says it all.

 

I have criticised some on here in the past for negative veiws of TTA namely oafc0000 and the Corp and for that I deeply apologise chaps becuase I am converted........!

 

It seems you were right all along and unfortunately we are going nowhere......... and it will only get worse when they sell our land and bail out! IMO

 

 

 

I, for one, had a pretty positive view of TTA until, within the space of a few weeks, we were told that the BP plan was to be ditched in favour of sharing a new stadium with 'another local club,' then, without so much of a pause, that we are to move to Failsworth, with a full quarter (in reality it looks like being considerably more than a quarter) of the projected seating capacity of BP lopped off without any discussion whatsoever.

 

I fail to see how anybody can be positive about such a blatant downscaling of ambitions. Or kid themselves that it doesn't mean permanent third or fourth division football.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Corporal_Jones

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

Yes, it's quite obviously a choice between stagnation at this level until professional football disappears from the town, or a Notts County type fiasco.

 

On the other hand, we could seek to emulate those clubs in towns not unlike Oldham who have managed to advance and thrive without imploding.

 

Just a thought.

 

Oh yeah, those other towns. Like Huddersfield (still here), Blackpool (Major investment, more than TTA), Barnsley (More towards the club model I think we can still sustain), Doncaster (smaller scale Dave Whelan-type chairman).

 

You see corp, I'm not saying it can't be done, but if TTA don't have the ambition and stomach for it any more, then who's going to come in and pump money at it? Doncaster and Blackpool for starters were in much worse shape than we are now when they attracted their investors.

[Corporal_Jones]

You keep saying that without adding that the vast majority of those 6000 were people who were duped into buying season tickets early by Chris Moore with the promise Championship football or a real title challenge the following season if we didn't go up.

 

 

 

So what? All that matters is that the club failed to capture their imaginations enough to stop them drifting away.

 

In any case, gates had been steadily rising since 2001-2, so there's no need to try and rewrite history.

[Corporal_Jones]

Just a thought Corp, but would it be a binding clause of the sale agreement that any new owners had to have the same level of ambition as indicated by the stadium size apparently favoured by the current ones?

 

 

 

There aren't going to be any new owners. The downscalers and their little band of meerkats have won.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Corporal_Jones

[Diego_Sideburns]

If memories of near-liquidation still loom so large for some people that they will swallow a plan for downscaling the club and call it ambition, then there really is no hope.

 

I was referring to the people for whom you said the legacy of Chris Moore is the creation of a menatlity that sees them frightened of their own shadows.

 

Who are those to whom you refer who have swallowed a plan which has still not been produced, apart from those who predict it will lead to doom?

[Corporal_Jones]

Oh yeah, those other towns. Like Huddersfield (still here), Blackpool (Major investment, more than TTA), Barnsley (More towards the club model I think we can still sustain), Doncaster (smaller scale Dave Whelan-type chairman).

 

You see corp, I'm not saying it can't be done, but if TTA don't have the ambition and stomach for it any more, then who's going to come in and pump money at it? Doncaster and Blackpool for starters were in much worse shape than we are now when they attracted their investors.

 

 

 

No, not them. I was thinking more of Bolton, Burnley and Preston.

 

Better not to reach for the sky, though, just in case you find out it's too high.

 

As I said, I don't think anybody is going to come in and pump anything in. Successive incompetent boards have basically knackered the club. We were allowed to get left behind and there will be no recovery. A sub-12000 capacity stadium almost out of town spells it out for you.

[Corporal_Jones]

I was referring to the people for whom you said the legacy of Chris Moore is the creation of a menatlity that sees them frightened of their own shadows.

 

Who are those to whom you refer who have swallowed a plan which has still not been produced, apart from those who predict it will lead to doom?

 

 

 

We've been told enough about the plan to know the gist of it. Don't be so naive.

 

The clue is in the projected capacity. A sub-12000 stadium means ambitions to merely survive at this level. We are already seeing that this isn't enough to capture the imagination of the town. It's even started to alienate long-standing hardcore supporters.

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

No, not them. I was thinking more of Bolton, Burnley and Preston.

 

Better not to reach for the sky, though, just in case you find out it's too high.

 

As I said, I don't think anybody is going to come in and pump anything in. Successive incompetent boards have basically knackered the club. We were allowed to get left behind and there will be no recovery. A sub-12000 capacity stadium almost out of town spells it out for you.

 

But you're constantly banging that drum aren't you? About it all being too little too late. Everyone knows, you can't go rewinding clocks.

 

Do you honestly believe by doing so anything positive or productive will come of it?

[Corporal_Jones]

But you're constantly banging that drum aren't you? About it all being too little too late. Everyone knows, you can't go rewinding clocks.

 

Do you honestly believe by doing so anything positive or productive will come of it?

 

 

 

No-but your point is irrelevant.

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

No-but your point is irrelevant.

 

Ha! What's irrelevent? The fact that what you're banging on about, every day, for the past god-knows-how-long is academic because it happened 10 years ago and it's too late now to do anything about it.

 

Anyway, I'll leave you to it. I've wasted more than my fair share of time on this one.

[Corporal_Jones]

Ha! What's irrelevent? The fact that what you're banging on about, every day, for the past god-knows-how-long is academic because it happened 10 years ago and it's too late now to do anything about it.

 

Anyway, I'll leave you to it. I've wasted more than my fair share of time on this one.

 

 

 

Banging on about it on here is about all that's left to us.

 

You didn't actually have to waste any time on this thread. You didn't have to read it at all. Or you could have read it with me on automatic ignore. That's why your point is irrelevant.

 

You love me really. All the Nodders do.