eyres_28 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) Carl Winchester is a player who certainly splits opinions among the Latics faithful. Personal opinion of the lad is he has undoubted ability. He is fairly quick, excellent on the ball, being arguably the 3rd most comfortable after Mellor and Baxter at the club, and when he does come forward with the ball he is very direct and proved at times against Brentford in particular at home he is one who can read the mind of Jose. Drawbacks IMO are clearly his lack of physical strength of any kind, and at the forum I hope someone can ask if this is the reason that PD, TP and LJ have not given him a chance despite some excellent performances, none-the-least against L'pool. He has been on the verge of the first XI for a couple of years and if he had been coached better by PD and Taggart then we'd have a serious player on our hands i feel. LJ mentioned he was disappointed with the progress the youths have made since emerging in the first team (prior to his appointment) at the first meeting with the lucky 12, and I assume with CW it's coaching him to look forward more frequently and be more direct with his play. The other side of the coin is the verdict I here so often that he's pi$$ poor. Don't see this but some blinkered fans near me will never forget the last 15mins vs. Nardiello and Exeter and are so closed with their views, who the hell thought there was a player in Millar until LJ came in?? (I didn't - but holding my hands up here - deal should be offered). The thread on keep/let go is very even on Winchester and I am very intruiged to here opinions... Mellor has moved ahead in the pecking order this week, but Carlisle last year proved they can definitely play together. Edited April 18, 2013 by eyres_28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Carl Winchester is a player who certainly splits opinions among the Latics faithful. Personal opinion of the lad is he has undoubted ability. He is fairly quick, excellent on the ball, being arguably the 3rd most comfortable after Mellor and Baxter at the club, and when he does come forward with the ball he is very direct and proved at times against Brentford in particular at home he is one who can read the mind of Jose. Drawbacks IMO are clearly his lack of physical strength of any kind, and at the forum I hope someone can ask if this is the reason that PD, TP and LJ have not given him a chance despite some excellent performances, none-the-least against L'pool. He has been on the verge of the first XI for a couple of years and if he had been coached better by PD and Taggart then we'd have a serious player on our hands i feel. LJ mentioned he was disappointing with the progress the youths have made since emerging in the first team (prior to his appointment) at the first meeting with the lucky 12, and I assume with CW it's coaching him to look forward more frequently and be more direct with his play. The other side of the coin is the verdict I here so often that he's pi$$ poor. Don't see this but some blinkered fans near me will never forget the last 15mins vs. Nardiello and Exeter and are so closed with their views, who the hell thought there was a player in Millar until LJ came in?? (I didn't - but holding my hands up here - deal should be offered). The thread on keep/let go is very even on Winchester and I am very intruiged to here opinions... Mellor has moved ahead in the pecking order this week, but Carlisle last year proved they can definitely play together. We have a number of decent youngsters who could make it into the first team - whether any of them do depends on so many variables, Belezika, Tarkowski, Millar, Mellor, Sutherland, Winchester - it's down to attitude and opportunity - it's down to being managed and coached properly - it's about wanting it at the end of the day - LJ is the man to find out methinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) I'd definitely keep him as his quality and calmness on the ball is something you rarely find. Just look at our team now...too many can't trap it and pass it simple with calmness. We've got a good crop of youth with Winchester, Mellor, Millar, Taylor and some younger players like Sutherland on the fringes of the team. Only thing I'd like for him to do is to bulk up a bit or find some attacking ability. At the moment I just think he doesn't really do enough. He's not attacking as a midfielder or defensive. If I was to compare a role for him in the future to anybody it would be a Carrick type player who can spread the ball around and link attack to defence, his passing should allow him to play that way. If Dickov had given some of the younger lads a go, especially Winchester after his fantastic Liverpool performance, there would be no question about renewing the contracts of these lads. They have the ability, it's about being given the opportunity to prove it in first team football. Edited April 18, 2013 by NewBlue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Sinnott Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Very very good ball player. Needs to eat steak every night of the summer, drink protein shakes and bench press. Maybe take some of Mellors weight.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcprozac Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Get him on the promax and keep him, has great potential needs a run of games and someone to show faith in him, just like Mellor and Millar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boys in Blue Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 He does need to put some muscle on but we should keep him. I'd love to see him develop a more confident attitude. At times he can look devastated by a bollocking off senior players but I'd like to see him back himself & shrug it off. Bags of ability on the ball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Keep him, if he's cheap. But play him ffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Heck C-Beck Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 I would give him another year to see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) I would stick with him, he should toughen up with experience. Edited April 18, 2013 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Very very good ball player. Needs to eat steak every night of the summer, drink protein shakes and bench press. Maybe take some of Mellors weight.. And work on running in a more manly fashion. Tightly wound wrist straps maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc-latics Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 he's had his chances and overall I don't think he's really impressed. he's tricky because he's obviously got ability, but he's too lightweight. If Johnson wants to keep him then it will only work if he puts some weight on and gets a run in the team. If not, there's no point keeping him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_blue Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 I think it's clear that Dickov and Taggart had no interest in developing the kids... Since LJ has come in he has invested in them and give them a chance. Dickov would not have visited Mellor and his Mrs at home to help him with his diet and eating habits and the resuly is a 6K weight reduction. Not in a million years would we have seen Mellor and Millar playing this season if Dickov was here and he wouldn't have renewed contracts. I do know as fact that Dickov would often not even acknowledge the younger fringe players when even walking passed them in the corridor so this alone shows he wasn't fussed. Keep all the young fringe players mentioned for me Their not on loads of money and let's see what a good pre season and good man management with confidence in them as individuals can do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Wouldn't get into any other League 1 side so he shouldn't get into ours, same goes for Tarkowski and Millar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Ritchie Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Great footballer. Needs to sharpen up his football brainand play with his head up as much as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie_J Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 He's got ability. But I reckon my five-year-old would beat him in an arm wrestle and he makes too many mistakes. I expected a lot more from him; I know he's had very limited opportunities but the fact he's so lightweight concerns me. I'd be very surprised if TP and co. haven't been trying to bulk him up for the past few years. Perhaps he's just one of those lads who's always going to be as skinny as a rake and that's going to seriously hold him back, especially playing centre midfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moorcider Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 We should have loaned him out earlier this season for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slystallone Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Moorcoder has it for me. All the youngsters needed a loan this season. I know Mellor & Millar went to Chorley for a month, but it was such a lowly standard in relation to our league standing that i dont think they should have bothered. Winchester needed a stint in the Blue Square Prem, just like Marc Tierney and Chris Taylor had a Barrow. It would have been the making of him. I think Mellor and Millar could have realistically gone to either BSP or L2 for their loan stint - but instead they went to Chorley. Clearly PD had no interest in the younger player & there development. LJ is different. I fully expect Gossett, Cooper & Simpson to be out on loan next season; maybe Sutherland too (but i think he'll be kept around and feature). LJ clearly backs youth and wants to work with them, to develop them and better them. I think Millar, Mellor, Tarkowski & Belezika will all be offered deals - I wager LJ wants to work with them next season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudemedic Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Keep him but if he is not playing for us he should be loaned out, he isn't going to develop much more sitting on our bench, but not getting on, or in our reserves. The same for Mellor and Millar, they've progressed from this time last year a lot more than Winchester and I don't think it's coincidence that they went on loan and Winchester didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancy lad Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Don't know enough about him if I am totally honest (probably like 90% of us). Give him a chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Winchester needed a stint in the Blue Square Prem, just like Marc Tierney and Chris Taylor had a Barrow. It would have been the making of him. Would it though? He'd still have been up against big hard bastards twice his weight, but without anyone worth passing to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pk200 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Keep him for another year...he will come through.... imho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_mighty_bosh Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) As I've said in the "who to keep" thread, Winchester is the type of player we should keep as back up for a year and try to develop him into a first team player rather than pay over the odds for a player from another club just to be back up. There was the same debate about Mellor before the Carlisle game iirc. All the current batch of youngsters could go either way, let's give them a chance! It's a low risk gamble. Edited April 18, 2013 by the_mighty_bosh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oafc1895 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Winchester would be the complete player if he had a bit of muscle behind him. He could sit in the middle of the park and ping balls all over the show. I'm not going to jump on the 'lets all blame PD' bandwagon but if Winch, Mellor and Millar had been given a proper chance all three would be double the players that they are now and there wouldn't be any threads like this as they would be dead certs for starting spots in the side. As for keeping him I would, but, send him out on loan straight away for a couple of months to L2/ top BSP team so he can have regular 1st team football and then he has a even better chance of barging his way into our 1st team. But the only thing is who do you then play in CM as most on here want to get rid of Wesolowski then that a question for another thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GravityGrave Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Keep defo . Wants and is good with the ball which has been evident since his arrival around the first team . Motm for me against Liverpool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) It's a bit of a myth non league is full of big cloggers, I remember the Yeovil team that came up from the Conference a few years ago as being an excellent footballing outfit with many players possessing the quality to go on and play for Championship clubs, I would go as to far as to say there's more direct and physical football in Division One. Having said that, the demise of a competitive reserve league in the last couple of seasons has meant those progressing from the youth team have so few games to play they become stale and the step up to league football becomes more difficult. Edited April 18, 2013 by BP1960 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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