Dickov: "We're on a bit of a dodgy run"

[UpTheLatics]

I genuinely think Dickov doesn't realise how grave a situation we're in. Initially, I couldn't fault his positivity but he talked about finishing in the top half for too long he must have started to believe it.

 

Today in his post-match comments he talked about the players' misgivings on the field, bit does he recognise our overriding problem? So late in the season - and with the likes of Leyton Orient scoring easy victories at Boundary Park - he needs to drop this "we want to play football... we're best when we're playing across the field, looking for gaps" (partly because we don't, that's a blatant, delusional lie) and start to demand vast improvements.

 

For too long he comments have been full of easing his players and not criticising them. Dickov has essentially treated them like kids and they're been allowed to make mistake after mistake. He's wrapped them up in cotton wool and he's been made to look like an idiot.

 

My confidence in the man is on a dramatic slide, it's sad to say.

[stargazer]

No more excuses for this lot , another miserable performance.

 

Tons of possession ,due to them being a man down twice , but their keeper had very little to do.

 

If we had been the team with 2 men off we would have been battered.

 

We are becoming an awful team to watch and as soon as we are 1-0 down it is game over , any ideas Mr Dickov ?

[steveoafc]

I think if penney or moore were in charge then the vultures would be circling.

 

Dickov talks a good game, and with his undoubted ability to attract better than average loanees ( on paper at least ) has bought himself time.

 

My concern is his ability to motivate and turn out a side that can win football matches.

 

For me, the jury is still out. On the one hand.....do we really want to start all over again ?.....BUT....Do we persevere with a manager with a terrible win record ?

 

We desperately need to see some light at the end of the tunnel.....hopefully with PD.....but i must admit, i'm becoming concerned.

[UpTheLatics]

Can't disagree. Both posts essentially put rings around every issue we have.

 

I've never been overly impressed with his post-match comments, but as you say he talks a good game. He's likeable, and again as you say if it had been a Penney-esque character he'd be gone.

 

I wasn't there today but I was at Brentford and when I see people describe certain performance I can imagine it to a tee.

 

Here's another corker: "I just ask them to give a six or a seven". What does that promote? I can't believe he even said that.

[oafc1955]

It wouldn't be so bad if we were making slow progress but since Dickov came in I think we have actually gone backwards. We have a decent keeper in Cisak, Lee at RB who was already here, Furman also already here, Wesolowski who could be decent when fit, and Simpson if he stays would be OK........I think Kuqi was a flash in the pan and next season he will be a year older.

 

In my opinion Dickov has brought in a total of 3 players who have actually improved the squad.....Would you be really that upset to lose any of the others during the close season?

 

While he will have another decreased budget to contend with so will plenty of others in this division, our first eleven on paper look decent, maybe as individuals they are, but collectively as a team they are bloody woeful, and more importantly bloody awful to watch!!

 

I really want Dickov to succeed but next season he has to improve on two disaterous campaigns where apart from the promise shown early in his tenure we have since lacked any creativity from midfield and been bloody awful in both penalty areas!

 

If we are as poor up to Christmas next season fans will not be as forgiving!!

[JoeP]

Can't disagree. Both posts essentially put rings around every issue we have.

 

I've never been overly impressed with his post-match comments, but as you say he talks a good game. He's likeable, and again as you say if it had been a Penney-esque character he'd be gone.

 

I wasn't there today but I was at Brentford and when I see people describe certain performance I can imagine it to a tee.

 

Here's another corker: "I just ask them to give a six or a seven". What does that promote? I can't believe he even said that.

 

I think his point was that he asks that as a minimum for the periods when their performances drops during 90 minutes (if they performed at a 10 for the entire 90 minutes, they'd be at a better club than Latics...). A 6 or 7 level performance for the entire 90 minutes would have meant the Charlton goal would have been stopped, basically.

 

I agree with everything he said in the interview - we made a lot of poor decisions with the final ball yesterday, even more than usual and it's something he needs to sort. A few players deserved a rollicking after yesterday.

[UpTheLatics]

I think his point was that he asks that as a minimum for the periods when their performances drops during 90 minutes (if they performed at a 10 for the entire 90 minutes, they'd be at a better club than Latics...). A 6 or 7 level performance for the entire 90 minutes would have meant the Charlton goal would have been stopped, basically.

 

I agree with everything he said in the interview - we made a lot of poor decisions with the final ball yesterday, even more than usual and it's something he needs to sort. A few players deserved a rollicking after yesterday.

 

I understood the point he was trying to make, but in what walk of life do you expect the bare minimum? Or just enough to get you over the finishing line. When you're in the sort of form we are you can't say that. Every player we have can raise their game by at least 30%.

 

I don't think he pushes them enough and it's telling. I can see on his face he wants to win and it's paining him, but he has to demand so much more from the players. Christ, if I ever saw Fergie say such a thing then you'd think he'd finally lost the plot. And before anyone says we're not Man Utd, I know that, but it doesn't stop demanding everything a player has in every match.

 

He said we don't ask them to run past five or six players and fire the ball into the top corner, but that's not our problem and that's not what the fans are wanting. We need to work harder in midfield, we need to concentrate and mark whichever has been designated, and we need to work at getting bodies forward - three basic things in football. He mentioned the basics, but he's overseen this sort of shoddy performances for a year and a half now and he's softly, softly attitude isn't getting him anywhere.

 

Actually it is. Closer and closer to the sack.

[bigfatjoe1]

Agree, but what surprised me was how average Charlton were, even given the dismissals. Just shows what a Piss poor league this is, which really makes our demise even worse

[JohnnyPimp]

Charlton weren't particularly impressive, even taking into account the sendings off.

 

However, you couldn't fault their workrate, constantly pressing when we were in possession. If we'd have put as much effort in we'd have got something out of the game.

[opinions4u]

Charlton weren't particularly impressive, even taking into account the sendings off.

 

However, you couldn't fault their workrate, constantly pressing when we were in possession. If we'd have put as much effort in we'd have got something out of the game.

Like we did during Dickov's first few months in charge.

 

Winning mentality in improving players.

[KYLEOAFC]

Like we did during Dickov's first few months in charge.

 

Winning mentality in improving players.

 

I think it’s got past the stage where the management need to look at themselves long and hard at their methodology.

Two things we will all agree that we can’t do as a team, Defend particularly well from crosses or set pieces and score goals in the box!

Who do we bring in to coach the players the knowledge needed, I know two players who spent the majority of their careers playing in those positions in the top flight to coach the lads….Wait a minute haven’t we got that in Taggart and Dickov??

Start on the training ground boys and stop relying on two or three of the better players to scrape through its not working!!

Say what you will Kuqi is past it and won’t be the 20 plus a year we need take off penalties and hes average.

[oldhamandy1]

What do you expect him to say? How he plans to turn it round? For goodness sake, we should sack because his hair looks naff.

[jsslatic]

Should he come out and bollock them in public and say how we're in danger? Everyone knows we are, no need to go about giving the media headlines.

 

He's not blind or stupid. He knows full well what the situation is and I'm sure the players know it too. If they don't, I'm sure he's letting them know it. Just because he doesn't publicly express the doom and gloom spewed by most on here doesn't mean he's got his head in the clouds.

 

Situation still remains that if we get one win (especially at Wycombe), we'll be safe. Once we are safe, people will start planning for next season. We have three winnable games left (four if Carlisle have sewn up a playoff place come final day). Given how :censored: the rest of the league is then a couple of scrappy 1-0ers could get us up a fair few places and then people will be talking about progress.

 

Should PD be as fickle as most on OWTB? No, he's got his head screwed on.

 

Bonkers.

Edited April 8, 2012 by jsslatic

[IceStationLatic]

Should he come out and bollock them in public and say how we're in danger? Everyone knows we are, no need to go about giving the media headlines.

 

He's not blind or stupid. He knows full well what the situation is and I'm sure the players know it too. If they don't, I'm sure he's letting them know it. Just because he doesn't publicly express the doom and gloom spewed by most on here doesn't mean he's got his head in the clouds.

 

Situation still remains that if we get one win (especially at Wycombe), we'll be safe. Once we are safe, people will start planning for next season. We have three winnable games left (four if Carlisle have sewn up a playoff place come final day). Given how :censored: the rest of the league is then a couple of scrappy 1-0ers could get us up a fair few places and then people will be talking about progress.

 

Should PD be as fickle as most on OWTB? No, he's got his head screwed on.

 

Bonkers.

 

Spot on.

 

I think nearly everything PD has set in post-match stuff has been bang on. Yet, as a result, some slag him off as if that's a bad thing - he 'talks the talk... but....'. Yes results are the be all and end all, but when the players do as he say (ie their jobs for 90min) it's been shown it works (Hartlepool away being a prime example).

 

And do you really expect him not to slag off the officials - sorry, make excuses - when we are constantly on the receiving end of naff decisions and getting nothing our way (and yesterday doesn't count because despite our man advantage at times the referee completely ruined the game). That doesn't mean he's ignoring other problems!

 

And what sort of message would he send out as a manager if he picks players that aren't behaving. It would breed indiscipline. The players in the squad who are working hard and adhering to rules would think, 'why do I bother'.

 

And would it really be worth it? Should a manager pick KMB just out of blind hope (he must have pants in training too) that he might spark something on a matchday? Apart from his bright spell off the bench at Sheff U, has KMB really shown he'd be this saving grace that some fans believe he would be - or is this just an excuse to slag off PD. He missed a lot of chances in games before he stupidly got himself a needless five-match ban. Then, instead of fighting for his place back in the team and making the effort for a club that paid his wages while he couldn't play because of his own stupidity, he has done the opposite. Wouldn't you feel a bit betrayed given that you're the club that's 'given him a second chance'. Hopefully leaving him out for a bit might buck his ideas up. I fear it's done he opposite and, typical of many modern-day footballers, he'll just sulk and wait for another club to come along. I hope I'm not right though - no-one knows the full story yet. But my point is that you have to presume the manager does - he knows more than us!

 

 

 

 

 

[LaticsPete]

Spot on.

 

I think nearly everything PD has set in post-match stuff has been bang on. Yet, as a result, some slag him off as if that's a bad thing - he 'talks the talk... but....'. Yes results are the be all and end all, but when the players do as he say (ie their jobs for 90min) it's been shown it works (Hartlepool away being a prime example).

 

And do you really expect him not to slag off the officials - sorry, make excuses - when we are constantly on the receiving end of naff decisions and getting nothing our way (and yesterday doesn't count because despite our man advantage at times the referee completely ruined the game). That doesn't mean he's ignoring other problems!

 

And what sort of message would he send out as a manager if he picks players that aren't behaving. It would breed indiscipline. The players in the squad who are working hard and adhering to rules would think, 'why do I bother'.

 

And would it really be worth it? Should a manager pick KMB just out of blind hope (he must have pants in training too) that he might spark something on a matchday? Apart from his bright spell off the bench at Sheff U, has KMB really shown he'd be this saving grace that some fans believe he would be - or is this just an excuse to slag off PD. He missed a lot of chances in games before he stupidly got himself a needless five-match ban. Then, instead of fighting for his place back in the team and making the effort for a club that paid his wages while he couldn't play because of his own stupidity, he has done the opposite. Wouldn't you feel a bit betrayed given that you're the club that's 'given him a second chance'. Hopefully leaving him out for a bit might buck his ideas up. I fear it's done he opposite and, typical of many modern-day footballers, he'll just sulk and wait for another club to come along. I hope I'm not right though - no-one knows the full story yet. But my point is that you have to presume the manager does - he knows more than us!

 

 

Thank you for this reasoned and ariculate posting. dead right.

Edited April 8, 2012 by LaticsPete

[Stevie_J]

I think it’s got past the stage where the management need to look at themselves long and hard at their methodology.

Two things we will all agree that we can’t do as a team, Defend particularly well from crosses or set pieces and score goals in the box!

Who do we bring in to coach the players the knowledge needed, I know two players who spent the majority of their careers playing in those positions in the top flight to coach the lads….Wait a minute haven’t we got that in Taggart and Dickov??

Start on the training ground boys and stop relying on two or three of the better players to scrape through its not working!!

Say what you will Kuqi is past it and won’t be the 20 plus a year we need take off penalties and hes average.

Show me another player in our squad who's got anywhere near Kuqi in terms of goals per game ratio, even in spite of his long barren spell. You can even discount his penalties if you like.

[KYLEOAFC]

Show me another player in our squad who's got anywhere near Kuqi in terms of goals per game ratio, even in spite of his long barren spell. You can even discount his penalties if you like.

 

I will give Kuqi his pens.

 

This is just Goal to appearence % in the league:

 

R Reid 29.41%

S Kuqi 31.42%

 

Remember that includes his penalties!

 

Kuqi has had 31 shots on target in the league this season and has played 35 times!

 

He's not ever in the box long enough to be effective because he has to come deep to get the ball.

[oldhamandy1]

I will give Kuqi his pens.

 

This is just Goal to appearence % in the league:

 

R Reid 29.41%

S Kuqi 31.42%

 

Remember that includes his penalties!

 

Kuqi has had 31 shots on target in the league this season and has played 35 times!

 

He's not ever in the box long enough to be effective because he has to come deep to get the ball.

I'm sure we all thank you for including his pens, they do count them in the goalscorer charts. So why wouldn't you?

 

Point remains Kuqi has been our best striker this season, but of course some will complain and moan about him. If PD dropped from now until the end of the season fans would be asking why he has been singled out.

Edited April 8, 2012 by oldhamandy1

[Schlieb]

Plus.... Imagine he'd taken reids penalties away haha

[Stevie_J]

Plus.... Imagine he'd taken reids penalties away haha

Plus, if you take all competitions, it's:

 

Kuqi: 35%

Reid: 27%

 

As for penalties, 67% of Reid's goals are pens, compared with 25% of Kuqi's.

[UpTheLatics]

Should he come out and bollock them in public and say how we're in danger? Everyone knows we are, no need to go about giving the media headlines.

 

He's not blind or stupid. He knows full well what the situation is and I'm sure the players know it too. If they don't, I'm sure he's letting them know it. Just because he doesn't publicly express the doom and gloom spewed by most on here doesn't mean he's got his head in the clouds.

 

Situation still remains that if we get one win (especially at Wycombe), we'll be safe. Once we are safe, people will start planning for next season. We have three winnable games left (four if Carlisle have sewn up a playoff place come final day). Given how :censored: the rest of the league is then a couple of scrappy 1-0ers could get us up a fair few places and then people will be talking about progress.

 

Should PD be as fickle as most on OWTB? No, he's got his head screwed on.

 

Bonkers.

 

At what point do you finally climb down and begin to grow tired of what is currently being served up? Do you want managers asking for "sixes and sevens"? There are many ways of managing, and on the whole I agree with Dickov's style. That is until it grows quite evident - which it has, several months ago in fact - that the players are failing to respond.

 

Or am I "bonkers" and it is working? Do you happy clap every time Dickov says we're going to finish in the top half and not take a moment out to realise we're so far away from that target in terms of results and performances? I know he knows the situation, but where is the fight from both the players and manager?

 

Of course telling Gordon that we're in danger and in terrible form (or "dodgy" as Dickov calls it) is pointless. But calling the run "dodgy" is head in the clouds stuff, and letting slip that he asks no more than sheer averageness is not what I want to hear. If you're happy with that I'd suggest taking the word "bonkers" and apply it to yourself.

 

I'm pro-Dickov, not that that needs justifying to two or three cheery folk without a criticism to hand, and I appreciate the difficulties Dickov if forced to work with, despite around a dozen or more sides in this league working under the same pressures. But when I see a blatant lack of progress after each defeat and after each promise of marked improvement, do you expect fans to be patient following several inept, defeat-infested months?

[JoeP]

At what point do you finally climb down and begin to grow tired of what is currently being served up? Do you want managers asking for "sixes and sevens"? There are many ways of managing, and on the whole I agree with Dickov's style. That is until it grows quite evident - which it has, several months ago in fact - that the players are failing to respond.

 

Or am I "bonkers" and it is working? Do you happy clap every time Dickov says we're going to finish in the top half and not take a moment out to realise we're so far away from that target in terms of results and performances? I know he knows the situation, but where is the fight from both the players and manager?

 

Of course telling Gordon that we're in danger and in terrible form (or "dodgy" as Dickov calls it) is pointless. But calling the run "dodgy" is head in the clouds stuff, and letting slip that he asks no more than sheer averageness is not what I want to hear. If you're happy with that I'd suggest taking the word "bonkers" and apply it to yourself.

 

I'm pro-Dickov, not that that needs justifying to two or three cheery folk without a criticism to hand, and I appreciate the difficulties Dickov if forced to work with, despite around a dozen or more sides in this league working under the same pressures. But when I see a blatant lack of progress after each defeat and after each promise of marked improvement, do you expect fans to be patient following several inept, defeat-infested months?

 

I think you're over-analysing this a bit too much.

 

Last season, when we were flying at the start, and there was a lot of hype around us and I remember listening to a report saying that Dickov hated the media handling side of his job. It wouldn't surprise me if he still felt this way (this doesn't make him a bad manager, by the way...), so I wouldn't take every 3 minute Latics-player interview as a true reflection of what's being said behind close doors.

 

Dickov isn't exempt from criticism - I've offered a bit after particularly bad performances. But the bigger picture is he has no funds, a ridiculous injury list and is only in his second full season of management. The guy's on a bit of a hiding to nothing.

Edited April 8, 2012 by JoeP

[UpTheLatics]

I think you're over-analysing this a bit too much.

 

Last season, when we were flying at the start, and there was a lot of hype around us and I remember listening to a report saying that Dickov hated the media handling side of his job. It wouldn't surprise me if he still felt this way (this doesn't make him a bad manager, by the way...), so I wouldn't take every 3 minute Latics-player interview as a true reflection of what's being said behind close doors.

 

Dickov isn't exempt from criticism - I've offered a bit after particularly bad performances. But the bigger picture is he has no funds, a ridiculous injury list and is only in his second full season of management. The guy's on a bit of a hiding to nothing.

 

I'd agree you can't take what is said too literally, but when you see very little emotion on the sidelines, save his continuous hounding of the fourth official and/or referee, his comments in front of the camera are all we have.

 

Nor do I buy into this injury crisis. Of course we've had a terrible run, but our attack-minded players haven't been affected too severely yet game after game we don't look capable of scoring a goal. When Dickov talks about finishing well up the league and he fails to deliver he sets himself up for a painful fall. He'll learn a lot from this season, there's no doubt about that, but he's been damaged and has a lot to prove.

[RobOAFC]

I think you're over-analysing this a bit too much.

 

Last season, when we were flying at the start, and there was a lot of hype around us and I remember listening to a report saying that Dickov hated the media handling side of his job. It wouldn't surprise me if he still felt this way (this doesn't make him a bad manager, by the way...), so I wouldn't take every 3 minute Latics-player interview as a true reflection of what's being said behind close doors.

 

Dickov isn't exempt from criticism - I've offered a bit after particularly bad performances. But the bigger picture is he has no funds, a ridiculous injury list and is only in his second full season of management. The guy's on a bit of a hiding to nothing.

If Corney was telling the truth when he said that there is around 12 teams (I think he said it was around 12, but if he didn't please correct me) with a lower budget than us, than Dickov has had the funds to get us to be around the low top half. Obviously that can still happen, but it doesn't look like it at the moment, we look like we're going to be in a relegation scrap if Sheff Wed beat us on Monday and Wycombe beat Chesterfield.

[jsslatic]

I'd agree you can't take what is said too literally, but when you see very little emotion on the sidelines, save his continuous hounding of the fourth official and/or referee, his comments in front of the camera are all we have.

 

Nor do I buy into this injury crisis. Of course we've had a terrible run, but our attack-minded players haven't been affected too severely yet game after game we don't look capable of scoring a goal. When Dickov talks about finishing well up the league and he fails to deliver he sets himself up for a painful fall. He'll learn a lot from this season, there's no doubt about that, but he's been damaged and has a lot to prove.

 

What Joe has said above echoes what would be my response to your initial points.

 

In relation to the bold bit, the 'injury crisis' is effectively the injuries to Wes and Furman. With the assets at PD's disposal, to KO those two for the second half of the season has been a right slap in the face. For starters, in tandem they operated superbly with both being able to get the ball and bring it forward. The result of their injuries has been that not only have we been overrun in midfield but that when we have had the ball in CM, the quality isn't there to bring it forward. Shef comes back to get the ball and suddenly there's no one there.

 

If Deano and Wes had been fit all season we'd be OK. In fact, given that Tranmere are bloody 11th and the fine margins between upper-midtable and the rest of the league we'd be at least around there.