opinions4u Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) It has been poor since February 2011 No. It was the end of November 2010. About 5 minutes after Evina gave us the lead at Spotland. Edited January 20, 2013 by opinions4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazlatic Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 No. It was the end of November 2010. About 5 minutes after Evina gave us the lead at Spotland. Will never forget the way we started the abandoned game at Spotland. We were devastating tempo-wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 The real rot set in with the home defeat by Bury, I thought at the time if we can't compete physically with them trouble is looming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossrocks Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I've been very forgiving of PD and I'm not sure we'd have kept Baxter without him but unfortunately, LLLLDLL is sacking form. Its the second worst in the league after Colchester. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I've been very forgiving of PD and I'm not sure we'd have kept Baxter without him but unfortunately, LLLLDLL is sacking form. Its the second worst in the league after Colchester. Even prior to this latest pisspoor run he should have been gone long before we got to this stage. He should have been sacked in September when we were on a run of 2 wins in 18. The only reason I can see for him clinging to his job is that he has some sort of financial interest in the club and it would cost Corney not only a year's salary but also the return of his investment. That sounds ridiculous doesn't it, but hang on we're Oldham Athletic a :censored:ing laughing stock of a club from Char Lady to Chairman where the official club policy is to trot out any old bull:censored: and the faithful few will swallow it and clap even louder. The club motto at BP really should be 'Truth is Stranger than Fiction'….. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticsPete Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 An experienced manager isn't always the answer. Latics have had five promotions since the war, four have been with managers whose first job was managing Latics. 1952/3 George Hardwick 1970/1 Jimmy Frizzell 1973/4 Frizz again 1990/1 Joe Royle (!962/3 it was Jack Rowley, in his second job after five years at Plymouth) Both Frizz's promotions and Royle's came after learning on the job. It argues neither for nor against Paul Dickov but managers who have come here with years under their belt have achieved far less than those who have been new to the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) An experienced manager isn't always the answer. Latics have had five promotions since the war, four have been with managers whose first job was managing Latics. 1952/3 George Hardwick 1970/1 Jimmy Frizzell 1973/4 Frizz again 1990/1 Joe Royle (!962/3 it was Jack Rowley, in his second job after five years at Plymouth) Both Frizz's promotions and Royle's came after learning on the job. It argues neither for nor against Paul Dickov but managers who have come here with years under their belt have achieved far less than those who have been new to the job. Not all, but a lot of it down to lack of money Pete. I remember Ron Atkinson and Tommy Docherty trying and failing to manage non league clubs after one time managing Man United. Edited January 20, 2013 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laticacid Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 man management is not just about the players liking you, its about them respecting, and to a certain degree fearing you. man management is getting the best out of players, keeping all the squad involved, and together, making players fight for each other and the club, dickov cant do this so i totally disagree he is a good man manager, just a very good bloke im sure, but that is not what we need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneSizeFitz Posted January 21, 2013 Author Share Posted January 21, 2013 His man management appears atrocious the way his players take the piss out of him every week. Why shouldn't his rapport with fans and and handling of the media be underestimated? As soon as the fans and/or media start to get on a manager's back, it breeds a sense of uncertainty around the club. The players start to lose faith in the gaffer. This is then reflected by performances on the pitch. Also, doubt starts to creep into the gaffer's mind - panic decisions start to be made, out of desperation as much as anything. Take Steve Kean at Blackburn; he was hounded out by the fans and the media. All that's succeeded in doing is bringing more instability to the club, and look where they are now - two managers later, and little or no chance of promotion. Winning them over's half the battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrown23 Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 the thing that really irritates me is that, when he does things right we look brilliant. Away at Forrest, second half, he got it right, got the boys up for it and we performed. But then after that its back to the same :censored:. The team are spineless, hence conceding so many late goals and I think the manager is too. I constantly worry what the team do in training, what he says to them a half time. I don't know what his game plan is because it seems so inept and useless that it cannot possibly be an actual plan or tactic. Brilliant, he can attract players and signing Baxter is superb. But if we still can't perform and win what's the point? Surely, with "the best squad he's ever had" the tactics should be based around the players, playing them in their best positions and working with them, not having a set mentality and forcing players to play to his tactics that are quite clearly useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrown23 Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 As soon as the fans and/or media start to get on a manager's back, it breeds a sense of uncertainty around the club. The players start to lose faith in the gaffer. This is then reflected by performances on the pitch. Also, doubt starts to creep into the gaffer's mind - panic decisions start to be made, out of desperation as much as anything. Take Steve Kean at Blackburn; he was hounded out by the fans and the media. All that's succeeded in doing is bringing more instability to the club, and look where they are now - two managers later, and little or no chance of promotion. Winning them over's half the battle. but to be fair, I haven't heard any booing or "dickov out" at matches, the media haven't exactly hounded him either. the pressure is coming from lack of wins, which is mainly down to his atrocious tactics and poor preparation. if I were working for someone and we were constantly suffering set backs and not achieving our aims then I'd lose faith with him too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slystallone Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 How much longer do you give a guy who is clearly out of ideas & out of his depth? He'll take us down if he stays....... He has to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukers1 Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 As soon as the fans and/or media start to get on a manager's back, it breeds a sense of uncertainty around the club. The players start to lose faith in the gaffer. This is then reflected by performances on the pitch. Also, doubt starts to creep into the gaffer's mind - panic decisions start to be made, out of desperation as much as anything. Take Steve Kean at Blackburn; he was hounded out by the fans and the media. All that's succeeded in doing is bringing more instability to the club, and look where they are now - two managers later, and little or no chance of promotion. Winning them over's half the battle. I started to doubt him when the form was 2 wins in 18. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laticdickovarmy Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) Excellent 1st post and nice to another perspective. You make your own luck in football, I dont think anyone is expecting the world. I said back in September after the Brentford loss if we stay up it will be a miracle and got a bit of a slatting for it but I look at the current squad and I dont see the fight for a battle IMO not only do we need experience off the pitch we need it on the pitch as well! He has still got time to get it right and I really want him to as I like him as a person but I dont think he will have enough about him to keep us up with his current squad and tatics which I see little change in week in week out Edited January 21, 2013 by laticdickovarmy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_mighty_bosh Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I see what you mean and hate the idea of continually sacking managers in a Chelsea-esque style. However, the tactical nativity is such a negative that I think if he shows no signs of improvement in this regard he should go. How can the manager continuously make incorrect decisions, crap substitutions, and stay in a job? He has done something odd at pretty much each game this and last season. Additionally at Yeovil the score didn't flatter them, we were weak, second to the ball and clueless after we let their first goal in. Sorry to pick up on this because I pretty much agree with the rest of the post, but that's given me the image of a Sunday league dad using subbuteo players to tell his kids where the stand for their Christmas play! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4froale Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) it doesnt matter that we 'deserved to win' or 'deserved a draw', the problem is that we still lost those games. How many excuses do we have to use for Dickov. Edited January 21, 2013 by 4froale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 "Losers whine about giving their best…Winners go home and :censored: the Prom Queen….." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Sorry to pick up on this because I pretty much agree with the rest of the post, but that's given me the image of a Sunday league dad using subbuteo players to tell his kids where the stand for their Christmas play! Might be progress tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Even prior to this latest pisspoor run he should have been gone long before we got to this stage. He should have been sacked in September when we were on a run of 2 wins in 18. The only reason I can see for him clinging to his job is that he has some sort of financial interest in the club and it would cost Corney not only a year's salary but also the return of his investment. That sounds ridiculous doesn't it, but hang on we're Oldham Athletic a :censored:ing laughing stock of a club from Char Lady to Chairman where the official club policy is to trot out any old bull:censored: and the faithful few will swallow it and clap even louder. The club motto at BP really should be 'Truth is Stranger than Fiction'….. Wicked whisper in the Mirror today, says a struggling managers potential payoff would be much lower than expected as he owes his chairman thousands in personal loans... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hands on Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I’m sick and tired of the idea that effort alone will be rewarded. I believe the team often leaves its sharpness on the training ground because the players who work the hardest are the ones that get picked. The coaching seems to make things worse rather than better. You can’t replace character and ability with hard work. I also worry about Dickov because I believe he is a stubborn man and I don’t therefore buy into the idea of providing him with a mentor/older more experienced 2nd. I also agree that he is not good at man management - being a nice bloke has got nothing to do with it. I do believe he will be here at the end of the season and think we must go on supporting the team as unless we do we will have helped them fail. I suspect we will be relegated but there is just a chance that we will stay up with less than 46 points. I see the Liverpool game as crucial because a decent showing could help us to battle on but the more likely thrashing, worse than the 5 1 at Anfield, will leave this group utterly defeated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbrown23 Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Wicked whisper in the Mirror today, says a struggling managers potential payoff would be much lower than expected as he owes his chairman thousands in personal loans... Pardew? Heard he owes Mike Ashley a fair sum of gambling debts. Either that or Dickov owes Corney Bacon and tea taxes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaticMark Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Long time visitor, first time poster. A brief assessment of recent performances: Although recent results have, undeniably, been dire, I'm of the opinion that Dickov is still the right man for the job. Recent performances have merited more than the 1 point we've gained in the last seven games: - Oldham 0 - 2 Swindon. A fair result, I felt. Outclassed. No complaints. - Yeovil 4 - 1 Oldham. Again, a very poor result, but flattered Yeovil. - Oldham 1 - 2 Doncaster. Unfortunate, deserved a point. - Oldham 1 - 2 Crewe. Very unfortunate, deserved a win. - Scunthorpe 2 - 2 Oldham. A good point, given the circumstances. Showed good character from 2 - 0 down, and had Wes not been sent off, could well have gone on to win the game. - Oldham 0 - 2 Brentford. Slightly unfortunate, could well have scraped a point. - Coventry 2 - 1 Oldham. One minute away from a point at the Ricoh? Unlucky. Admittedly, this still isn't great. But it isn't sacking form. And let's not forget the cup-run. Dickov as a manager: Positives: - His effort, passion and desperation for the club to succeed are irrefutable. - His ability to attract players to the club is equally so. - His man-management appears excellent; the players really do seem to rate him. - He seems very highly-regarded within the game. - His rapport with the fans/handling of the media is also impressive. This shouldn't be underestimated (...Penney?). Negatives: - Tactical naïvety. - An unwillingness to shake things up a bit when they're not going well. A lack of a Plan B. In my eyes, the latter two could be solved with the addition of an experienced, wise head to the backroom staff (Sammy McIlroy 'd been on my shortlist). Dickov is FAR from the finished article, but he deserves to be given the opportunity to fix things. The club needs stability; Rome wasn't built in a day. I firmly believe that we're not far from finding the right formula. Fans of this club seem to have somewhat unrealistic expectations. Let's face it, we are, based on attendances and finance, about where we should be. The idea that we should be higher up the league is the conception of nostalgia and an opinion that the current bunch of players are under-performing. It's time we stopped living in the past, and engaged in some realism. Would we have been able to attract these players without Dickov? Baxter springs to mind. I don't think we'll go down this year; our recent perfomances really haven't been that bad, and there ARE four worse teams than us in this league. Let's give Paul a chance, assisted by an experienced number two, until the end of the season and then take stock. The last thing we need is fans getting on the gaffer's back; he's doing his best. This sort of discontent inevitably filters through to the players, and isn't a mindset conducive to dragging ourselves out of a relegation dogfight. So, let's get behind the lads, and the manager and pull ourselves out of this mess. KTF. Excellent post and the type of discussion we should be having on this forum. I agree with most of your post, but I would still put a timeline on PD's tenure, and that to me is the end of the season. In the meantime I hope we can turn things around in the last third of the season, as I don't fancy another end of the season like 2004/5 (?) when we had to win our last game of the season to guarantee staying up. Now that was nerve racking! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldhamoafc Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 The problem is, if - and thats a big IF we manage to beat Liverpool, Dickov will be given the job for life relegation or not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangerinedreams Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 The problem is, if - and thats a big IF we manage to beat Liverpool, Dickov will be given the job for life relegation or not! Are you SC in disguise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 The problem is, if - and thats a big IF we manage to beat Liverpool, Dickov will be given the job for life relegation or not! A bit like Talbot was for beating City? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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