The Boxing Thread.

[dave_ragg1984]

Really? Watch the first minute and a half of round 9, Groves was even winning that round!

 

First 45 seconds of the round, Groves better than Froch but there isn't loads in it. For the next 45 seconds Froch absolutely dominates him and then the ref stops it. If rounds only lasted 90 seconds, Froch would have won the round hands down, even without the dodgy stoppage.

 

Just watched the full fight again. It was good to watch again cos I'd had a few on Saturday night. It was closer than I thought first time round. Once you block out Jim Watt's terrible commentary, its noticeable that Froch was nowhere near as bad as has been made out. Going into the last round I'd make it Groves up by 2 (maybe 3). But what is noticeable is that from round 6 onwards, Groves is absolutely knackered.

 

The 6th was Groves best round of the fight, IMO (well, the first 2 minutes before he thought he was good enough to drop his gloves). Groves hit Froch loads, with some sustained attacks. But by this point, Froch is walking through everything. I don't think Groves had the energy to do any serious damage. And once this round was over, Groves was knackered. His quick pace at the start of the fight had really taken its toll.

 

I do believe that if the fight hadn't been stopped when it was (which it shouldn't have been) that Froch would have knocked him out either later in the 9th, or not long after. But if it did go to points, Froch would have won it. Seeing how tired Groves looked, and how strong Froch is at the end of fights, I think Groves would have struggled to win another round.

 

The fight shows that Groves could have a career at World level, but it also showed that he needs to learn how to fight for a full 12 rounds. If he is fighting the top fighters, running out of gas after 6 rounds isn't going to lead to a massively successful career. He's got time on his side with that though.

[Mullet]

No offence, but what does your opinion matter as to what would happen? The fact is that Groves was winning on every card. Froch had 45 seconds of good punches in the 9th round, the first time he had hurt Groves, most of which didn't even land cleanly and got a very premature stoppage; that's enough to predict an easy win for Froch?

 

I'm assuming you thought Froch was going to :censored: Groves pretty routinely before the fight. That just goes to show the unpredictability of boxing. This is why a rematch is needed. The result of the fight is unsettled and contested when you're saying if's and but's and what haves.

[leeslover]

Just watched that, maybe part hindsight but Groves looked like he had problems from the 5th. He could hardly have boxed much better, and wanted to finish it then, but it wasn't happening. For all that Froch was struggling his hits were digging in a lot more than the ones he was taking and I couldn't see much beyond a knockout soonish. Absurd stoppage though.

[dave_ragg1984]

No offence, but what does your opinion matter as to what would happen? The fact is that Groves was winning on every card. Froch had 45 seconds of good punches in the 9th round, the first time he had hurt Groves, most of which didn't even land cleanly and got a very premature stoppage; that's enough to predict an easy win for Froch?

 

I'm assuming you thought Froch was going to :censored: Groves pretty routinely before the fight. That just goes to show the unpredictability of boxing. This is why a rematch is needed. The result of the fight is unsettled and contested when you're saying if's and but's and what haves.

 

My opinion matters little, its as worthless as yours. But this is a message board, so if people didn't offer their opinions what on earth would be the point of it existing?

 

If Froch hardly landed cleanly in the only part of the fight where he hurt him (which is balderdash) then why on earth was Groves face such a mess on Sunday?

 

Like you say, its a fact (we can all use bold) Groves was winning on every card - so are you saying the judges were correct? Groves was only winning by 1 round on 2 cards. That to me says that at least 2 of the judges were seeing it very favorably towards Froch. Those score cards were only after 8 rounds too. With that barrage from Froch in the 9th its pretty safe to assume he would have won that round, so on 2 cards after 3/4's of the fight Froch would be level.

 

Whats enough to predict a win for Froch, was like I said, Groves was knackered and Froch is a well known strong finisher. And 2 judges had already given Froch more than he probably deserved, so I'm going to assume that those 2 judges would have carried on doing that.

 

I thought Froch would win, and win by knockout. And therefore its a fact that I was correct. But I was surprised with how well Groves fought. I did rate Groves before the fight, but thought this fight was coming too early for him.

[Mullet]

 

My opinion matters little, its as worthless as yours. But this is a message board, so if people didn't offer their opinions what on earth would be the point of it existing?

 

My point is that you can't just be content in that the fight ended prematurely because that's what you predicted. Without trying to sound patronising, the fact remains that Groves was winning the fight and was in control until the 9th round.

 

 

If Froch hardly landed cleanly in the only part of the fight where he hurt him (which is balderdash) then why on earth was Groves face such a mess on Sunday?

 

Obviously every punch hurts whatever boxers claim for their own image, but in boxing terms being hurt really means disorientated or having a negative affect on your ability to punch in the coming seconds, minutes etc. Froch was visibly wobbled by Groves' punches, and knocked down at one point. Other than the bad stoppage can you genuinely say there was a time when Groves was visibly disorientated?

 

 

Like you say, its a fact (we can all use bold) Groves was winning on every card - so are you saying the judges were correct? Groves was only winning by 1 round on 2 cards. That to me says that at least 2 of the judges were seeing it very favorably towards Froch. Those score cards were only after 8 rounds too. With that barrage from Froch in the 9th its pretty safe to assume he would have won that round, so on 2 cards after 3/4's of the fight Froch would be level.

 

They were correct in saying Groves was leading, however the experts will tell you that one point was unjustifiably lenient towards Froch.

 

 

Whats enough to predict a win for Froch, was like I said, Groves was knackered and Froch is a well known strong finisher. And 2 judges had already given Froch more than he probably deserved, so I'm going to assume that those 2 judges would have carried on doing that.

 

That's a completely fair and logical guess, but it's a guess at best because we were robbed of a proper conclusion to a cracking fight. In the same way that Howard Foster made a shocker of a decision, Froch winning unfairly on the scorecards would've been as illegitimate as his premature stoppage proved.

 

 

I thought Froch would win, and win by knockout. And therefore its a fact that I was correct. But I was surprised with how well Groves fought. I did rate Groves before the fight, but thought this fight was coming too early for him.

 

I think that I also posted earlier in the thread that Froch would annihilate Groves, I underrated him as I didn't like him in his press conferences and thought Froch would capitalise on the anger Groves had incited through his verbal tactics. Even though I believe the fight was actually unfinished, I agree it was too early for Groves, because to be honest if he had gradually stepped up the quality of his opponents before this fight rather than making a huge leap in standard I reckon he'd have killed Froch. But as is the estimation of what could have been in the last 4 rounds of the fight, that prediction is as worthless.

Edited November 28, 2013 by Mullet

[rudemedic]

If you haven't seen Froch v Groves it is on Sky Sports 2 in 10 minutes.

[Yard Dog]

Froch did his last preparation session before the Groves fight at the gym I go to.

 

EDIT: Can't link to the pics as they're on Oldham Boxing's twitter page (Nov 21st)

Edited November 29, 2013 by Yard Dog

[dave_ragg1984]

 

I think that I also posted earlier in the thread that Froch would annihilate Groves, I underrated him as I didn't like him in his press conferences and thought Froch would capitalise on the anger Groves had incited through his verbal tactics. Even though I believe the fight was actually unfinished, I agree it was too early for Groves, because to be honest if he had gradually stepped up the quality of his opponents before this fight rather than making a huge leap in standard I reckon he'd have killed Froch. But as is the estimation of what could have been in the last 4 rounds of the fight, that prediction is as worthless.

 

If the estimation of what could have happened in the last 4 round of the fight is worthless, then the estimation of what could have happened if Groves had tougher fights before he fought Froch similarly worthless.

[Roger Ritchie]

Watched the fight again last night. Opinion has still not changed. Stopped far too early and I only gave Froch one round before the 9th.

 

Watch the Bellew - Superman weigh in if you fancy a laugh. - well that escalated quickly.

 

Quality double header on tonight. Clearly HBO fancy Stevenson - Kovalev for a unification fight next year.

 

Should be some heavy hitting tonight.

 

Gutted Cleverley isn't fighting tonight would like to have seen what he could do at Cruiserweight - my prediction not a lot.

 

Chisora should win again and then Frank Warren will be banging on about him being deserving of a world title shot. When in reality he will have just beaten someone who got stopped by Airich.

[Mullet]

Watched the fight again last night. Opinion has still not changed. Stopped far too early and I only gave Froch one round before the 9th.

 

Watch the Bellew - Superman weigh in if you fancy a laugh. - well that escalated quickly. Loved Bellew saying 'what he doesn't understand is that I'm from a place just as bad as him' in his broad Scouse accent!

 

Quality double header on tonight. Clearly HBO fancy Stevenson - Kovalev for a unification fight next year. That will be superb, but I fancy Bellew to give Stevenson a good go tonight, he can keep to a detailed plan and has that bomb of a right hand. Stevenson's been KOed by a fighter with 20 losses before so land clean and he's suspect.

 

Should be some heavy hitting tonight.

 

Gutted Cleverley isn't fighting tonight would like to have seen what he could do at Cruiserweight - my prediction not a lot. To think Haye was in that division just 3 or 4 years ago, Cleverley's far too scrawny to compete. Won't punch hard enough.

 

Chisora should win again and then Frank Warren will be banging on about him being deserving of a world title shot. When in reality he will have just beaten someone who got stopped by Airich. He's :censored:. Which places amongst the mode of heavyweight boxers at the moment. Dreadful division.

Edited November 30, 2013 by Mullet

[Mullet]

Turned out Bellew's tactics were far too negative. Never pushed Stevenson back and was totally dominated. That was a fighter from the top level against a 2 levels below fighter so the only way he'd win it was a flash KO but he didn't give himself a chance really.

 

Kovalev - Stevenson is going to be a cracker. Can't see much further than Kovalev though.

Edited December 1, 2013 by Mullet

[Roger Ritchie]

Stevenson's interview was funny. The fans want to see Carl Froch against me.

 

No, the fans want to see Kovalev against you which is why you were on the same bill.

 

Looks like 'superman' is a little scared of the mere mortal.

[HarryBosch]

My point is that you can't just be content in that the fight ended prematurely because that's what you predicted. Without trying to sound patronising, the fact remains that Groves was winning the fight and was in control until the 9th round.

 

 

 

 

Obviously every punch hurts whatever boxers claim for their own image, but in boxing terms being hurt really means disorientated or having a negative affect on your ability to punch in the coming seconds, minutes etc. Froch was visibly wobbled by Groves' punches, and knocked down at one point. Other than the bad stoppage can you genuinely say there was a time when Groves was visibly disorientated?

 

 

 

 

They were correct in saying Groves was leading, however the experts will tell you that one point was unjustifiably lenient towards Froch.

 

 

 

 

That's a completely fair and logical guess, but it's a guess at best because we were robbed of a proper conclusion to a cracking fight. In the same way that Howard Foster made a shocker of a decision, Froch winning unfairly on the scorecards would've been as illegitimate as his premature stoppage proved.

 

 

 

 

I think that I also posted earlier in the thread that Froch would annihilate Groves, I underrated him as I didn't like him in his press conferences and thought Froch would capitalise on the anger Groves had incited through his verbal tactics. Even though I believe the fight was actually unfinished, I agree it was too early for Groves, because to be honest if he had gradually stepped up the quality of his opponents before this fight rather than making a huge leap in standard I reckon he'd have killed Froch. But as is the estimation of what could have been in the last 4 rounds of the fight, that prediction is as worthless.

I watched it again last night, sober.

 

You all should.

 

We were had by disgraceful (even by Watt's standards) commentary.

[Mullet]

I watched it again last night, sober.

 

You all should.

 

We were had by disgraceful (even by Watt's standards) commentary.

 

I have watched it since, twice. I'll admit, Watt had a bad night, took along with the disbelief we all felt when Groves dropped Froch it certainly distorted the viewpoint of the fight for the TV audience. All of the rounds were closer than he voiced and Froch landed more than he claimed; it was almost like he commentated on the context. However, I still gave Groves most of the rounds, the stoppage was far too easy and still think the judging was of poor quality.

 

Putting that fight, and the possibility of a rematch behind, Broner being battered was entertaining.

[PlayItLivo]

Brilliant result last night that. Maidana just kept walk through him and roughing Broner up.

 

Glad that cocky, hype job been exposed and the fact it was a guy like Maidana who did it made it a bit sweeter.

[Yard Dog]

Brilliant result last night that. Maidana just kept walk through him and roughing Broner up.

 

Glad that cocky, hype job been exposed and the fact it was a guy like Maidana who did it made it a bit sweeter.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

 

Always liked Maidana...and seen Broner struggle a couple of times before so had a feeling someone would come along and smash him up.

 

As much as I am happy with the result, Broner deserves some credit for that tonight. Took a lot of massive left hooks.

[Yard Dog]

Top watch. No mas.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-BlK3B4Ykc

Edited December 18, 2013 by Yard Dog

[PlayItLivo]

Couldn't have put it better myself.

 

Always liked Maidana...and seen Broner struggle a couple of times before so had a feeling someone would come along and smash him up.

 

As much as I am happy with the result, Broner deserves some credit for that tonight. Took a lot of massive left hooks.

He took a lot of punishment, fair play to him for that's but the way he tried to con a DQ and a get out of jail free card was pathetic.

 

He'll struggle at 147 where he isn't particularly big with his style and lack of footwork. He should try and drop back down to 135 where he has explosive power, failing that 140, he needs to grow a bit more into 147. He got away with it against Paulie 'cause of Malignaggi's lack of power.

[jburbri]

Broner is a lightweight at best at 140 he'd struggle danny garcia will take him inside 8. I'd say he'd get beat of Madina as some people where saying he was like floyd because he had the shoulder road. But he's not as fast and his defensive prowess is not like mayweather.

[rudemedic]

Interesting decision by the IBF, a rematch within 90 days or Froch may lose the IBF belt. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/boxing/25888443

[PlayItLivo]

So it's on then, Froch v Groves on May 31st.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSF4o4ERdWA

 

Can only see Groves taking this based on the first fight. IMO he'll box a lot smarter than he did in the first fight, knowing the speed advantage he has and knowing he can land and hurt Froch quite easily you'll see a more methodical beating and perhaps a KO/Stoppage of Froch. I don't like writing Carl off, but he looked slow against Kessler in the rematch, but he got away with it as Kessler has significantly slowed himself, but Froch looked wild at time in that one and then Groves boxed Carl's ears off until a late rally and ridiculous stoppage.

 

Please can an admin add a public poll to the thread for Froch v Groves II?

 

This fight will be massive, everyone will be talking about it come fight week. Brilliant fight for British boxing this.

Edited February 17, 2014 by PlayItLivo

[RobOAFC]

So it's on then, Froch v Groves on May 31st.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSF4o4ERdWA

 

Can only see Groves taking this based on the first fight. IMO he'll box a lot smarter than he did in the first fight, knowing the speed advantage he has and knowing he can land and hurt Froch quite easily you'll see a more methodical beating and perhaps a KO/Stoppage of Froch. I don't like writing Carl off, but he looked slow against Kessler in the rematch, but he got away with it as Kessler has significantly slowed himself, but Froch looked wild at time in that one and then Groves boxed Carl's ears off until a late rally and ridiculous stoppage.

 

Please can an admin add a public poll to the thread for Froch v Groves II?

 

This fight will be massive, everyone will be talking about it come fight week. Brilliant fight for British boxing this.

Can't see Groves knocking Froch down again let alone being able to KO Froch & Froch is too good in the final rounds. Groves won't be able to dominate the early rounds again so can only see it being a Froch win by either KO or on points.

[jburbri]

Can't see Groves knocking Froch down again let alone being able to KO Froch & Froch is too good in the final rounds. Groves won't be able to dominate the early rounds again so can only see it being a Froch win by either KO or on points.

The fight will be the same again only this time when froch gets hit with that left-hand low again he`'ll get stopped as froch is again underestimating him by saying he's giving him a pasting.

[sjk2008]

The fight will be the same again only this time when froch gets hit with that left-hand low again he`'ll get stopped as froch is again underestimating him by saying he's giving him a pasting.

 

You're only kidding yourself if you think Froch will underestimate Groves again.

 

Just because Froch has promised to give him a pasting, doesn't mean he's underestimating him, you know? He's hardly going to say "It'll be close, yeah, I mean, I won the last one but he was too good for the majority of that fight, I only hope I can connect with the odd haymaker", is he?

 

I'm leaning towards a Froch stoppage providing he goes into his training camp with the respect for Groves that he's earned, and approaches it like any other title fight he's had.

[jburbri]

 

You're only kidding yourself if you think Froch will underestimate Groves again.

 

Just because Froch has promised to give him a pasting, doesn't mean he's underestimating him, you know? He's hardly going to say "It'll be close, yeah, I mean, I won the last one but he was too good for the majority of that fight, I only hope I can connect with the odd haymaker", is he?

 

I'm leaning towards a Froch stoppage providing he goes into his training camp with the respect for Groves that he's earned, and approaches it like any other title fight he's had.

Froch will struggle because groves won't make the same mistake as turning is back on him when he gets hit. I also believe froch didn't want this rematch as he was apparently going to fight Chavez Jnr who's a blown up middleweight. We've seen the best of froch against Bute. Froch I believe will get stopped in 7.