PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 It's come to this, has it? I wouldn't say I thought you had an agenda to your face? Why not? I assume everyone isn't an ass in person until I meet them in person. If you are saying you would say that, then says all I need to know about your integrity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pukka Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I'd personally say the horse has been flogged on this thread.. I'm out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 I certainly feel like a flogged horse with all this crap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLatics Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 So, in a nutshell. Phil starts a thread that's far from ambiguous which can easily misconstrued as having bigoted or faintly-racist undertones (ie questioning a player's religion-related choice, this time fasting). People question Phil on this, some going so far to hint at a bigoted or xenophobic agenda. Phil doesn't nothing really to dissuade that notion, only choosing to fan the flames some more. Phil then gets fed upb at one person's line of questioning and goes on that old "You wouldn't say that to me face to face now, would ya!? WOULD YA!??"". There's a fair few facepalms on this thread Phil lad. #phonenumber What? I'm sorry - but this is heading in a dangerous direction. I don't wish to stoke the fire, but how can questioning an athlete's diet (wrong or rightly - I believe the issue ot be irrelevent because M'Changama has not looked any worse than the rest of the players) be misconstrued as being "faintly racist"? He gave absolutely no indication of any anti-Islamis or racist sentiments. The language used questioned purely his diet. What makes you believe his initial message could be deemed so? Deary me - too many fall for media ideological manipulation. I respect every religion - in fact it irritates me how every religion has taken a severe beating for several years now - but we can talk about the negatives and positives without being anti-religion, anti-Islam/Christianity/Judiasm etc or racist (which doesn't even apply in this case). If anything, I'm pro-religion and I didn't see anything to take offence by from what Phil said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheLatics Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 For the record - I speak purely in relation to the opening post. I daren't read pages 2 or 3, although I have because of the quoting etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 What is this all about... you talk about a discourse and brand perfectly sensible people like Jim in a patronising manner. I gave his accusational, childish post exactly the response it deserved. If you say he's sensible, I'll take your word for it. It wasn't evidenced here. You mention polite conversation, doubt it is from your responses, as you just let people get on with religion as its personal and the root cause of much trouble because of intolerence and lack of understanding. He appears a very genuine lad. Eh?. Think you might need to reword this. As he says himself it meant readjusting his lifestyle."Just because I was unable to eat or drink between sunrise and sunset was not a problem. 16 hours without food or drink for an athlete isn't a problem? "I was fine and was able to run and to train and play matches. May be I was a little bit tired, but for me it was no big deal." He even admitted he was tired. See the problem I am referring to? My good mate has a first in Sports Nutrition and Fitness Coach - Pro mountain biker, worked with the GB Boxing training camp pre olympics in Sheffield he laughed and said your assuming its a bad thing. If he has a good breakfast that suits him before sunrise, water if hes fit he will feel no worse than anyone if his metabolism is used to it. He said the big enemy is eating too close to a game in his opinion. There are enemies everywhere with nutrition, but maybe you should ask your good friend how the body is expected to maintain muscle glycogen levels, with 16 hours of starvation, with strenuous exercise, without catabolising muscle tissue, and even then without reducing energy levels and therefore performance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 For the record - I speak purely in relation to the opening post. I daren't read pages 2 or 3, although I have because of the quoting etc. After the accusations began and the fallacies started flooding in I was taking even more care not to be misunderstood (for what good it did). I doubt you'll find anything more incriminating on the other pages. I'm glad some people are looking at my posts objectively though. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYLEOAFC Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Catholics dont eat meat on a Friday this could seriously damage their protein intake a day before a vital match. I saw Paul dickov and gerry taggart discussing this at Tesco's earlier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie_J Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I gave his accusational, childish post exactly the response it deserved. If you say he's sensible, I'll take your word for it. It wasn't evidenced here. Eh?. Think you might need to reword this. 16 hours without food or drink for an athlete isn't a problem? He even admitted he was tired. See the problem I am referring to? There are enemies everywhere with nutrition, but maybe you should ask your good friend how the body is expected to maintain muscle glycogen levels, with 16 hours of starvation, with strenuous exercise, without catabolising muscle tissue, and even then without reducing energy levels and therefore performance? You :censored:ing love an argument, don't you?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepingthe Faith Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I doubt many of you would lack the integrity to act so childishly if you were talking with me in person. At least I hope you wouldn't. I'm tired of the mindless accusations and insults, having to repeat easily digestable points, the strawman arguments and seeing people too cowardly to make VALID points resort to automatic nay saying or down repping my posts. All because I dared to bring up a topic related to something you consider taboo. It's pathetic. If you don't agree with someone then at least have the courage to explain why LOGICALLY, or stay out of it. That is how an adult conversation is supposed to be handled. Put up or shut up. This is not what I signed up to this forum for. If you people can't handle civil discourse, then don't expect me to try either. There's just far too many children on here. Go play on your own. I'm done. Apparently not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 You :censored:ing love an argument, don't you?! Only with honest arguers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 Apparently not! I'm allowing this mess of a thread to fizzle out. I wouldn't want to be accused of running away from it.. If you have a problem with that, stop posting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshgaz Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 You :censored:ing love an argument, don't you?! please can we watch the language. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie_J Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I assume everyone isn't an ass in person until I meet them in person. If you are saying you would say that, then says all I need to know about your integrity. Oh that's what you meant! You're being deliberately provocative just as you have throughout the thread and in starting it in the first place. This is exactly what I meant when I said you had an agenda - it strikes me that you were spoiling for an argument. For the record, whether M'changama's performance level is impacted by Ramadan has the potential to be an interesting source of discussion. It's how you tell 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldhamSheridan Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Not sure why this is still running as people are getting personal rather than discussing the issue. You all do realise its a post on a website you are responding to, not a political leader, etc? The only other thing, is Stevie, as an administrator I'd refrain from getting involved in crap like this. You saw the way it was heading early doors. I'd either hold off or ditch the administrating as you cannot win as sooner or later you'll disagree with alot of people (even the reasonable ones on here {so probably not me, then}). Edited August 27, 2012 by OldhamSheridan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 Oh that's what you meant! You're being deliberately provocative just as you have throughout the thread and in starting it in the first place. This is exactly what I meant when I said you had an agenda - it strikes me that you were spoiling for an argument. That is horse:censored:. I was fine until the irrational brigade, including you, put me on the defensive. All I was doing until then was try to hold a rational discussion. I invited nothing but polite discourse. For the record, whether M'changama's performance level is impacted by Ramadan has the potential to be an interesting source of discussion. It's how you tell 'em. I told it fine enough. And if you're expecting me to believe that if I had phrased my OP and my following posts differently then people would have acted less antagonistic, then you do me a disservice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 If the sun had been out this Bank Holiday Monday this thread might never have happened. Ponder that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 That, at least, is true Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Just lock it. It's run its course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 What? I'm sorry - but this is heading in a dangerous direction. I don't wish to stoke the fire, but how can questioning an athlete's diet (wrong or rightly - I believe the issue ot be irrelevent because M'Changama has not looked any worse than the rest of the players) be misconstrued as being "faintly racist"? He gave absolutely no indication of any anti-Islamis or racist sentiments. The language used questioned purely his diet. What makes you believe his initial message could be deemed so? Deary me - too many fall for media ideological manipulation. I respect every religion - in fact it irritates me how every religion has taken a severe beating for several years now - but we can talk about the negatives and positives without being anti-religion, anti-Islam/Christianity/Judiasm etc or racist (which doesn't even apply in this case). If anything, I'm pro-religion and I didn't see anything to take offence by from what Phil said. He is a serial wind up merchant who comes out with these sorts of posts on a semi regular basis. I think he has started enough posts to make me and others question his motivation. A slippery customer who evades sensible debate when it is contrary to his own opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 He is a serial wind up merchant who comes out with these sorts of posts on a semi regular basis. I think he has started enough posts to make me and others question his motivation. A slippery customer who evades sensible debate when it is contrary to his own opinion. Evidence? Or is this yet another hit and run attack on my character? I have never run away from any honest debate in my life. And I have always been willing to address any point posed to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 A whole month of irresponsible nutrition. And you can't possibly starve yourself for 16 hours of the day without your energy levels being sverely affected. I'm all for people being able to do what they want with their lives, and make whatever dietry choices they see fit. But when you are an athlete, or athleticism is a key part of your job and others are counting on you, you lose all my sympathy. "Irresponsible nutrition" is obviously not the way he sees it. Sure it'll affect his fitness, but for him "irresponsible nutrition" would be offending God by breaking the fast. I realise this is quite difficult for an atheist or agnostic to understand but you could at least give it a go. It's a nice try but you're obviously not really "all for people being able to do what they want with their lives". You're actually dead against people doing what they want with their lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) Catholics dont eat meat on a Friday this could seriously damage their protein intake a day before a vital match. I saw Paul dickov and gerry taggart discussing this at Tesco's earlier I didn't hear the Dickov/Taggart discussion, but I heard (or I think I heard) that no-meat-on-Fridays now extends to fish. Anyone know whether this is true? I'd like to know how bad I've been before I head to confession. Edited August 27, 2012 by 24hoursfromtulsehill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilStarbucksSilkySkills Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 "Irresponsible nutrition" is obviously not the way he sees it. Sure it'll affect his fitness, but for him "irresponsible nutrition" would be offending God by breaking the fast. I realise this is quite difficult for an atheist or agnostic to understand but you could at least give it a go. It's a nice try but you're obviously not really "all for people being able to do what they want with their lives". You're actually dead against people doing what they want with their lives. Another false accusation. I very clearly stated that I am all for people doing what they want with their lives until it impacts other people. In this case I see it as impacting on his job responsibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Another false accusation. I very clearly stated that I am all for people doing what they want with their lives until it impacts other people. In this case I see it as impacting on his job responsibilities. My you are being persecuted today. They're almost tying you to the stake. Perhaps he puts his "job responsibilities" quite some way below his religious ones in his personal pecking order. And who are you to say he shouldn't? In any case, the club, which determines his "job responsibilities", obviously does not insist on players abandoning their beliefs and the rituals demanded of them for the sake of footie. As a fan, your claim to be "impacted" by his behaviour is not exactly zero, but it's not far off. Perhaps you should put this to M'Changama himself, to his face. Say to him, "I've been adversely affected by your fasting." I absolutely want to be there when you do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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