sykelatic1 Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 The shoved them at the other end and gave them a bit of the south stand too, by the looks of it. http://www.footballforums.net/forums/showthread.php/290446-Bury-v-Preston So they do have the capability to actually organise things properly then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 He had money everywhere! All over the counter top - a gust of wind and that cash is gone! He did actually comment about tidying it up as i was passing through. So if say the £31 was handed over as a £20 note, a £10 note and a £1 coin, the turnstile operator had to remove from his other takings £7 to tally the number of clicks with the gate receipts for VAT purposes. If he had the organisational ability to keep each of the surplus £7 separate, he's too clever to be a banker and he could do a better job of running the country's economy than George Osborne. At BP in the 1950s, I and three other lads (including two who formed The Oldham Tinkers) were admitted to the Chaddy End two at a time on one click of the turnstile. Inside the ground we were approached by a plain-clothes policeman who asked us to confirm what had happened and took our details. In due course we had a day off school to appear as witnesses at Oldham Magistrates' Court when the turnstile operator was found guilty of theft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sykelatic1 Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 So if say the £31 was handed over as a £20 note, a £10 note and a £1 coin, the turnstile operator had to remove from his other takings £7 to tally the number of clicks with the gate receipts for VAT purposes. If he had the organisational ability to keep each of the surplus £7 separate, he's too clever to be a banker and he could do a better job of running the country's economy than George Osborne. At BP in the 1950s, I and three other lads (including two who formed The Oldham Tinkers) were admitted to the Chaddy End two at a time on one click of the turnstile. Inside the ground we were approached by a plain-clothes policeman who asked us to confirm what had happened and took our details. In due course we had a day off school to appear as witnesses at Oldham Magistrates' Court when the turnstile operator was found guilty of theft. I gave him a 10 note and 2 coins then when he offered to let me through too i gave him a 20 note and he gave me a 1 coin back! Tbh looking at the state of his 'area' it was so disorganised notes and coins everywhere ,but my feeling wasnt of anybody 'pocketing' cash - more of ' do they know how many people are getting in' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) I am embarrassed by the complete shambles that occurred through no fault of ours. Had this occurred at Oldham I would obviously be looking at the preparations and arrangements. How much money did they lose . Perhaps £10.000 plus. The issue re compensation is difficult because unless identified at the time it would be difficult to address which fans were affected. Whether contract law has been broken I do not know because I have not seen Bury FC terms and coniditions of sale. Did they enter into a contract when they sold the ticket and by a fan not getting admission is he then subject to gaining damaages for lost time, travelling, inconvenience etc. Interesting thought but taking a case to court would cost more than the damages you would get. Having said that you could apply for the costs in the case. Not a course of action I would recommend but nevertheless interesting. Barry It's not contract law as the sale is to a consumer so the sales of goods act 1979 applies. It doesn't matter what terms Bury have got. If they have not allowed entrance through a fault of the club, the least the fans should get is the cost of the ticket back Fans without tickets have got little claim as Bury don't have to admit them. To add, yes, when the sale take place they have entered into a contract to supply the fan with the right of admission to the game. Edit - Sales of Goods and Services Act 1979 Edited April 14, 2013 by jimsleftfoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De_La_Vega Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-22138057 Does this not sound suspiciously like people are blaming Latics fans? Interesting... It did fill up quickly, when I got there at 2.30 the queue was about 60-70 people but by the time I got in that was up to about 200. But that still left half an hour to sort something, with the option of delaying the kick-off. Pathetic, and some of the excuses coming out of the authorities now are even worse. These people's jobs are to deliver a football game successfully to the paying public, and if an extra 400-500 fans is the worst you have to deal with then you should be very pleased, and able to accommodate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Depressing to see the default response of 'blame the fans', this weekend of all weekends. The Bury chairman's comments are just idiotic: "They hadn’t sold that many tickets. I think they sold 900 tickets and suddenly more than 2,000 turn up. You can’t legislate for that." You chose to not make the match all-ticket, you then spent all week begging fans of your nearest rivals to come to the game, which happened to be a relegation 6 pointer for both clubs. It really didn't occur to you that a lot of people might turn up and pay on the day? I heard from some people after the game that the police were saying that the problems were all down to fans turning up late (heard that one before, eh?) and "there was no queue at twenty to three, hundreds of fans turned up at ten to". Tell you what, why don't you accuse people of trying to storm the gate and get in without paying as well? I got there at 2.45pm (ironically I was in a panic because my train was an hour late and I was still in Liverpool at 1pm - I had a ticket and I ended up being the only one out of my mates who got in) and the queue was across the car park then. And as for the nonsense about "we're damned if we do and damned it we don't, what if we'd moved our fans and only 1000 Oldham fans turned up?" Well what if that had happened? Some Bury fans would have been pissed off at being inconvenienced. It wouldn't have been top of the list of things they were pissed off about yesterday, would it? Running the risk of moving fans unnecessarily, weighed up against the risk of what actually happened - hundreds of fans locked out, massive loss of income at a time when they're desperate for money, away fans going in the home stand (which was inevitable once they were locked out), trouble kicking off after the goal, people getting thrown down the steps.....yeah well done, good choice. And the police over-reaction after the game was ridiculous - stopping people going in pubs, telling them to stop serving (the Wetherspoons in the town centre was like a :censored:ing library and they still made them shut the bar for half an hour), loads of riot vans.....FFS it wasn't Fenerbace v Galatasaray. The only trouble was in the home stand after the goal, I didn't see any trouble outside the ground, the response was just unnecessary. It's a shame that what should have been a brilliant day was ruined, but it just feels like the attitudes haven't changed from the 80s. Mismanagement, hope for the best, then when it goes badly wrong blame the fans and treat them like thugs. I'm sorry but I'm not buying the "well if you'd had tickets....well if you'd turned up earlier...." arguments, and it just sounds horribly familiar. If you don't want people to pay on the day, make the game all ticket. If you let people pay on the day and beg them to turn out in numbers to ease your financial problems, don't complain when people do exactly that. I wouldn't wish going down or going bust on many teams. I feel really sorry for Bury's fans. They deserve better than the incompetent arseholes who run their club. +1 Although I would like to point out I had a pint of Old Rosie at 17:30. Only certain pubs within walking distance of the ground stopped serving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosa Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 +1 Although I would like to point out I had a pint of Old Rosie at 17:30. Only certain pubs within walking distance of the ground stopped serving. Aw where was that? I could have been drinking proper cider instead of watching Wigan win at Wembley, sober? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Aw where was that? I could have been drinking proper cider instead of watching Wigan win at Wembley, sober? The same pub I was in before the game, which you already know the name off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Mikey Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) So if say the £31 was handed over as a £20 note, a £10 note and a £1 coin, the turnstile operator had to remove from his other takings £7 to tally the number of clicks with the gate receipts for VAT purposes. If he had the organisational ability to keep each of the surplus £7 separate, he's too clever to be a banker and he could do a better job of running the country's economy than George Osborne. Keep a tally of how many adults have gone through, multiply by 7 and take that amount from the pot at 3:00. Not rocket science but still probably beyond George Osbourne. (To the Neil Adams types out there, that was intended as a light hearted quip, I am not a communist.) Edited April 14, 2013 by Magic Mikey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forte_Baby Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Only positive i can see from this is it shows how the turnstiles at Oldham are by far more organized than at Bury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) The Lloyds Wetherspoons in Bury centre wasn't letting anyone in after the game, that's where a lot of those that didn't get in had retired too, including Scouse Latic who I was supposed to meet. Managed to blag my way in after going through the we're not all idiots routine etc unfair to taint us all with the same tag etc… even flashed my NASUWT members card, which the bouncer said 'Yeah, but the teacher in Green Street, was the biggest dick of the lot!' He let me in for my persistence….. Lo and behold the bar was quiet, crazy that all football fans are still treated like dickheads in this day and age…. Edited April 14, 2013 by oafcprozac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Supporters with grievances against Bury FC may find the club's Customer Charter useful. http://www.buryfc.co...ub/charter.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Supporters with grievances against Bury FC may find the club's Customer Charter useful. http://www.buryfc.co...ub/charter.aspx Customer Service contact is Mrs Jill Neville who will deal with enquiries, complaints or concerns and is available on 0844 57 90009 option 8 or email: admin@buryfc.co.uk Your Mum's your Dad, your Dad's your Mum ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 First of all congratulations to the team on a great win. Not the best performance, (second half better than first and some good substitutions) but a win that we deperately needed and worked hard for. I often compliment our vocal away support but really ladies and gents you were terrific today . I know the players were really pleased and know that it helps them immensely. The sound coming from that stand was something different. Take a pat on the back each and every one of you. On a totally sour note can I apologise to all those fans who did not get in to see the game. Let me say from the outset that totally responsibility for match day arrangement rests with the home club and it is up to them to make preparation with the local agencies and the police. Having said that we are a responsible club that looks afters it fans (contrary to opinion in some quarters). I am often criticised for not supporting the fans but that is not correct. Wehn incidents occur such as this I do believe that it necessary for certain questions to be asked regarding the match day arrangements and the role of the home club and the police in a situation that did not allow a large number of fans to gain access. There may be a perfectly good explanation as to the numbers expected, based on intellligence and arrangements made accordingly with safety in mind. Segregation of fans does not allow for last miunte arrangement to be made in many cases. I am currently looking at the situation and hope that our win takes a little bit of the heat out of the disappointment. Barry Apologies if this has been mentioned before, I've skimmed through the thread. Parts of the statement by Barry Owen reads as having an attitude of superiority, and although it's completely understandable for our fans to be angry at the Bury administration, I think OAFC played a part in the farce. I fully understand that match day arrangements lie with the home team, however in local ties like the one yesterday I think that in the future there's scope for the travelling administration to communicate with the home team to alleviate match day pressure as much as practically possible. A question was raised elsewhere about how would OAFC handle a similar situation - At the ground yesterday all the ingredients were there for a very serious, threatening situation to develop - we can all claim that Bury were turning money away at the gate, but the right call was made with respect to the safety of the fans - and apart from some truly bizarre judgement calls about splitting children and parents up, I think Bury made the best of a bad thing. I'd like to add that one would assume that after yesterday's events Latics wouldn't create the same crowd problem, and we hope that all concerned learned from the experiences - before yesterday's fiasco I'm not too sure, who can have absolute confidence in the OAFC administration? It's easy to point the finger, Barry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 It's easy to point the finger, Barry. ...and yet I reckon the finger should be pointed anyway, and perhaps wagged a little. The original organisation was poor and the problems easily foreseeable. Maybe it's a case of there but for the grace of God, but in OAFC's defence, the organisation of the massive home games against Liverpool and Everton was impeccable. If anyone's going to point the finger, they should point it at the deeply worrying lack of communication during the crisis and the subsequent "it's not my fault pal" blame shifting. The police on the ground blamed the club stewards, who in their own defence prayed in aid the police. Higher up, Bury officials blamed OAFC fans and the police. We're not talking about a life-and-death situation, so there's no need to go overboard, but the lack of organisation and communication and the subsequent blame game are indications of a :censored:ty culture of complacency. Maybe it's just Bury, but I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 A question was raised elsewhere about how would OAFC handle a similar situation - At the ground yesterday all the ingredients were there for a very serious, threatening situation to develop - we can all claim that Bury were turning money away at the gate, but the right call was made with respect to the safety of the fans - and apart from some truly bizarre judgement calls about splitting children and parents up, I think Bury made the best of a bad thing. I'd like to add that one would assume that after yesterday's events Latics wouldn't create the same crowd problem, and we hope that all concerned learned from the experiences - before yesterday's fiasco I'm not too sure, who can have absolute confidence in the OAFC administration? It's easy to point the finger, Barry. 2 virtual sell out games this season and no significant problems suggest that speculating that latics might not be able to handle problems is a case of ignoring the plain facts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) To be fair as well as we handled our sell out matches - they were all ticket, with a clear process of priority entitlement and no tickets being sold on the day. Edited April 14, 2013 by oafcprozac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) 2 virtual sell out games this season and no significant problems suggest that speculating that latics might not be able to handle problems is a case of ignoring the plain facts? I wouldn't draw a parallel with all ticket games. For me the buck stops with Bury. But Latics should also address two things: 1. Could we have been more proactive in the 24 hours before kick off, as our own web site implied we could overfill the stand? 2. How do we ensure that we don't put supporters visiting BP in a similar position? I think we've pretty much cracked the answer to part 2 by shifting all home fans out of the RRE for many games. I suspect nobody gave question 1 any consideration. Edited April 14, 2013 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimeblue Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) To be fair as well as we handled our sell out matches - they were all ticket, with a clear process of priority entitlement and no tickets being sold on the day. Small part, big part or all of the RRE. Anyone likely to bring 4,500 all ticket. Sometimes unnecessary to give the big part but yesterday proved it's better the edge on the side of caution. If 2,100 had been enough it'd have only just been enough. Unbelievable not to have any kind of contingency plan and the intelligence was appalling. Only needed to have a read on here to see a decent following was expected. Edited April 14, 2013 by longtimeblue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy_Fent Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 normally when a large away following is expected at Latics we allow for an overspill area I think with it being another club that worked with the same police force most of us assumed there would be some sort of similar arrangements, so it was to a lot of shock from me and fellow supporters when the steward on the turnstyles said to us "I'm sorry the ground is full, you'll have to go home I'm afraid". Then we were told by a policeman outside the ground they wanted to open a section for us but the Bury Chairman didn't want to pay the extra policing costs. But I've also been told that it was in fact the police that didn't allow Bury to open a section up for us, so it's a case of people passing the blame around. Still it was a good crack in the pub near the ground, personally I still had a good day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Then we were told by a policeman outside the ground they wanted to open a section for us but the Bury Chairman didn't want to pay the extra policing costs. I don't believe the copper on this one. There would have been no extra costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 2 virtual sell out games this season and no significant problems suggest that speculating that latics might not be able to handle problems is a case of ignoring the plain facts? Christ. Hardly the same is it. OAFC went into 'The Premiership are coming" mode and serviced the ties accordingly - which was all-ticket, we wouldn't have expected any less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy_Fent Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Bury launch investigation into Oldham fans locked out of Gigg Lane 9:46pm Saturday 13th April 2013 in Sport By Craig Nelson BURY’S board of directors have apologised to Oldham fans locked out of today’s crunch relegation battle at Gigg Lane and vowed to launch an investigation. Estimates of between 300 and 500 Oldham supporters were unable to get into the ground, some who had bought tickets in advance, after the Manchester Road Stand allocated to visiting fans reached capacity. “Bury Football Club offer our sincere apologies to those supporters who were unable to gain access to the stadium,” read a statement from the Bury board, released on the club’s website. “The club have launched an investigation into the events prior to today’s game. “Naturally, we are extremely disappointed to see supporters turned away and we shall be meeting with the club’s safety department and the police in order to ascertain just what went so badly wrong. “We shall inform supporters of the outcome of that investigation in due course.” The total attendance was 4,558 – Bury’s second-highest of the season. The official figures show that 2,073 Oldham fans attended the game, not counting those outside the ground or who sneaked into the home stands. The situation could well have cost Bury between £5,000 and £9,000 in lost revenue, not to mention the refunds to fans who bought tickets and were unable to watch the match. That is money the club, which this week appealed for £1million to stay afloat, can ill afford to lose. It is also a sting in the tail of what was already a terrible day for Bury, who were relegated to League Two after losing 1-0 following a 79th-minute goal from Oldham substitute Matt Smith. While the police had to deal with disgruntled fans outside the ground, there were also ugly scenes inside, as Oldham fans celebrated their late winner. A number of supporters stormed the pitch from the away end while around 30 Oldham fans were ejected from the Main Stand. Serious questions were asked as to why the half-empty Cemetery Stand was not allocated to away supporters as well. But commercial director David Manchester said that possibility had been discounted on safety grounds. “We’re damned if we do and damned if we don’t,” he said. “What if we had opened both ends (to away fans) and then only a thousand turned up. “I mean, we were supposed to be getting 3,000 when Sheffield United came here and how many did they bring? 900. “You just don’t know until they turn up in a lot of cases. “They (Oldham) hadn’t sold that many tickets. I think they sold 900 tickets and suddenly more than 2,000 turn up. “You can’t legislate for that. “It was suggested (that we open up a Bury end to the Oldham fans locked out) but it didn’t happen. “There were concerns about safety issues.” http://www.burytimes.co.uk/sport/10354234.Bury_launch_investigation_into_Oldham_fans_locked_out_of_Gigg_Lane/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 If anyone's going to point the finger, they should point it at the deeply worrying lack of communication during the crisis and the subsequent "it's not my fault pal" blame shifting.... I agree with all of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 (edited) Mike Keegan's MEN offering. http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/oldham-athletic-fans-locked-out-2592885 Ian Crowther's comments at the bottom suggest people should buy tickets for games that his club haven't made all ticket. Cock. Edited April 14, 2013 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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