Stevie_J Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Not a chance. Remember 12 months ago????? Ask them all to pay 96p towards "KICKING RACISM OUT OF FOOTBALL" Give them nothing, their fans were out of order last year and we should not forget that. Give them nothing but a hostile reception for the way our own was treated last year. Put ourselves first for a change, no apology go stick your 96p One of their fans was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Not a chance. Remember 12 months ago????? Ask them all to pay 96p towards "KICKING RACISM OUT OF FOOTBALL" Give them nothing, their fans were out of order last year and we should not forget that. Give them nothing but a hostile reception for the way our own was treated last year. Put ourselves first for a change, no apology go stick your 96p I don't think the actions of one individual in a crowd of 45,000 should be relevant. Especially as he might have been misheard (however unlikely). I also made reference to Bellamy's Welshness that night. He killed us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie_J Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I know. I haven't voted in the poll. The whole Hillsborough thing affected me greatly as an ordinary football fan. The last 23+ years of bollocks that those families have had to suffer has also hit home. I couldn't be more sympathetic. Maybe my post above is wrong. They were my initial instincts though. I don't like forced giving. Twist my arm, encourage me, wave a bucket in my face or whatever. But don't force a "donation" out of me. Doesn't feel right. That's fair enough. I would take the approach that charitable attractions do of adding the voluntary contribution and asking if people are happy to pay it. As someone has pointed out, that's necessary to not have to pay tax on it and apply Gift Aid anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonesyOAFC Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) One of their fans was. The rest were chanting Suarez's name just a week or so after he'd be charged of racially abusing another professional tbf. But he isn't a racist though. Oh no. Edit: Although I suppose we can't really take the moral high ground after having a certain Mr L Hughes play for us... Edited January 6, 2013 by JonesyOAFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangerinedreams Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) I'm crap at copying and pasting stuff via iPad, hopefully, here is the Liverpool walkers website on what they have done so far, which clubs/companies supported them and what they hope to achieve. Underdog http://www.fromthekop.com/ Edited January 6, 2013 by tangerinedreams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusoe Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 If the club wants good PR, It can do something. I really do not believe the 96 families do not need our cash. They will in due course be awarded bucket loads. I am so pleased they've got their justice they sort, but they didn't need our charity for that. However I would back any showing of support the club wants to give. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonesyOAFC Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 (edited) This. And if anyone wants to donate money to what is a worthy cause, they're welcome to do so. But as someone said in an earlier post, forced charity doesn't sit well with me. Edited January 6, 2013 by JonesyOAFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 And if anyone wants to donate money to what is a worthy cause, they're welcome to do so. But as someone said in an earlier post, forced charity doesn't sit well with me. Here's a link (nicked from above) for people to do just that. http://www.fromthekop.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Not for me. I don't see that this is the most important charitable cause out there right now, they have legal aid, the single, a huge global fan base etc. I am deeply uncomfortable with the idea of doing charity for PR purposes, how cynical have we become? Do it because it's right or not at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankly Mr Shankly Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I'm a no too. For exactly the same 'forced charity' reasons as someone said a page or two back. It should be completely by choice. :censored: me, can you imagine someone quasi-aggressive affronting you on the high street with a bucket? It stacks up to the same thing really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I wonder if Tom Adeyemi will do the half-time draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lalalajpkalala Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 If we're doing it for PR reasons, ask yourself how long any goodwill to Mansfield for their gesture will last and what will it bring to them? Not long and nowt. Let the club focus on OAFC and if someone with a bucket outside the ground asks for a donation, throw in your change if you feel like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayItLivo Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Give them nothing but a hostile reception for the way our own was treated last year. I'm targeting Daniel Sturridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philliggi Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 the whole charity thing for this should have ended when the government announced they were paying legal fees. any money made after that should have been redirected into another good cause. why else do these families need this money other than the legal fees? If this question can be answered legitimately then i apologise for my next comment, but they are in danger of looking like they are making a profit out of this which is so so wrong on so many levels. from a footballing point of view bp needs to be made a fortress. nice gestures might get you a 10 line comment 6 pages in from the back of the sun but what does it get you on a football pitch? give them the minimum allocation, no Gestures need making and lets treat the like any other football club coming to bp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosa Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Just to clarify, the families will not be getting - and are not seeking - 'bucket loads' of money in compensation. They were awarded compensation after the disaster, so I'm not sure they can claim again. They were paid an average of £3500 each. Some were paid as little as £1000. The average pay-out for the police officers who claimed compensation for post-traumatic stress disorder was over £90,000. The ongoing legal fight by the families is to hold those responsible for the disaster to account. The government have agreed to pay their legal fees for the inquest. I don't know the details of what exactly they will be covering. There has been no mention of legal aid for any future criminal or civil proceedings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Just to clarify, the families will not be getting - and are not seeking - 'bucket loads' of money in compensation. They were awarded compensation after the disaster, so I'm not sure they can claim again. They were paid an average of £3500 each. Some were paid as little as £1000. The average pay-out for the police officers who claimed compensation for post-traumatic stress disorder was over £90,000. The ongoing legal fight by the families is to hold those responsible for the disaster to account. The government have agreed to pay their legal fees for the inquest. I don't know the details of what exactly they will be covering. There has been no mention of legal aid for any future criminal or civil proceedings. I imagine it would be impossible for there not to be criminal prosecutions against guilty parties, "if," the inquest finds that a previous inquest was fixed on a mammoth scale. I'm not sure but I would guess there would be grounds for further civil action/compensation regarding the negligence leading to the deaths as it would be brought on completely different grounds to the original claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De_La_Vega Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 No. I don't believe the fans were 100% innocent at the game and I have no great animus towards the police, who are being judged by today's standards when the reality of policing football then was vastly different. Let it lie. Liverpool fans will not be happy until someone accepts total blame, but not 1% of me believes that there was no reason for the gates being opened. That said, the poor sods at the front were totally innocent, and part of me wonders whether a sense of guilt drives some of the campaign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosa Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Let it lie. Liverpool fans will not be happy until someone accepts total blame, but not 1% of me believes that there was no reason for the gates being opened. No, they weren't opened for 'no reason'. They were opened because the layout of the ground, with the bottleneck at the Leppings Lane end, and the failure to stream the fans as they approached the ground (as had happened the previous year) meant that a crush had built up outside the ground. There was already congestion and lengthy queues an hour before kick off. I think I might have to give these boards a miss for the next month or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De_La_Vega Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 No, they weren't opened for 'no reason'. They were opened because the layout of the ground, with the bottleneck at the Leppings Lane end, and the failure to stream the fans as they approached the ground (as had happened the previous year) meant that a crush had built up outside the ground. There was already congestion and lengthy queues an hour before kick off. I think I might have to give these boards a miss for the next month or so. I don't want an argument because I sympathise with the Liverpool fans, but explaining these events in purely mechanical terms doesn't work for me. Big games regularly visited such inadequate facilities without such a disastrous ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 I don't want an argument because I sympathise with the Liverpool fans, but explaining these events in purely mechanical terms doesn't work for me. Big games regularly visited such inadequate facilities without such a disastrous ending. I used to think much as you do - but I was wrong. The ground was known to be unsafe by the police but they didn't care and didn't revise their procedures accordingly. And they used the general lack of sympathy with/suspicion towards Scousers to pass the buck to them. They fooled me and I admit it, but not now. It's another question whether to support fundraising at this game. I would want to be convinced that there was a compelling need rather than being supportive of the cause, which we could do in a number of ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scratch2000uk Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Hindsight eh??, The people to blame are the people who allowed the fencing/pens to be erected in the first place, Although it could be argued, that the decision to do so. was a result of troublemakers/hooligans, infiltrating opposing sides terracing. So, who does the blame lie with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 No. I don't believe the fans were 100% innocent at the game and I have no great animus towards the police, who are being judged by today's standards when the reality of policing football then was vastly different. Let it lie. Liverpool fans will not be happy until someone accepts total blame, but not 1% of me believes that there was no reason for the gates being opened. That said, the poor sods at the front were totally innocent, and part of me wonders whether a sense of guilt drives some of the campaign. I think you're so wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimsleftfoot Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 I don't want an argument because I sympathise with the Liverpool fans, but explaining these events in purely mechanical terms doesn't work for me. Big games regularly visited such inadequate facilities without such a disastrous ending. It did happen though and you are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danoafc Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Not for me. I don't see that this is the most important charitable cause out there right now, they have legal aid, the single, a huge global fan base etc. I am deeply uncomfortable with the idea of doing charity for PR purposes, how cynical have we become? Do it because it's right or not at all. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimeblue Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 (edited) If it was optional and there were buckets at the ticket office, I'd be surprised if all of the 65% who voted yes on here opted to make a contribution. It's an absolute non-starter. Not because the cause isn't valid but because donations need to be a choice and a selfless act. Doing it in a gimmicky way (which is what this would be in truth) doesn't hold much merit. Everyone who's voted yes just make a donation off your own backs? The money raised will be the same which is what it's all abouts surely? Edited January 7, 2013 by longtimeblue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts