Keepingthe Faith Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 My view like it or lump it... Cisak...one mistake..it happens...I wish we had Kirkland tonight Byrne ok..old sod..steady.. Mvoto..ok Tarkowski...kid learning his trade.....good and bad..cannot blame him.. Mchangawamba ?..out of position.. Weslowski...best player..all effort..70s porn star moustache.. Slew.......ok but lost the plot..no service... Furman....ok The real villains.... Simpson.........Bertie big bollocks..senior player...went mising..Chris Taylor with a shorter haircut Croft...................FAT FAT FAT waste of space....ONE cross Thats 10 players................. Now who is totally missing ? Cannot have done much ...............Lost the plot after 30 mins...thought the job was done.................Something needs to change big time NOT GOOD ENOUGH That would be Grounds one of the better performers!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanakapan Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I wish we had O Grady in or forward line instead of Slew..........what a dropped bollock that was letting him go...........he actually looks like a striker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepingthe Faith Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I think too many supporters are saying "learn from it". For me, those mistakes are ones that have hindered us for a long time. We lost tonight because our lads failed to respond to Wednesday's own response. Was there any doubt Dave Jones was not gonna rocket his players? There was not enough quality in Wednesday play to have thrown away a 2-0 lead. It was a capitulation in midfield and that ultimately highlighted our defensive frailties. Start as we mean to go on. Enough excuses, enough "ah well, they're a better side"s. They weren't better than us. I said this last season and I'll say it again: stop feeling sorry for ourselves, toughen up, and learn. Pleasing in some respects, of course. But to concede four goals with such ease, displaying brittleness as we did, was a major disappointment. ????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 (edited) Just watching the game back. It's 2-2 at the moment. I can't fault Tarky for either of them. Although credit to Tarky and Cisak for parting like the red sea to give O'Grady the third. Edited August 13, 2012 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latics_Fanatic Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 My view like it or lump it... Cisak...one mistake..it happens...I wish we had Kirkland tonight Byrne ok..old sod..steady.. Mvoto..ok Tarkowski...kid learning his trade.....good and bad..cannot blame him.. Mchangawamba ?..out of position.. Weslowski...best player..all effort..70s porn star moustache.. Slew.......ok but lost the plot..no service... Furman....ok The real villains.... Simpson.........Bertie big bollocks..senior player...went mising..Chris Taylor with a shorter haircut Croft...................FAT FAT FAT waste of space....ONE cross Thats 10 players................. Now who is totally missing ? Cannot have done much ...............Lost the plot after 30 mins...thought the job was done.................Something needs to change big time NOT GOOD ENOUGH Wow, you're an optimistic bastard aren't you. Croft was our best player - you must have been watching a totally different game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz_Oafc Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Fat? Croft looked like he could play at a higher level! Always looking to create and fantastic work rate for the full 90! One silly challange granted Your avin a laugh pal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobOAFC Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Why the fook can't we defend a lead? Better team or not, throwing away a 2-0 lead is unacceptable. Happens time and time again - Exeter, Carlisle etc.. Get a left mid in please Paul, M'changama ain't no left winger and we have no attacking threat down the wing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Sinnott Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 In fairness to Fanakapan : Lee Croft is at least a stone overweight. If he got himself fitter, he would easily catch a decent Championship side! That said, he was our best player from what I saw! I only saw the 1st half as I had a game myself at 9 so, as far as I'm concerned, there is no way we won't have the League wrapped up by Easter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeP Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Just watching the game back. It's 2-2 at the moment. I can't fault Tarky for either of them. Although credit to Tarky and Cisak for parting like the red sea to give O'Grady the third. The second one was the free header, wasn't it? Thought it was poor defending all round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrown23 Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I wouldn't say anyones blaming tarky (although i have skim read so someone might have), just pointing out the obvious which is right now he's young, naive and very average. I'm not blaming him but he cost us goals/points last season and the same faults are still there, loses concentration, loses positioning, not very strong, pretty slow...... whats worrying me is everyone seems to be saying "he'll learn, he'll get better," surely we should be HOPING he does. i hope he does but I am getting a little worried that we've had 7 weeks of preseason, lots of training (albeit a lot of fitness work no doubt (actually he didnt look fit tonight either so thats worrying) was done) and to me he hasn't really improved from what i saw the end of last season. again, HOPEFULLY its a slow start but im not expecting him to definitely come good for us, time will tell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 The second one was the free header, wasn't it? Thought it was poor defending all round. Two of our players there failing to challenge. Neither of them Tarky. Tarky was :censored:e on the fourth though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latics_Fanatic Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 (edited) Two of our players there failing to challenge. Neither of them Tarky. Tarky was :censored:e on the fourth though. Not to make excuses, but the defense was stretched at that point. Antonio should never have been allowed to turn inside and shoot though. Poor second half, rounded off by a good goal. Edited August 13, 2012 by Latics_Fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 (edited) I think we started so quickly that the midfield burned out by the mid point of the second half - they didn't close down as well as first half and then Wednesday were able to play their way back in (helped by a shocking error from Cisak). Comments elsewhere about Tarkowsky are fair - he isn't strong enough yet, he's not quick and makes mistakes which cost, but he may be one for the future. Croft ran out of steam and couldn't cover - giving their winger too many one on ones, but he was a real threat going forward and his delivery was excellent.. I'll be pleasantly surprised if we manage to get a decent left midfield player and experienced centre back some time soon - I think we'll struggle to get anyone in. All in all though- it's not all doom and gloom. Hit the nail on the head, a common fault during last season and every opposition manager knows it. PD must correct this 60 minute men trend. Furman is the biggest worry for me in this aspect, when he tires the team goes to pot. Edited August 13, 2012 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada_latic Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Only caught the second half. But so far I think we have better attack minded players than last season. We were better going forward than last season. The defence still scares me. Especially when Cisak, M'voto or Tarky loose concentration. They have got to be more focused than they were tonight. This was there problem last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyPimp Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 We lost to a good manager who had a very expensive squad at his disposal. If this had been against Walsall I'd have been worried but I saw enough in the first half to suggest that we'll be OK this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshawlatic Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 (edited) My view like it or lump it... Cisak...one mistake..it happens...I wish we had Kirkland tonight Byrne ok..old sod..steady.. Mvoto..ok Tarkowski...kid learning his trade.....good and bad..cannot blame him.. Mchangawamba ?..out of position.. Weslowski...best player..all effort..70s porn star moustache.. Slew.......ok but lost the plot..no service... Furman....ok The real villains.... Simpson.........Bertie big bollocks..senior player...went mising..Chris Taylor with a shorter haircut Croft...................FAT FAT FAT waste of space....ONE cross Thats 10 players................. Now who is totally missing ? Cannot have done much ...............Lost the plot after 30 mins...thought the job was done.................Something needs to change big time NOT GOOD ENOUGH I don't post on here often and I am as gutted as anyone tonight but that post is quite frankly utterly bollocks The part on Croft I'm more relating too, one of our best players penalty aside Edited August 13, 2012 by JWhite101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewrat Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I thought our problems were in central midfield. Any defence will cave in if they have no cover. Both Furman and Wes were found wanting in the second half. They did not get on the ball and were obviously tired and needed subbing before Sheffield's second goal. Croft disappeared even earlier leaving Byrne totally exposed to the pace of their winger. First half Croft covered and this did not happen. Some people must be looking through strange spectacles if they think our midfield was not totally outplayed second half. IN the circumstances the defence did the best we could hope for with the exception of the keeper. His error let them back in the game whilst Kirkland was making world class saves at the other end. There should be no despair as we will not come up against a team as good as Sheffield in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canada_latic Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Good to see the main stand with a new lick of paint. Or I need to adjust my colour setting on the t.v.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLatics Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 ????????? It's the attitudes to the learning. Dickov neees a tougher approach and as supporters we need to snap out of this "small club" mentality. For me the standards aren't high enough. If players aren't learning they go. Certain players have had too much time to do their learning. Dickov, too, who as per saw us concede (our third), shook his head, looked at Taggart... and sat down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoney Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) For God sake, cut everyone some slack, there were some really promising signs tonight - we scored two great goals - looked threatening all game, it's just we got caught by inexperience at the back, but Tarky will keep learning. Overall I think that was promising, the mane worry is how thin our squad is Agreed good signs in first half - everyone really postive pre - season then one disappointing second half and all the doom mongers are back out again - let's see what Saturday brings eh. Edited August 14, 2012 by Stoney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) I thought our problems were in central midfield. Any defence will cave in if they have no cover. Both Furman and Wes were found wanting in the second half. They did not get on the ball and were obviously tired and needed subbing before Sheffield's second goal. Croft disappeared even earlier leaving Byrne totally exposed to the pace of their winger. First half Croft covered and this did not happen. Some people must be looking through strange spectacles if they think our midfield was not totally outplayed second half. IN the circumstances the defence did the best we could hope for with the exception of the keeper. His error let them back in the game whilst Kirkland was making world class saves at the other end. There should be no despair as we will not come up against a team as good as Sheffield in the league. You're right about where the problems were, but your solution is wrong. Jones changed Wednesday's style of play and we found ourselves outnumbered there towards the end of the second half. We were 2-0 up but did nothing to counter this. If we'd strung 5 across the middle we might, and it is only a might, have frustrated them. If we'd subbed both Wes and Furman who, seriously, are you suggesting would have replaced them and strengthened us? Last night boiled down to the managers' tactical nouse. Dave Jones outclassed Paul Dickov. Jones reacted. Dickov didn't. Edited August 14, 2012 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De_La_Vega Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 By totting up resources the only way I could see Dickov changing things would have been to pull M'changama inside, Wes onto O'Grady's toes and put slew out left. Worrying lack of resources, and a concern that he did nothing. Some good stuff in the first half, but old failings still appear to be in evidence. That said though, Crofty on the back post at 2-0 had to be game over. Awful finish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayItLivo Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Thin budget means thin squad with a bit of quality which will hopefully pickk up enough points or a larger squad full of Kevin Betsy's, Wes Wilkinson's and David Lee's. Either way, it's gonna be a long season, a couple of injuries to the likes of Furman and Simpson and we're gonna be in serious trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lags Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 Last nights performance was evident all pre season. Some fantastic football from the off (30 mins). Some of the best pass and movement in many a year on show. Then once a bit of fatigue kicks in the ability to concentrate lowers and so does the shape. Dave Jones did improve his side early after the second goal. Nadine wasn't fit and asked to come off, so that passenger was replaced. He hauled off the ineffective Maguire and pushed Pecnic up front to partner O'Grady, the latter doing his usual against Latics. Half time saw Jones obviously read the riot act and one massive save from Croft sealed our fate. The midfield lost it's battle as Youssef was never in the battle, Croft tired and whilst still one of our better players couldn't cover back helping Byrne has he had done. This exposed our soft under belly allowing Tarky & Big Jean to be out muscled on each and every occasion. O'Grady, JJ & Antonio bullied them easilly on every occasion. Game over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EASTLEY Posted August 14, 2012 Share Posted August 14, 2012 You're right about where the problems were, but your solution is wrong. Jones changed Wednesday's style of play and we found ourselves outnumbered there towards the end of the second half. We were 2-0 up but did nothing to counter this. If we'd strung 5 across the middle we might, and it is only a might, have frustrated them. If we'd subbed both Wes and Furman who, seriously, are you suggesting would have replaced them and strengthened us? Last night boiled down to the managers' tactical nouse. Dave Jones outclassed Paul Dickov. Jones reacted. Dickov didn't. I sort of agree with this, however the caveat is that Dave Jones has the strength in depth to change things, we don't apart from long ball to Matt Smith, or Byrne to CH and brown at lb. Furman and Weso were outnumbered in midfield by the substitution before the half hour, again maybe m'changma could have bolstered that or simo could have dropped deeper, but with the system we played it could easily have been 3-0 or 3-1 at least but for Kirkland - 2nd stop was brilliant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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