Who voted Barry onto the board of directors?

[Frankly Mr Shankly]

Personally, I'd rather have a fans representitive that didn't use stuff like "lololololololol" on the messageboards.

[oafcprozac]

Not trying to achieve anything Matt, if you get the impression I have a hidden agenda I can assure you I don't.

My names Paul...

I could do with losing a bit of weight, I'm losing my hair far too quickly. If I could emigrate to Oz tomorrow I would but that's a long way off and I like to wear 3/4 pants....

Seriously no agenda from me...

Edited July 7, 2013 by oafcprozac

[slystallone]

It doesn't need knocking down and starting again IMO.

Yes there are clearly 1 or 2 issues, but a disbanding and rebuilding? Nah. And in who's design would it be then rebuilt in? Surely the self same accusations that are currently being levelled at it now, could very well be levelled at it again after the rebuild; as it would be formed in someone's design model and opinions, not representive of the fan base as a whole?

 

I see this solving absolutely nothing, merely creating more issues. We don't need another faction, we don't need another voice with conflicting opinions brought into the mix, claiming to represent all fans.

The issues can easily be resolved by tweaks to the current set-up IMO.

 

I'm sure word of this thread will reach the Trust Board members and probably SC and other directors at the club too. If it stimulates the tweaks needed then it's been a good thing, but if this thread is indeed a exerise in creating a new role where it isn't neccessary; then i see only trouble ahead...

[Matt]

It doesn't need knocking down and starting again IMO.

Yes there are clearly 1 or 2 issues, but a disbanding and rebuilding? Nah. And in who's design would it be then rebuilt in? Surely the self same accusations that are currently being levelled at it now, could very well be levelled at it again after the rebuild; as it would be formed in someone's design model and opinions, not representive of the fan base as a whole?

 

I see this solving absolutely nothing, merely creating more issues. We don't need another faction, we don't need another voice with conflicting opinions brought into the mix, claiming to represent all fans.

The issues can easily be resolved by tweaks to the current set-up IMO.

 

I'm sure word of this thread will reach the Trust Board members and probably SC and other directors at the club too. If it stimulates the tweaks needed then it's been a good thing, but if this thread is indeed a exerise in creating a new role where it isn't neccessary; then i see only trouble ahead...

 

Democracy is great until it :censored:s you in the arse.

[HarryBosch]

I'd be interested to know how many other clubs' fans know the daily machinations of their team.

Or want to

[ChrisA]

Personally, I'd rather have a fans representitive that didn't use stuff like "lololololololol" on the messageboards.

Lolololololol.

 

Seriously though I would agree with Metty. It appears to have veered away from its original intentions. Was it 250 grand for 3% as well?

 

Sweet.

[HarryBosch]

No he wasn't voted by the Trust's members, he was voted by the Trust Directorship, that has changed significantly since 2003 and was re-elected a few years later, I think mainly because there was no real way of challenging him unless you were indeed a Trust Director.

 

However, I do not feel the Trust is fit for purpose - people have said well join the Trust, but how can you join an Organisation you do not believe in?

 

Simon has invited me in for a chat in the next couple of weeks once he's back from New York, if any sort of representation was outside of the umbrella of the Trust, then I'd seriously consider giving us a proper voice. Of course I can be overly emotional at times, but I have had a few constructive chats with Simon over the last few months, whilst I feel he doesn't particularly like me or much of what I have to say, he does respect the fact I am blue through and through and unlike many, I don't snipe from afar I have sought him out and aired my grievances and asked my questions. I haven't always like the answers but I do appreciate how forthright he can be.

 

As much as I can be emotional I also capable of listening to both sides of an issue, at the end of the day we are all Latics fans and we all want what is best for the club, if that means we can improve communications between the club and the fans and on a much more regular basis then so be it. You won't find me hob-knobbing in board rooms on match-day, I'll be in the stands with my fellow fans freezing my nuts off cheering the lads on and after the game I'll be sharing a pint with my mates and moaning like hell at how bad we are.

 

If people were to support for a change or another voice in representing the fans, I'm sure Simon would be open to someone like myself getting more involved. It will not be via the Trust though, it's up you, I think we can make this happen....

I'm no fan of Barry but neither would I want the most vocal of a vocal, moaning minority acting as fans representative.

 

If we need one at all....

 

Sorry.

[Armchair]

I'm not picking on anyone in particular - but lots of posters have mentioned problems with the Trust and the way it represents fan views in very general wide sweeping terms, almost as though there is an assumed agreement that it's not performing it's function correctly.

 

Can anyone help me out by spelling out in simple terms what isn't happening that should be? (Some sort of list would help)

 

Can someone else help me by spelling out in simple terms what major achievements the Trust has contributed to in the past 8 years? (Some sort of list would help)

 

Until then I'll remain blissfully ignorant of how much the Trust is failing me and remain quietly optimistic about:

 

- the new stand

- the players we've signed (and the improved communication from the website since the contract extension news article)

- the performance we put in on Friday

- the fact we have an owner who's willing to talk frankly with the fans (we're doing a good job of making this positive thing into a significant negative. I can actually see Simon Corney avoiding this type of discussion in the future if all people do is use it as ammunition to undermine someone else's position).

 

The start of the season can't come soon enough.

[HarryBosch]

All well and good, but does that actually happen? I don't know. If so, I'd put a lot of money on it being the exception rather than the rule.

 

All I'm saying is that buying a season ticket or whatever doesn't give people a divine right to know the ins and outs of the club's bumhole.

Exactly.

 

I don't share this sense of entitlement to be appraised of every piece of potentially sensitive business information that could come out of the club.

 

If Simon Corney or any future owner ever needs to :censored: us over it will happen very quickly and there'll be nothing we can do about it. Just like last time.

 

Let the people whose job it is to run the club run the club.

 

Demanding to know the ins and outs of every ducks arse would only hinder that.

[Barryowen]

At one stage I thought it best not to get involved in this debate.

 

Many members of OWTB will recall the times in the past when I have been requested to keep off the site and not post. That had nothing to do with my attitude but people pointed to the fact that the intrigue of the debate was being spoiled because I was actually giving truthful and accurate answers based on my knowledge of the club and the job I was doing.

 

I think Metty makes some good points,although I feel he is a little bit dogmatic as to my role and his sympathy towards posters. It is many years since he was a director of the trust and many things have changed.

 

The demise of the Supporters Asssociation has seen the Trust take on ALL roles which has not been easy. I can take personal criticism but when it comes to my colleagues on the trust being maligned that rattles my cage (sorry). They work vrey hard and are "doers" as opposed to "talkers"

 

I , like Metty do not agree with Prozac's position. I have no personal gripe with Paul but my impression is that he wants to do a lot of talking and representation without putting any real work into a task. We have encouraged him to join the Trust from where he can make a difference but he choosed to use the excuse that because he does not believe in the Trust he will not join.

 

In the first place, the Trust many years ago was elected by the fans and those successful joined the Board. The election dictated the Chair position in those early days.

 

Trust members complete an awful lot of work that goes unnoticed. Meetings, commitments and assisting the club takes many hours and I suspect that many "talkers" on this site are put off by the commitment.

 

I am fortunate that I am retired and can put a great deal of time and work into the club. My effort and interest in the fans, with respect, is no less that other persons who boast of their popularity and role within the eyes of the chairman.

 

I have offered on numerous occasions to meet fans. I have had personal correspondence with numerous fans to help them but I don't publish every bit of work I do.

 

The advantage of the fans having a representative on the board is that the Trust has a working knowledge of how a football club is run on a daily basis.

 

There is no doubt that the Trust website needs updating and this will be done. I would hope then that better communication can be attempted.

 

We have some new members taking interest in working with the Trust and I would encourage anyone else to come along and commit yourself. To attempt further representation with a splinter group is just plain ridiculous.

 

And before anyone attacks me, I have no personal issues with any individual but I am entltled to defend myself.

 

If you want to ask a question please do so. If I can answer you I will. Unfrotunately I cannot always commit myself to the same amount of time that other posters have on OWTB because I have other active tasks and commitments for the Trust and Club.

[Oh Heck C-Beck]

I'm no fan of Barry but neither would I want the most vocal of a vocal, moaning minority acting as fans representative.

 

If we need one at all....

 

Sorry.

 

I agree, far too much of a personal agenda to be truly representative of the fan base as a whole, based on what gets posted on OWTB.

[HarryBosch]

We can leave things as they are with the majority of fans feeling like they have no voice and their concerns are not taken seriously whilst the club becomes more detached ...

More detached than when?

 

Have we ever had more information out of the club than we get today with the Internet etc...?

[lancy lad]

More detached than when?

 

Have we ever had more information out of the club than we get today with the Internet etc...?

In fairness Harry, the bit of info in question came from prozac rather than the formal route.

[LaticsPete]

I'm no fan of Barry but neither would I want the most vocal of a vocal, moaning minority acting as fans representative.

If we need one at all....

Sorry.

I can agree with this. Be my representative

[garcon]

prozac, I honestly don't think there is anything to be gained from you doing any more than you do now. Unless and until the Trust is disbanded then I believe it must remain the only recognised fans' group. If anyone wants to change how the fans are represented then I suggest they join the Trust and work from within.

 

I admit I'm rather out of touch, but when I was more closely involved a few years ago the Trust needed a lot of work. I think I joined, but I was never entirely sure - that is, I joined once and then ended up joining again when I found they had no record of me joining the first time. It was not the fault of anyone involved at the time, but there was a woeful like of administrative organisation. I know only too well how difficult it can be when your only resource is volunteers, but people have to make a real commitment to make it work.

 

If the volunteer resource exists within the Trust to manage it I think it needs to go on a serious recruitment drive, to gain membership and greater legitimacy as a fans' group.

 

In tangible terms the 3% ownership of OAFC 2004 Ltd is relatively meaningless, however the position on the club board is invaluable. I'm not sure it needs to be the Trust Chairman, but I think it is vital that one individual is a member of both the club and Trust boards.

 

In truth, I never truly understood what a "fans representative" was supposed to do to represent fans' views to the club board. As others have said, we have 4000 different opinions on more or less everything. Even actively canvassing opinion across the fan base is only likely to gain a minority view. So it seemed inevitable to me that the Trust position on the board became more one of communications director. A voice communicating TO the fans about what was going on, inevitably limited by what proprietary information can and cannot be shared.

 

All in all I actually think Barry has done a pretty good job. That understanding of how the club runs day to day is gold dust alone. The Trust was formed in fairly volatile times. It's not entirely unlikely that volatile times will return before too long - the Trust needs the strength of a large membership and a volunteer workforce willing to do its bit in the club's interest. Whatever you think of Barry, if you want to do more than share your opinions on an internet forum get involved.

[oafcprozac]

I'm not sure what's more insulting - either you're implying i'm full of piss and wind or that I'm lazy!?

 

 

Barry, if you check the Trust's records I was a member of the Trust from formation until around 2006. I even attended a fair few meetings when the organisation was in its infancy particularly at the Blue Club. I have always put my money where my mouth is and attended various events (including shaking buckets regularly with the likes of Limpetlad and CMR during the summer of hell) - usually the ones that are helping the club rather than exclusively to boost The Trusts' Coffers. (I understand this has to be done) I have also supported Player Share, Rick invited me onto the Committee but it wasn't for me.

I cancelled my Trust Membership I was increasingly asking questions about membership numbers, how much was in the coffers, why couldn't we have one member, one vote etc then When I enquired as to why I had not received my membership card I was informed I wasn't a paid up member despite having proof the annual fee had left my bank account the Trust had no record of me … and was getting nowhere. I also could see from afar that a few of the original board were drifting away, people were joining and quickly leaving the board and getting increasingly personal with people, that wasn't for me. From us on the outside Barry, the Trust is you. But you are the Chairman, fans rep and also Director of Oldham Athletic. Increasingly you're not only for me but for many Latics fans I speak to as your primary role is that of an Oldham Athletic Director, not the Chairman of Trust Oldham that is actually Our Fans Representative on the board of Oldham Athletic.

I am not shying away from anything, I feel the Trust is a closed shop that feels the Trust is fine as it is. I know some of you work very hard and I know a lot of what you and one or two others do, but if you were more accessible through newsletters, communications had a real direction and purpose to engage fans at all levels and actually sought out fans opinions by going to them instead of stating 'you have made yourself accessible', get into the stands on Match Day, get in the pubs before and after games etc...

There's several occasions when anyone who is aware of fans' concerns could have approached the club to issue a short statement or explanation as to why certain decisions have been made.

 

I don't think anyone wants to know the ins and outs of EVERY decision taken by the club, but fans' concerns should be addressed more often than they are. Whether you think a concern is warranted or not Barry, each and every issue should at least be acknowledged even if you have to clearly state that the information is confidential. Simon didn't have to tell me what he did the other day, but it did help allay the fears of many on here and gave us some understanding why some decisions have been made and why he was happy for me to post our conversation on here.

 

I have always preferred to support the club on Match Day, purchase my season tickets, my replica strips and any other old tat that takes my fancy. If I have a grievance, an issue, complaint or suggestion I often raise it either on here, or sometimes I've even spoke to people or contacted people in the club. I don't hide, everyone knows who I am even the Chairman himself, he's mentioned getting involved a few times to me but I am not a politician, I have no agendas all I want is the fanbase of Oldham Athletic to come together and support the club as one. I want us to have a voice, one that is listened to - not to know the ins and outs of every minute detail but a voice that understands the concerns of Chris the Solicitor, Paul the Builder, John the partially-sighted retired caretaker and a voice that addresses those concerns by making him/herself visible.

 

I think at the very least there should be some sort of published monthly update from our fans reps, report back what issues have been raised and how the club have responded?

 

And contrary to popular belief I do not spend every waking moment on this site, mobile media does mean I spend an unhealthy amount of time on here but the time I spend on here is not all consuming.

Edited July 7, 2013 by oafcprozac

[oafcprozac]

Apologies for my poor spelling through the evening, I was on my phone….. better give myself a poor grade!

Edited July 7, 2013 by oafcprozac

[al_bro]

I vote for Prozac to have a 20 minute meeting/roll around the terracing with SC every month.

All the points/rumours that are talked about endlessly on this site could then be answered or quashed once and for all.

sounds to me after the club shop last stand that SC welcomes the chance to have a full and frank discussion with a man of the people as opposed to throwing the odd bone to the nodding dog sat beside him on the board!!

May be an idea for Prozac to take Gordons role once a month and ask SC the questions on Latics Player. We would then hear the answers from the horses mouth.

[Lags]

Lolololololol.

 

Seriously though I would agree with Metty. It appears to have veered away from its original intentions. Was it 250 grand for 3% as well?

 

Sweet.

SC has always believed that was the clubs money in the first place anyway. So given that, 3% ain't too bad.

Edited July 8, 2013 by Lags

[opinions4u]

I'm not a member of Trust Oldham. But everything I read tells me they are a fans' organisation, not a members only club.

 

Their web site tells me their aims are:

 

1.

Protecting the future of Oldham Athletic: Having a fan on the board of the club is vital in ensuring a debacle similar to that of the 'Chris Moore Era' will never happen again un-noticed. Whilst the Trust may be unable to stop such an event happening, we will be in a good position to see this happening, and have plans formulated to cope with such a situation.

(Question: What are these plans?)

 

2.

Representing the views of the fans: The fans are the very soul of the club - there is no doubt of that. By having a fan on the Board of Directors, the view of many Oldham Athletic fans can be aired at board-room level. The Trust will always strive to ensure that fans are treated in a fair manner, and help build a fan-friendly football club.

(Questions: How does this happen? How do fans views get collated, represented, discussed and, perhaps most importantly, how do fans find out about this?)

 

3.

Investing in the future of Oldham Athletic: The Trust will continue to raise funds to invest in the future development of the football club - starting at youth-team level. We will work closely with the youth set-up to help youngsters in Oldham develop their footballing talent so we can see more players like Chris Taylor, Neil Eardley, Dean Smalley and Matty Wolfenden progress into the first team.

(Question: What support has the Trust given to the youth set up in the last 12 months?)

 

---

On point one I'm interested to know what cash reserves the organisation has. My fear is that at some point legal help will be needed. While at a high level this can often be obtained free with goodwill if a serious threat to the future of the football club arose then expensive costs could need to be met by Trust Oldham. Building up such a reserve and maintaining it is, to me, vital.

 

On point two communication is everything. It's why the thread started. It's why Prozac wants to try something different. Indeed, I'd go a step further and suggest that the lack of communication by Trust Oldham has directly contributed to some fans giving up on supporting the club. This needs radical overhaul. What has the Trust done? Why has it done it? What were the outcomes for fans? How did the Trust engage those fans? Put on repeat, week after week. The Trust web site, if maintained, could be a powerful tool. A refresh every couple of years isn't good enough. Stuff goes out of date very quickly.

 

On youth, what support has The Trust provided? How have they funded this? How can it be demonstrated that this is over and above what the football club's budget would have provided? I'm genuinely interested, but don't have a clue.

 

There is probably an army of people out there who are keen to help in some way, but don't really know what that help should look like. A small inner circle of people committing time and working hard to run round in circles doesn't appear to achieve a great deal. A handful of events and a bit of cash raised that's absorbed somewhere, not sure where, but presumably to benefit the town's football club.

 

Look outwards, engage, make some noise. And think about what your true purposes are and how you can be more inclusive. If Trust Oldham can get its act together and the football club can get the new stand up there is a real opportunity to get something positive in motion.

Edited July 8, 2013 by opinions4u

[oafcprozac]

SC has always believed that was the clubs money in the first place anyway. So given that, 3% ain't too bad.

 

Bucket collections apart and one or two bits and pieces it was well under £100k that the Trust raised - it mostly was the club's money. The Legends game money was the clubs', so were other funds. The Trust were custodians of those amounts and gate receipts. Somewhere along the line people began to believe that the £230k was raised by the Trust it wasn't, I don't know the exact total and whilst the total the Trust raised was significant the majority of that total was the club's money that the Trust ringf-enced - asked by Jarvis and Joy so that it didn't end up in the Black Hole. The Trusts efforts were admirable (I was part of those fund raising efforts in a small way, bucket collecting, attending every event I could, buying books about Sheep on Pitches for £30 a time etc…)

 

I too have been guilty of thinking that we paid 6 figures for our 3% stake, it was nothing like that - the 3% was a genuine gesture by the new owners, which was gratefully accepted by us all.

[oafcprozac]

Anyhow reports to write today, then QT with the missus as it's our wedding anniversary. Will return to this later in the week.

Edited July 8, 2013 by oafcprozac

[oafcprozac]

I'm not a member of Trust Oldham. But everything I read tells me they are a fans' organisation, not a members only club.

 

Their web site tells me their aims are:

 

1.

Protecting the future of Oldham Athletic: Having a fan on the board of the club is vital in ensuring a debacle similar to that of the 'Chris Moore Era' will never happen again un-noticed. Whilst the Trust may be unable to stop such an event happening, we will be in a good position to see this happening, and have plans formulated to cope with such a situation.

(Question: What are these plans?)

 

2.

Representing the views of the fans: The fans are the very soul of the club - there is no doubt of that. By having a fan on the Board of Directors, the view of many Oldham Athletic fans can be aired at board-room level. The Trust will always strive to ensure that fans are treated in a fair manner, and help build a fan-friendly football club.

(Questions: How does this happen? How do fans views get collated, represented, discussed and, perhaps most importantly, how do fans find out about this?)

 

3.

Investing in the future of Oldham Athletic: The Trust will continue to raise funds to invest in the future development of the football club - starting at youth-team level. We will work closely with the youth set-up to help youngsters in Oldham develop their footballing talent so we can see more players like Chris Taylor, Neil Eardley, Dean Smalley and Matty Wolfenden progress into the first team.

(Question: What support has the Trust given to the youth set up in the last 12 months?)

 

---

On point one I'm interested to know what cash reserves the organisation has. My fear is that at some point legal help will be needed. While at a high level this can often be obtained free with goodwill if a serious threat to the future of the football club arose then expensive costs could need to be met by Trust Oldham. Building up such a reserve and maintaining it is, to me, vital.

 

On point two communication is everything. It's why the thread started. It's why Prozac wants to try something different. Indeed, I'd go a step further and suggest that the lack of communication by Trust Oldham has directly contributed to some fans giving up on supporting the club. This needs radical overhaul. What has the Trust done? Why has it done it? What were the outcomes for fans? How did the Trust engage those fans? Put on repeat, week after week. The Trust web site, if maintained, could be a powerful tool. A refresh every couple of years isn't good enough. Stuff goes out of date very quickly.

 

On youth, what support has The Trust provided? How have they funded this? How can it be demonstrated that this is over and above what the football club's budget would have provided? I'm genuinely interested, but don't have a clue.

 

There is probably an army of people out there who are keen to help in some way, but don't really know what that help should look like. A small inner circle of people committing time and working hard to run round in circles doesn't appear to achieve a great deal. A handful of events and a bit of cash raised that's absorbed somewhere, not sure where, but presumably to benefit the town's football club.

 

Look outwards, engage, make some noise. And think about what your true purposes are and how you can be more inclusive. If Trust Oldham can get its act together and the football club can get the new stand up there is a real opportunity to get something positive in motion.

 

This for me is key

[jimsleftfoot]

So, if I feel that you don't operate in a way that I can agree with, and do not represent my views in the way I expect, I should set up another "fans rep" role too?

 

Let's be clear here, you will represent the fans views in the way YOU think it should be done. And part of that already involves ignoring an element of the fans current form of representation as you, without attending any recent meetings (in the last 8 years by your statement), have decided that it does not, and can never operate in the way that YOU want it to.

 

Your ability to form an opinion on an organisation that has existed to represent latics fans for about 10 years, no matter how poorly it may do so, without you attending a meeting or giving that organisation any opportunity to demonstrate what it does for 8 years, suggests to me that you don't posses any real ability to form reasoned judgements.

But hey, one conversation with SC and you're the messiah.

Here here.

 

I give credit where it's worth so credit to you Prozac for getting a bit of info out of SC.

 

SC wants you more involved as your an intelligent man who makes a lot of noise and could do a lot. But it's clear from this that you don't want to work with people, you'd rather do your own thing. A 'loose cannon' so to speak.

 

You don't represent me.

[oafcprozac]

Now the New Stand is looking more and more likely, what are The Trust doing to ensure the fans' bar is fitted out and furnished? The Stand will be built, but there's a real opportunity to involve the fans in fundraising to ensure a bar they have long lobbied for to be one that meets their expectations and ensure it is one they will use time and again. Simply one where you think pre/post-match pint it is the fans' first choice.

 

If the Trust get involved here, that will be something tangible where people can say - "Oh yeah the Trust raised funds for this, they listened to what the fans wanted, went back to the club and raised the funds to make it happen etc after consulting the fans on likely numbers wanting to use the new facility, the club even increased the proposed square footage of the bar etc…"

 

The Trust distributed leaflets on the New Stand last year which was admirable and just the sort of visible exercise we are looking for more of. Now distribute questionnaires and ask your fellow fan what they want in the new bar. How can we make it unique to get our fans coming back time and again. Spending their hard earned quid benefitting the club time and again. There's a chance to maximise fan involvement here, don't waste it.