World Cup Thread

[boboafc]

Two

planes landed in England today, one carrying a group of overpaid under

achieving prima donnas and the other carrying seven coffins draped in

the union flag. Hero is a much over used word these days but I know

where my priorities lie. R.I.P BRAVE SOLDIERS.

[Ackey]

Two planes landed in England today, one carrying a group of overpaid under

achieving prima donnas and the other carrying seven coffins draped in

the union flag. Hero is a much over used word these days but I know

where my priorities lie. R.I.P BRAVE SOLDIERS.

I'm fearful this will make me incredibly unpopular. But why exactly should a child hero-worship a soldier?

 

I appreciate all they do and the nobility they show. But I'd rather my child one day dream of playing international football than killing other people - which is fundamentally what a soldier does (no matter the reason for this killing).

 

 

[Stevie_J]

Two

planes landed in England today, one carrying a group of overpaid under

achieving prima donnas and the other carrying seven coffins draped in

the union flag. Hero is a much over used word these days but I know

where my priorities lie. R.I.P BRAVE SOLDIERS.

I'm surprised the CTRL, C and V buttons still work on your computer keyboard, Bob.

[jorvik_latic]

I'm surprised the CTRL, C and V buttons still work on your computer keyboard, Bob.

They do. It's just that he's been through 20 mice wondering why the right button keeps breaking...

[wardlelatic]

I'm fearful this will make me incredibly unpopular. But why exactly should a child hero-worship a soldier?

 

I appreciate all they do and the nobility they show. But I'd rather my child one day dream of playing international football than killing other people - which is fundamentally what a soldier does (no matter the reason for this killing).

 

Its is the sentiment young padawan....

 

To worship a man/woman of great courage, nobility or one admired for their exploits.

 

The 23 returning today wanted to be worshiped and be seen as Heros.

 

The Seven that returned today only wanted to return.

 

We should always treat people as heros who are willing to make sacrifices for everyone else and not those who want something in return

[Ackey]

Its is the sentiment young padawan....

 

To worship a man/woman of great courage, nobility or one admired for their exploits.

 

The 23 returning today wanted to be worshiped and be seen as Heros.

 

The Seven that returned today only wanted to return.

 

We should always treat people as heros who are willing to make sacrifices for everyone else and not those who want something in return

Not sure that works Ric.

 

You can't speak of the courage or nobility of the soldiers, can you? They may have joined for selfish reasons, they may have acted in a cowardly way whilst at war, they may have committed a host of other acts - we can't speak of them as they're not televised. I don't know. I'm not suggesting they have. But you don't know either.

 

I appreciate there's a big difference in terms of the peril involved, I'd not dispute that.

 

Equally, you don't know much about England players. I know what I saw on the pitch from Frank Lampard. I also know that he does a host of noble things to benefit the youth players at Chelsea and the community around him as a whole.

 

Comparable to putting your life at risk? No, but then those at war don't have to do that either if they don't sign up. There's no draft anymore don't forget.

 

I appreciate that this perspective may not be popular, far from it even, but I'll not shirk away from it.

 

 

 

[wardlelatic]

Not sure that works Ric.

 

You can't speak of the courage or nobility of the soldiers, can you? They may have joined for selfish reasons, they may have acted in a cowardly way whilst at war, they may have committed a host of other acts - we can't speak of them as they're not televised. I don't know. I'm not suggesting they have. But you don't know either.

 

I appreciate there's a big difference in terms of the peril involved, I'd not dispute that.

 

Equally, you don't know much about England players. I know what I saw on the pitch from Frank Lampard. I also know that he does a host of noble things to benefit the youth players at Chelsea and the community around him as a whole.

 

Comparable to putting your life at risk? No, but then those at war don't have to do that either if they don't sign up. There's no draft anymore don't forget.

 

I appreciate that this perspective may not be popular, far from it even, but I'll not shirk away from it.

 

 

Tired and Bored is the latest excuse coming from the FA

 

The German players that hammered us have on average played more games and more mins on the pitch than our players.

 

Bored ?? Living in luxury and playing on your Ipad or lap top when sent to your room to shop on line and buy ANYTHING you want ??

 

Try living away from home for a tour (usually 6 months) living out of a kit bag... sleeping for 20 mins at a time... or

 

Living in a bedsit with 3 kids in the summer holidays as you dont have enough money to take them all somewhere ( EVERYDAY as I know parks are free etc) surely thats being bored?

 

I have watched the England team abroad and around the UK spending money sometimes I shouldnt... When they come out with excuses like that I just cringe.

 

Every single player who went to SA will collect a WC bonus of £100,000 min each player a solider risks all for less the 60% of that.

 

 

Some I know in the forces joined because they didnt want to be unemployed or because they wanted to learn a trade.

 

Football 99% just want to be rich !

 

In high schools now, its been documented most 14 yr old girls would rather be a page 3 model than a doctor/teacher/ etc as it gets them a football husband and money...

 

 

Not many footballers do a lot for the community without a camera on them or while they are not 'branded up'

[Ackey]

Tired and Bored is the latest excuse coming from the FA

 

The German players that hammered us have on average played more games and more mins on the pitch than our players.

 

Bored ?? Living in luxury and playing on your Ipad or lap top when sent to your room to shop on line and buy ANYTHING you want ??

 

Try living away from home for a tour (usually 6 months) living out of a kit bag... sleeping for 20 mins at a time... or

 

Living in a bedsit with 3 kids in the summer holidays as you dont have enough money to take them all somewhere ( EVERYDAY as I know parks are free etc) surely thats being bored?

 

I have watched the England team abroad and around the UK spending money sometimes I shouldnt... When they come out with excuses like that I just cringe.

 

Every single player who went to SA will collect a WC bonus of £100,000 min each player a solider risks all for less the 60% of that.

 

 

Some I know in the forces joined because they didnt want to be unemployed or because they wanted to learn a trade.

 

Football 99% just want to be rich !

 

In high schools now, its been documented most 14 yr old girls would rather be a page 3 model than a doctor/teacher/ etc as it gets them a football husband and money...

 

 

Not many footballers do a lot for the community without a camera on them or while they are not 'branded up'

They're not comparable though, that's the point.

 

If you are a 'better' soldier you get paid more. If you're a 'better' footballer you get paid more. That has zero to do with the hero-worship which was the point.

 

 

[Ackey]

Oh, sorry, and you can't blame page three models for the fact that young children want to be them any more than you can blame players because kids want to be them.

 

Little boys have wanted to be footballers for 50 years or more.

[opinions4u]

Little boys have wanted to be footballers for 50 years or more.

I'm 42 and still have the dream!

 

page three models

Same applies, different dream though.

 

 

Edited June 29, 2010 by opinions4u

[wardlelatic]

They're not comparable though, that's the point.

 

If you are a 'better' soldier you get paid more. If you're a 'better' footballer you get paid more. That has zero to do with the hero-worship which was the point.

 

 

there is no point, only sentiment.

 

A good soldier doesnt always get paid more, infact what is a good solider someone who played Rugger at Eton and attended Sandhurst?

 

I know a few who went into the forces at 18 and only moved slightly up the ranks. I also know a few lads who turned pro but fell into semi pro leagues...

 

A footballer wants and plays to be worshiped and called a hero.. A solider does the job he/she is paid to do and one many others wouldnt want too.

 

War right or wrong is a bi-product of civilisation, soliders are doing their job just like footballers, one protects us all and is willing to die to protect the other entertains us.

[Ackey]

there is no point, only sentiment.

 

A good soldier doesnt always get paid more, infact what is a good solider someone who played Rugger at Eton and attended Sandhurst?

 

I know a few who went into the forces at 18 and only moved slightly up the ranks. I also know a few lads who turned pro but fell into semi pro leagues...

 

A footballer wants and plays to be worshiped and called a hero.. A solider does the job he/she is paid to do and one many others wouldnt want too.

 

War right or wrong is a bi-product of civilisation, soliders are doing their job just like footballers, one protects us all and is willing to die to protect the other entertains us.

This bit in bold is complete horse crap mate. And you know I love you.

 

I know, stress know, someone who went and joined the army because they wanted to shoot people. Not protect and serve but to shoot people. Sure he was tapped in the head, but he got in. He's - as far as I know - still in the army and probably still shooting Iraqis or Afghanis in the head as regularly as possible.

 

On the other hand I know, stress know, footballers who do it because they love to play the game. They don't care what people think of them, that's a bi-product - not a particularly welcome one either.

 

On the other, other hand (yes, I have three hands) I know, stress know, a footballer who hates football. Doesn't watch it, doesn't check scores or care to any degree how any team other than his does. He does it because it's the only thing he's good at, ever been good at, and he wants to do his best.

 

The point of all three of those examples though is that they're just that - examples.

 

You can't choose who people hero-worship and you sure as hell can't blame/bemoan the players themselves for it. And I don't see why a child should not wish to be a footballer over wanting to be a soldier. A very select few in this world get to truly live their dream and if that dream is to play football I say go for it.

 

 

[Stevie_J]

This bit in bold is complete horse crap mate. And you know I love you.

 

I know, stress know, someone who went and joined the army because they wanted to shoot people. Not protect and serve but to shoot people. Sure he was tapped in the head, but he got in. He's - as far as I know - still in the army and probably still shooting Iraqis or Afghanis in the head as regularly as possible.

 

On the other hand I know, stress know, footballers who do it because they love to play the game. They don't care what people think of them, that's a bi-product - not a particularly welcome one either.

 

On the other, other hand (yes, I have three hands) I know, stress know, a footballer who hates football. Doesn't watch it, doesn't check scores or care to any degree how any team other than his does. He does it because it's the only thing he's good at, ever been good at, and he wants to do his best.

 

The point of all three of those examples though is that they're just that - examples.

 

You can't choose who people hero-worship and you sure as hell can't blame/bemoan the players themselves for it. And I don't see why a child should not wish to be a footballer over wanting to be a soldier. A very select few in this world get to truly live their dream and if that dream is to play football I say go for it.

I think it's pretty crass to juxtapose the return of the England team and dead soldiers, in order to ridicule the team's "efforts". What are we saying, that they should sign up in embarrassment? There's not one of those players who wouldn't have cringed if they'd been given a heroes' welcome home.

 

Hell, I bet a few of those soldiers would have given anything to be an England footballer instead.

 

And Acks, would I be right in thinking two players you thought of, whilst constructing the above post, were Purdie and Lee, in no particular order, of course?

[Stevie_J]

Oh, and Spain v Portugal. That sending off - WTF?!

[Ackey]

I think it's pretty crass to juxtapose the return of the England team and dead soldiers, in order to ridicule the team's "efforts". What are we saying, that they should sign up in embarrassment? There's not one of those players who wouldn't have cringed if they'd been given a heroes' welcome home.

 

Hell, I bet a few of those soldiers would have given anything to be an England footballer instead.

 

And Acks, would I be right in thinking two players you thought of, whilst constructing the above post, were Purdie and Lee, in no particular order, of course?

I agree with the first paragraph. I like how you can see the point I'm making without resorting to the "you're against the soldiers" as some may have.

 

As for the players, I'd rather not say as I don't think that's fair on them. But, as is to be expected, they're both Latics players.

[rudemedic]

How many of the soldiers signed up because they had very little skills, very few qualifications and very little career prospects? Or those who signed up because it was the done thing, their father before them, his father before him etc? What about those you signed up because the Armed forces will pay your way through uni- I know loads of medics who've done that? Not to mention the ones who signed up before 9/11. I would think quite a number of the England football team would have probably joined the army if they hadn't been able to make a living out of playing football? It is probably the number 1 career option for young men without a great deal of qualifactions and no life skills.

 

Yes the young men and women fighting in the various bits of the world, have a life, but most of the squaddies get paid better than almost every other profession (not related to sport) with similar qualifactions. Yes they are heros but I know quite a few heros who haven't served in the armed forces.

 

Plus whilst this is controversial, if one of those squaddies got himself killed (and possibly others too) by being stupid, something the general public are highly unlikely to know, are they still a hero?

 

To get back on to topic, I see a Mirror Journalist has gotten himself arrested in connection with the bloke who went into the England dressing room over accusations that it was a set up.

 

set-up

[rudemedic]

Oh, and Spain v Portugal. That sending off - WTF?!

 

Yet again we have more evidence for the case for video replays, the radio commentators seemed to think there was contact but he rolled around disproportionally, and having seen it I would agree.

[leeslover]

There isn't a bloke reading this that wouldn't have been a pro footballer given the choice, skills, qualifications or whatever, and I guess the average serviceman would on average be more likely to have fancied football as a career than the man in the street. People sign up for all sorts of reasons, I have met people who did it because they wanted to be an officer in Daddy's Regiment, people who had no idea what else to do, people who wanted to fight and kill people, people who saw it as a good career choice to learn a skill and leave with a good pension, people who thought it looked like a laugh. I think the use of the word, "hero," is where we are coming unstuck. It used to be a word for the soldier who did something way out of the ordinary, sometimes used to describe all of the dead after the event (WW1 mostly I suppose). I don't think you become a hero by dying in the Forces, but I do think it is a very sad thing indeed, and as some of our members could testify some of the people who have died over there were extraordinary people.

[24hoursfromtulsehill]

I think it's pretty crass to juxtapose the return of the England team and dead soldiers, in order to ridicule the team's "efforts". What are we saying, that they should sign up in embarrassment? There's not one of those players who wouldn't have cringed if they'd been given a heroes' welcome home.

 

+1

 

I'm pretty sure the players tried their best. They just happened to get their trousers pulled down because of a scandalous decision, precision counter-attacking and tactical naivety (in no special order). They're not bad people because they lost or because other people (journos) rated them too highly and hyped them up.

 

 

[oafcprozac]

Tired and Bored is the latest excuse coming from the FA

 

The German players that hammered us have on average played more games and more mins on the pitch than our players.

 

Bored ?? Living in luxury and playing on your Ipad or lap top when sent to your room to shop on line and buy ANYTHING you want ??

 

Try living away from home for a tour (usually 6 months) living out of a kit bag... sleeping for 20 mins at a time... or

 

Living in a bedsit with 3 kids in the summer holidays as you dont have enough money to take them all somewhere ( EVERYDAY as I know parks are free etc) surely thats being bored?

 

I have watched the England team abroad and around the UK spending money sometimes I shouldnt... When they come out with excuses like that I just cringe.

 

Every single player who went to SA will collect a WC bonus of £100,000 min each player a solider risks all for less the 60% of that.

 

 

Some I know in the forces joined because they didnt want to be unemployed or because they wanted to learn a trade.

 

Football 99% just want to be rich !

 

In high schools now, its been documented most 14 yr old girls would rather be a page 3 model than a doctor/teacher/ etc as it gets them a football husband and money...

 

 

Not many footballers do a lot for the community without a camera on them or while they are not 'branded up'

 

Not only that Rick young girls just aspire to be thin and pretty so they will be popular and liked. (Which they've always done, but it's overload - I only have to look at my 7 year old) Our obsessiveness with no-mark celebrities is ruining the aspirations of a generation.

 

What really feaks me out is the silly little sods that stand in front of Cowell aged 10/11/12 etc... "This is my chance to make something of my life, this is the thing i've always wanted.." FFS you're 11, have dreams yes but concentrate on being a kid not chasing instant fame. Parents and celebrities want shooting! I blame Blair and Cool Britannia, hopefully now the Tories are back in Cowell will be tried for treason in killing the hopes and dreams of a generation. Oh and next up would be Murdoch and his Sky cronies. As a teacher it is so sad to see these kids trying to copy these no marks.

 

The brighter kids are a little more grounded and want to go down the academic route, but in a society that allows kids to take BTEC Health and Beauty/Hairdressing at the expense of learning life-long skills from academic subjects such as debate, being able to support your own conclusions and being able to read and write properly. I always say, when you're older when you're having a conversation and someone asks you what you think about something, you offer your opinion then someone asks why you think that, do you simply answer, "Cos I do!" or do you explain your reasons for that opinion? Hairdressing won't teach you that. (Nowt against hairdressing except I have no hair)

 

As for the England squad - Those that played in the 4 games with the exception of Milner should never wear the shirt again. Look at what the Germans have done - young hungry players are the way forward.

 

 

 

 

[leeslover]

WC surveillance - a friend of a friend saw Davros coming out of the Al Jazera studio yesterday. And called him a :censored:.

[martjs]

As for the England squad - Those that played in the 4 games with the exception of Milner should never wear the shirt again. Look at what the Germans have done - young hungry players are the way forward.

 

Agree with most of what you wrote but then I had a flash back / deja vu moment - isn't the above highlighted phrase what a certain Mr. Penney said about a year ago?!?

[boboafc]

Uruguay 0 Ghana 1 great game so far ghana had some good chances tonight , big suprise for me as i want Uruguay to win the cup too

[Ackey]

1-1

 

Cracking little game.

[Lookers_Carl]

I have a netherlands uruguay double, so just need uruguay to get 1 more before end of normal time