jimsleftfoot Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I asked about migrants, you responded with refugee. All refugees are migrants, but not all migrants are refugees. or expats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I asked about migrants, you responded with refugee. All refugees are migrants, but not all migrants are refugees. I still think we should kick you out to make room for more refugees, migrants and Uncle Tom Cobleigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I asked about migrants, you responded with refugee. All refugees are migrants, but not all migrants are refugees. Migrants who've had to grab what they could or refugees who couldn't/didn't - they've all had to :censored: off sharpish for various reasons. Some have subsequently been able to "migrate" some have had to just seek refuge. Does the distinction really matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beag_teeets Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I finally voted today, abstained in the leadership as they are all :censored:e and voted for Stella Creasy 1st preference and Angela Eagle 2nd preference for deputy. I've voted in every election, ballot or beauty contest I've been eligible to vote in for the last 23 years but I can not bring myself to vote for any of the candidates in the leadership election. The trot, the tory, the wet and the wife. Gun to head I would have voted for Cooper but that is continuity Labour and we've seen what happens when that goes to the polls. Besides, there is more chance of Latics getting promoted than any of that shower being PM in 2020. As for the deputy, Creasy at least has an idea what the world that the rest of us are living in is like. Seems to be a decent MP, I know a very people in Walthamstow and they are happy with her, she likes good music and isn't a raving mentalist. She's probably a bit too right wing for me but hey ho. As for Angela Eagle, out of all of the mountains of spam, text and direct mail I have had hers was refreshing change, just a simple "Please vote for me?" Was a bit pathetic but I appreciated her pleading honesty. I'm probably quite close to her politically so that helps. But it looks like we have the dream team of Corbyn and Watson to march us down the hill to a worse defeat than our last worst defeat. Yay! Still, it brings about the inevitable split a bit sooner than hoped but for all those who are being royally shafted by the Tories, things aren't going to get any better soon. :censored:ing bollocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I finally voted today, abstained in the leadership as they are all :censored:e and voted for Stella Creasy 1st preference and Angela Eagle 2nd preference for deputy. I've voted in every election, ballot or beauty contest I've been eligible to vote in for the last 23 years but I can not bring myself to vote for any of the candidates in the leadership election. The trot, the tory, the wet and the wife. Gun to head I would have voted for Cooper but that is continuity Labour and we've seen what happens when that goes to the polls. Besides, there is more chance of Latics getting promoted than any of that shower being PM in 2020. As for the deputy, Creasy at least has an idea what the world that the rest of us are living in is like. Seems to be a decent MP, I know a very people in Walthamstow and they are happy with her, she likes good music and isn't a raving mentalist. She's probably a bit too right wing for me but hey ho. As for Angela Eagle, out of all of the mountains of spam, text and direct mail I have had hers was refreshing change, just a simple "Please vote for me?" Was a bit pathetic but I appreciated her pleading honesty. I'm probably quite close to her politically so that helps. But it looks like we have the dream team of Corbyn and Watson to march us down the hill to a worse defeat than our last worst defeat. Yay! Still, it brings about the inevitable split a bit sooner than hoped but for all those who are being royally shafted by the Tories, things aren't going to get any better soon. :censored:ing bollocks. Beautifully put. I've voted for Corbyn not because he's great but because the other three...really really piss me off. Umuna would've been my first choice. Not a massive fan of Creasy but voted for her because the others have a history of really really pissing me off. Not a great time. Still, the Tories have all this to come in a couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 9, 2015 Author Share Posted September 9, 2015 All refugees are migrants Refugees are welcome then. Although I agree that we should block the Westbound M62 around Outlane.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Umuna would've been my first choice. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 :lol: This Saturday's Meltdown will be right up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted September 12, 2015 Share Posted September 12, 2015 LEGEND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueatheart Posted September 12, 2015 Share Posted September 12, 2015 Beat me to it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 12, 2015 Share Posted September 12, 2015 (edited) As if I could be more delighted! Bet people are regretting getting Liz Kendall tattoos now. Edited September 12, 2015 by 24hoursfromtulsehill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disjointed Posted September 12, 2015 Share Posted September 12, 2015 As if I could be more delighted! Bet people are regretting getting Liz Kendall tattoos now. With a little bit of tinkering it becomes Felicity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OAFCM35 Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3233120/Shambles-shadow-cabinet-Corbyn-calls-Blair-s-old-chum-big-names-refuse-serve-him.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
help_shiny Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 from the outside looking in it looks to me that the Labour Party has committed suicide. I realise that many long standing rank and file members wanted the party to come back to them but surely nearly everyone who signed up as a £3 member did so to vote for Corbyn? A major party changed it's voting rules only to find itself hijacked by the Socialist Workers Party, Morning Star readers and that bloke who stands outside the supermarket with a can of cider and a dog on a string. And as a result of only interacting with people who think exactly the same way they are now sure that it's some kind of brave new dawn & the Tories are on the run when the fact is they're looking down the barrel of a General Election beasting that will nigh on break the party. I bet Cameron was dancing around number 10 in his finest top hat. Labour's only hope is the EU thing tears the Tories apart. It's going to be really interesting if the two big parties go in for some serious infighting at the same time. Seriously - if you're happy with Corbyn do you really think you have even the faintest chance of success? The media are going to destroy him and the thing is they dont even have to make stuff up, it writes itself. It's not an evil right wing smear campaign - he really has said all that stuff, he really does believe all that stuff and as for that McDonnell bloke - hoot! Oh, and Diane Abbot - ffs Great soap opera ahead, hand out the popcorn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 14, 2015 Share Posted September 14, 2015 from the outside looking in it looks to me that the Labour Party has committed suicide. I realise that many long standing rank and file members wanted the party to come back to them but surely nearly everyone who signed up as a £3 member did so to vote for Corbyn? A major party changed it's voting rules only to find itself hijacked by the Socialist Workers Party, Morning Star readers and that bloke who stands outside the supermarket with a can of cider and a dog on a string. And as a result of only interacting with people who think exactly the same way they are now sure that it's some kind of brave new dawn & the Tories are on the run when the fact is they're looking down the barrel of a General Election beasting that will nigh on break the party. I bet Cameron was dancing around number 10 in his finest top hat. Labour's only hope is the EU thing tears the Tories apart. It's going to be really interesting if the two big parties go in for some serious infighting at the same time. Seriously - if you're happy with Corbyn do you really think you have even the faintest chance of success? The media are going to destroy him and the thing is they dont even have to make stuff up, it writes itself. It's not an evil right wing smear campaign - he really has said all that stuff, he really does believe all that stuff and as for that McDonnell bloke - hoot! Oh, and Diane Abbot - ffs Great soap opera ahead, hand out the popcorn That's not what the voting shows. Corbyn got very slightly less than 50% of the vote among members, which is by far the largest voting group. Cleaned up the affiliates and registered clicktivists mind you. I'm still not sure. Had to pop into the chamber this afternoon to make sure it wasn't a hoax. He's got a new suit. I realise this is a terrible example, but no one could take any of the Lib Dems seriously before they became ministers and secretaries of state. Just sitting there gives you a weird type of authority, or at least an actuality. He's got one chance and one chance only: he has to stick to his guns while people like you get used to the idea. If Corbyn can go over the heads of most of the parliamentary party and all of the press, and if he can generate some actual popular appeal, you never know. Exactly what do you disagree with Corbyn about? For me, he's a bit of a sellout because there's no pledge currently to establish re-education camps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 14, 2015 Author Share Posted September 14, 2015 As if I could be more delighted! Bet people are regretting getting Liz Kendall tattoos now. ...and within minutes of the announcement Gideon and CCHQ changed their brainwashing mantra - 'Security' is the new 'Long Term Economic Plan.'.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
help_shiny Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Exactly what do you disagree with Corbyn about? For me, he's a bit of a sellout because there's no pledge currently to establish re-education camps. that made me laugh. I'm all for re-education camps myself of course, just with a different curriculum than yours I disagree with an awful lot of what goes on in Corbyn's head - I voted UKIP in the past two General Elections and gave up on Labour a long time ago, I'm not really the target audience. I do laud his EU scepticism, it's about time opposition to the EU isnt seen as a left/right thing and you can voice that without some bugged eyed left wing loon shouting at you that you're somehow racist, but I suspect like all others who get a sniff of power he'll backtrack on that, look at how your comrades in Greece blithely ignored the will of the electorate once things got real. I reckon he'll go through the motions of posing difficult questions to Cameron on the issue but when the day for the referendum comes he wont be advising his acolytes to make the break. I really dont think Corbyn can appeal to enough people to ever win power - he's got his left wing supporters and then he'll have the votes of everyone who always votes Labour no matter what, they'd vote for a pig in a red rosette. But everyone else? It's just not going to happen. Also he's in the rather delicate position of an overwhelming majority of the parliamentary party being absolutely horrified by his leadership, they cant move on him yet but they will when the chance comes. I can forsee a future where the likes of Corbyn will make great headway but the time isn't now, you'll just have to wait until the demographics of the country match those of London. 35 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueatheart Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 ...and within minutes of the announcement Gideon and CCHQ changed their brainwashing mantra - 'Security' is the new 'Long Term Economic Plan.'.... Sounds reasonable when a friend of Sinn Fein, Hezbollah and Hamas is going to be present. Photoshop might be pretty damn good these days, but those photos cannot be untook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 That's not what the voting shows. Corbyn got very slightly less than 50% of the vote among members, which is by far the largest voting group. Cleaned up the affiliates and registered clicktivists mind you. I'm still not sure. Had to pop into the chamber this afternoon to make sure it wasn't a hoax. He's got a new suit. I realise this is a terrible example, but no one could take any of the Lib Dems seriously before they became ministers and secretaries of state. Just sitting there gives you a weird type of authority, or at least an actuality. He's got one chance and one chance only: he has to stick to his guns while people like you get used to the idea. If Corbyn can go over the heads of most of the parliamentary party and all of the press, and if he can generate some actual popular appeal, you never know. Exactly what do you disagree with Corbyn about? For me, he's a bit of a sellout because there's no pledge currently to establish re-education camps. Yes, without the £3 vote he got 51/52% (so not as good as Tony Blair after all), so he would have won anyway in the first round, though it could have turned out slightly different perhaps if it had been closer. Also, despite his wave of so called popular support, only 105,000 people voted (of which he got 84%) which is hardly going to swing an election. I like his charisma, I like some of his principles, but there are a lot of middle class people who will be afraid of him ultimately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueatheart Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Yes, without the £3 vote he got 51/52% (so not as good as Tony Blair after all), so he would have won anyway in the first round, though it could have turned out slightly different perhaps if it had been closer. Also, despite his wave of so called popular support, only 105,000 people voted (of which he got 84%) which is hardly going to swing an election. I like his charisma, I like some of his principles, but there are a lot of middle class people who will be afraid of him ultimately. 423,000 total votes out of an eligible electorate of 46.3 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 that made me laugh. I'm all for re-education camps myself of course, just with a different curriculum than yours I disagree with an awful lot of what goes on in Corbyn's head - I voted UKIP in the past two General Elections and gave up on Labour a long time ago, I'm not really the target audience. I do laud his EU scepticism, it's about time opposition to the EU isnt seen as a left/right thing and you can voice that without some bugged eyed left wing loon shouting at you that you're somehow racist, but I suspect like all others who get a sniff of power he'll backtrack on that, look at how your comrades in Greece blithely ignored the will of the electorate once things got real. I reckon he'll go through the motions of posing difficult questions to Cameron on the issue but when the day for the referendum comes he wont be advising his acolytes to make the break. I really dont think Corbyn can appeal to enough people to ever win power - he's got his left wing supporters and then he'll have the votes of everyone who always votes Labour no matter what, they'd vote for a pig in a red rosette. But everyone else? It's just not going to happen. Also he's in the rather delicate position of an overwhelming majority of the parliamentary party being absolutely horrified by his leadership, they cant move on him yet but they will when the chance comes. I can forsee a future where the likes of Corbyn will make great headway but the time isn't now, you'll just have to wait until the demographics of the country match those of London. 35 years? We'll see. Today he's proposing to introduce rent controls to bring the housing benefit bill under control. The right-wing Institute of Economic Affairs advocates more or less the same thing. It's a no-brainer really, except it might be tricky to get through Parliament because loads of MPs (possibly a majority) are also landlords. Sounds reasonable when a friend of Sinn Fein, Hezbollah and Hamas is going to be present. Photoshop might be pretty damn good these days, but those photos cannot be untook. You assume everyone's totally against those organisations. I'm not pro the destruction of Israel, but I can easily see why someone might be. It's not as if Her Majesty's Government aren't talking to Hezbollah and Hamas, not to mention handing out nice bits of kit so some really unpleasant regimes can bring the populace to order. I'm also for a united Ireland and pro Sinn Fein. What of it? Have we given up talking to people about stuff? Yes, without the £3 vote he got 51/52% (so not as good as Tony Blair after all), so he would have won anyway in the first round, though it could have turned out slightly different perhaps if it had been closer. Also, despite his wave of so called popular support, only 105,000 people voted (of which he got 84%) which is hardly going to swing an election. I like his charisma, I like some of his principles, but there are a lot of middle class people who will be afraid of him ultimately. 105,000 people is still a lot comparatively. They could all have voted for someone else. Like I said, he's got one chance and one chance only. No one else (Tory or Labour) has offered something this crazy since Thatcher. If you agree with it, you should back it. It might just work. As for the ludicrous pedants and philistines middle classes out there in the home counties...if they engage their brains (a long shot) they might actually go for it. One fact about the general election is that very few voters swung. Middle England decided to stay put. Labour has to do something extra to persuade people to vote Labour when Tories are the incumbents. Lots of people criticised and declined to vote Labour because it didn't stand up for working people, civil liberties, peace, workers' rights and so on. The shorthand for that is Labour lost its soul and therefore became meaningless. Things have changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 We'll see. Today he's proposing to introduce rent controls to bring the housing benefit bill under control. The right-wing Institute of Economic Affairs advocates more or less the same thing. It's a no-brainer really, except it might be tricky to get through Parliament because loads of MPs (possibly a majority) are also landlords. I really doubt the IEA advocated rent controls. Scrapping Mr Attlee's Town and Country Planning Act (which Gordy praised in his anti-Corbyn speech) would be a better idea. Rent controls are good for people with an existing long term tenancy and bad for anyone signing one in the future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I really doubt the IEA advocated rent controls. Scrapping Mr Attlee's Town and Country Planning Act (which Gordy praised in his anti-Corbyn speech) would be a better idea. Rent controls are good for people with an existing long term tenancy and bad for anyone signing one in the future It's true the IEA has a supply side solution: build more stuff in more places. I agree. I think they should scrap the green belt around Basingstoke, Northampton, Corby, Braintree, Daventry etc. Chances of that happening under the Tories about a million to one. The IEA do say that anywhere where the tenant is on housing benefit should be subject to rent control. I agree with that too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 15, 2015 Author Share Posted September 15, 2015 Sounds reasonable when a friend of Sinn Fein, Hezbollah and Hamas is going to be present. Photoshop might be pretty damn good these days, but those photos cannot be untook. I don't know how politicians get factions around the negotiating table without talking to them, I'm sure Maggie was doing the right thing with Suharto, Pinochet, Saddam Hussein and the Khmer Rouge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 It's true the IEA has a supply side solution: build more stuff in more places. I agree. I think they should scrap the green belt around Basingstoke, Northampton, Corby, Braintree, Daventry etc. Chances of that happening under the Tories about a million to one. The IEA do say that anywhere where the tenant is on housing benefit should be subject to rent control. I agree with that too. I missed that one, but would be interested to read it if you can find a link? There could be two sides - stopping paying over the market rate for a place - ie the tenant and the landlord split the difference. Nothing new there and not controversial. The other side would be a limit on the type of places you can get full benefits for. This seems more contraversial. Just capping the price paid on certain houses will result in them being left to rot until the tenant leaves then they'll be let out again at far more, possibly after a refurbished making them less affordable to low income people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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