LaticsPete Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 There is no cut off line and I didn't suggest there was. it is a measure of the current plight of the club that Burton Albion reserve players can come in on loan and become our best players. Burton are an incredibly well run club, we are not, that is the point I'm trying to make. Stop sniping at anyone who doesn't agree with you and think the sun shines out of Corney's arse. Ignoring the personal stuff ....what I don't get is the view that the status and position of clubs are immutable. When we were in the top flight -or even before- there would have been fans of other clubs expressing outrage at how Oldham were performing more successfully than their own "bigger" club Presently Burton are doing very well and that's great . They've got good players in some positions and we can benefit from that. Just not worth getting sniffy about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scapegoat Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 I do find the views that clubs like Burton and Brentford, as two examples, are a damning statement to back up the fact that we have been run into the ground a little odd. In the last 18 years we have remained stable in League One with arguably slightly more flirts with the play-offs, than relegation battles. This season looks like a tough one don't get me wrong, but less than a year ago we were considering ourselves play-off contenders. We have not particularly got better or worse, other teams have moved past us. Some upwards, some downwards. I am sure Pompey, Luton, Tranmere, Stockport, Notts County, Macclesfield, Lincoln, Torquay, Oxford United - mostly teams that I have played at the same level or higher levels than us over the years probably feel that they have been run into the ground. When we got promoted to the First Division and then Premier League I am sure supporters of Cardiff, Hull Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Burnley, Fulham, Reading, Swansea, West Brom, Stoke, Sunderland, Birmingham, Watford, Wolves, Leicester, Newcastle, West Ham, Palace, Middlesborough and Forest were thinking similar feelings when looking at the League Tables and seeing 'little Oldham' above them. Football in its league format is the ultimate meritocracy. Its what makes the game so engaging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluear Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 I do find the views that clubs like Burton and Brentford, as two examples, are a damning statement to back up the fact that we have been run into the ground a little odd. In the last 18 years we have remained stable in League One with arguably slightly more flirts with the play-offs, than relegation battles. This season looks like a tough one don't get me wrong, but less than a year ago we were considering ourselves play-off contenders. We have not particularly got better or worse, other teams have moved past us. Some upwards, some downwards. I am sure Pompey, Luton, Tranmere, Stockport, Notts County, Macclesfield, Lincoln, Torquay, Oxford United - mostly teams that I have played at the same level or higher levels than us over the years probably feel that they have been run into the ground. When we got promoted to the First Division and then Premier League I am sure supporters of Cardiff, Hull Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Burnley, Fulham, Reading, Swansea, West Brom, Stoke, Sunderland, Birmingham, Watford, Wolves, Leicester, Newcastle, West Ham, Palace, Middlesborough and Forest were thinking similar feelings when looking at the League Tables and seeing 'little Oldham' above them. Football in its league format is the ultimate meritocracy. Its what makes the game so engaging. This is a great point. But the people it is aimed at have made their mind up and cannot see both sides of the argument. They're not open to looking at different perspectives Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 This is a great point. But the people it is aimed at have made their mind up and cannot see both sides of the argument. They're not open to looking at different perspectives Err Pot, Kettle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hometownclub Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Ignoring the personal stuff ....what I don't get is the view that the status and position of clubs are immutable. When we were in the top flight -or even before- there would have been fans of other clubs expressing outrage at how Oldham were performing more successfully than their own "bigger" club Presently Burton are doing very well and that's great . They've got good players in some positions and we can benefit from that. Just not worth getting sniffy about I really have nothing against Burton, I think what they have done is brilliant. They are an example to the likes of Latics in how a club should be run, its just very sad to see the position we are in and what the club has been run down too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfatjoe1 Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 He's a good little player, which really does underline what a :censored: squad we've got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Err Pot, Kettle Prepare to be called a :censored:. We're by no means a sleeping giant like others below us, and that's what makes us more conscious of smaller clubs overtaking us. These bigger clubs will rise again - the likes of Portsmouth, Luton, to an extent, Plymouth, Oxford etc. We may not. The ever-growing forces of City and United circle - you can already see the club losing out of fans more and more to them - and the club may never reach the size it once was. It's far easier to slide down the pole than it is to climb back up. I've nothing against Burton, but it really does hurt to see how they're performing, especially when you know you may never reach the heights they are again, or at least for a long, long time to come. Not to mention the game is ceasing to be a meritocracy, apart from the odd example across the leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scapegoat Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 It's far easier to slide down the pole than it is to climb back up. I've nothing against Burton, but it really does hurt to see how they're performing, especially when you know you may never reach the heights they are again, or at least for a long, long time to come. Not to mention the game is ceasing to be a meritocracy, apart from the odd example across the leagues. It is still a meritocracy in that the best teams of footballers tend to be the ones that are successful. It doesn't hurt to see Burton doing well - for me it gives the hope and belief that if a team at this level gets a decent manager and group of players you can still achieve. 15 months ago, we felt like we were on the cusp of something - good manager, reasonable squad performing well, and optimism off the pitch in the new stand. The factors that have changed that mood over the last 12 months are many and well discussed....but for whatever reason the opportunity slipped by. If they can do it, so can we with the right circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Does it make anyone feel better to reflect that Burton have had the same ownership since Diego was a deck hand at the Battle of Trafalgar and they achieved non league stays with a few cup runs and getting on the telly a bit because their manager's dad was famous through most of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted February 6, 2016 Share Posted February 6, 2016 Prepare to be called a :censored:. We're by no means a sleeping giant like others below us, and that's what makes us more conscious of smaller clubs overtaking us. These bigger clubs will rise again - the likes of Portsmouth, Luton, to an extent, Plymouth, Oxford etc. We may not. The ever-growing forces of City and United circle - you can already see the club losing out of fans more and more to them - and the club may never reach the size it once was. It's far easier to slide down the pole than it is to climb back up. I've nothing against Burton, but it really does hurt to see how they're performing, especially when you know you may never reach the heights they are again, or at least for a long, long time to come. Not to mention the game is ceasing to be a meritocracy, apart from the odd example across the leagues. Yet here we are with Leicester City top of the premiership in February 3 points clear of Man City 10 points clear of Man U and miles clear of Chelsea. In the championship Burnley and Middlesbrough to towns who's population combined is the size of Oldham lead the way. Burton Walsall and Gillingham are challenging for promotion at the top of league 1. It's about making the right decisions at the right time hiring the right people players coaches managers if you do that you can climb the leagues and punch above your perceived weight. Budgets and resources will always help getting the most out of them is more important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted February 6, 2016 Share Posted February 6, 2016 Yet here we are with Leicester City top of the premiership in February 3 points clear of Man City 10 points clear of Man U and miles clear of Chelsea. In the championship Burnley and Middlesbrough to towns who's population combined is the size of Oldham lead the way. Burton Walsall and Gillingham are challenging for promotion at the top of league 1. It's about making the right decisions at the right time hiring the right people players coaches managers if you do that you can climb the leagues and punch above your perceived weight. Budgets and resources will always help getting the most out of them is more important. Leicester are an exceptional example. The first of their kind in at least 20 years. Burton, Walsall and Gillingham haven't won anything yet. Just watch Wigan overtake them. Burnley and Boro. So what? They're big clubs with loads of money. If we got 15,000-20,000 fans a week we'd probably be up in the Championship. What does it matter how big their towns are? I'm well-aware teams over perform but it has become less frequent. Take last season. The teams which were promoted: Bournemouth (Russian-owned rich), Norwich, Watford (rich Italian owners). Bristol City (money bags), Preston, MK. Bury, Shrewsbury, Burton, Southend. I'd say two from that ten aren't above-average wealth in their division or aren't bankrolled. The chances of being those two from the 72 clubs is obviously small, even moreso when you've got no momentum to start with and no stability in ownership, which we will soon lose when Corney sells. It's doom and gloom, but ultimately that's how I see it. If we miraculously get some billionaires it will all change. If not, we're slugging it out with the other have-nots for that unlikely collusion of factors which take us beyond lower mid-table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 In a hypothetical world where we were willing to pay money for players, what bid would you put in for Palmer? It'd be the ultimate speculate to accumulate deal. Burton might see him surplus if they're promoted and be willing to accept something for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 (edited) If in a months time and he proves to be a success I will happily come on here and say I was wrong I've been wrong about players and managers before and I've also been right. Someone out their must want to play for us it can't be that bad. Only stupid people never change their minds. This lad has been far better than I and many others expected I hope we can keep him for the rest of the season. Edited February 20, 2016 by GlossopLatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Leicester are an exceptional example. The first of their kind in at least 20 years. Burton, Walsall and Gillingham haven't won anything yet. Just watch Wigan overtake them. Burnley and Boro. So what? They're big clubs with loads of money. If we got 15,000-20,000 fans a week we'd probably be up in the Championship. What does it matter how big their towns are? I'm well-aware teams over perform but it has become less frequent. Take last season. The teams which were promoted: Bournemouth (Russian-owned rich), Norwich, Watford (rich Italian owners). Bristol City (money bags), Preston, MK. Bury, Shrewsbury, Burton, Southend. I'd say two from that ten aren't above-average wealth in their division or aren't bankrolled. The chances of being those two from the 72 clubs is obviously small, even moreso when you've got no momentum to start with and no stability in ownership, which we will soon lose when Corney sells. It's doom and gloom, but ultimately that's how I see it. If we miraculously get some billionaires it will all change. If not, we're slugging it out with the other have-nots for that unlikely collusion of factors which take us beyond lower mid-table. And now watch out for Bristol Rovers after being taken over by rich Jordanian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
we hate man,u and city to Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 In a hypothetical world where we were willing to pay money for players, what bid would you put in for Palmer? It'd be the ultimate speculate to accumulate deal. Burton might see him surplus if they're promoted and be willing to accept something for him. Out of contract end of the season. Hopefully they go up and we can try tempt him here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyres_28 Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Out of contract but they'd be due a fee. He is absolutely superb and all the credit goes to Shez for a quite unreal find and loan coup. I think most fans who've watched him for the last 5 games would contribute to a player share attempt at signing him!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_blue Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Out of contract but they'd be due a fee. He is absolutely superb and all the credit goes to Shez for a quite unreal find and loan coup. I think most fans who've watched him for the last 5 games would contribute to a player share attempt at signing him!!!! They would only be due a small fee based on his development there if his contact is up won't then? They won't be able to demand a big fee if they haven't offered a contract! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scapegoat Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Isn't the tactic though to offer a contract, but one that they he won't accept therefore increasing the compensation claim? Am sure I've heard other clubs do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorvik_latic Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Isn't the tactic though to offer a contract, but one that they he won't accept therefore increasing the compensation claim? Am sure I've heard other clubs do that. It has to be higher or equal to his current wage I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Out of contract but they'd be due a fee. He is absolutely superb and all the credit goes to Shez for a quite unreal find and loan coup. I think most fans who've watched him for the last 5 games would contribute to a player share attempt at signing him!!!! In that case, this is just what PlayerShare was made for. Reckon you'd be able to raise a good few quid if it was promised to be used on Palmer.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 In that case, this is just what PlayerShare was made for. Reckon you'd be able to raise a good few quid if it was promised to be used on Palmer.. Tough promise to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 From the Burton Cloughthemagicdragon Forum: Feb 13, 2016 17:54:26 GMT tollerton said: Yes, took a look at Oldham's forum, they weren't enthusiastic about Matt's loan in the beginning comments along the lines of 'how can a reserve from Little Burton Albion improve our team, have we sunk that low' However, now it's a different story, he's a great player, head & shoulders above the rest of the team, man of the match etcetera. No wonder they now want to keep him! Also recognition that Brewers are a stable and an exceptionally well run club !!!Loanee 'reserve' player of ours going to a 'bigger' club and standing out on the pitch, making a difference don't it make your heart swell with pride?Well done Matthew Palmer but please come home soon, don't stay away too long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diego_Sideburns Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Palmer's loan runs until his 21st birthday, which is on Saturday, when he will be ineligible for a youth loan. At that stage, a new emergency loan deal would need to be agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Palmer's loan runs until his 21st birthday, which is on Saturday, when he will be ineligible for a youth loan. At that stage, a new emergency loan deal would need to be agreed. Take that up to, but not including, Burton. Then renew after that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disjointed Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Would love to see him here till the end of the season, certainly helps Kelly as he doesn't have to do it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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